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TSLA Investor Discussions
- Thread starter Fr23shjive
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We'll have to agree to disagree: cap-and-trade is a highly economically efficient way of achieving a goal. The logical goal is not to force each car company to achieve a particular target, but rather to collectively achieve a target.
As mentioned above emeralds are not durable; they should be worn for special occasions only. But I agree with your general view; my wife's engagement ring has a canary diamond because she loves yellow, but rubies or sapphires are good choices, too. As my daughter the geologist says, "Diamonds are geologically uninteresting. They're also unstable at standard pressure: diamonds are NOT forever! Give them a few hundred million years and they'll be gone."
Citizen-T
Active Member
I think that used to be the case but starting this year or next year the credits don't expire. I'll have to find a reference though.
The myth of exceptionality. There are plenty of places where people can be individuals, and some sub-cultures in America where they cannot.
Whether the current law puts a time limit on them or not, they're only good while the law makes them good. Change the law, change the game.
erha
Member
" Those issued from 2012 onward don’t expire, encouraging carmakers to try to sell more clean models than required" (Green-Car Credits: Automakers' New Way to Cash In - Businessweek)
Same article says they sell for between 5'000$ and 10'000$, and one model s generates 7 credits. That's 35-70 thousand USD extra for every single model s built. Could be that the lower range model s don't get 7 credits though. All in all there are 12 states that incorporate this law (including California, New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts).
This could be huge for Tesla! Tomorrow the market opens again and we are one step closer to the 22. Can't wait! Crossing my fingers for good news from the European countries that can't manage their finances.
Thumper
Active Member
I must be misunderstanding something or the credit value is not that high. $70K credit on a $70K car would be a 100% profit if they were selling them at cost. We know they are only claiming 25% margin sooooo...
same here, this seems too good to be true and if it is true TM could be profitable selling much less then they have publicly stated. Its good to be green!
+1. If that's is true then a majority of Tesla's income is going to be coming from selling credits.
KBF
Model X owner (formerly Cdn Signature Model S)
It must have been a typo from the original article; I could see $5-$10k per Model S. But if it is true then we will all be raking in dividends shortly...
erha
Member
As more automakers sell their own ZEV cars, the market for credits will collapse. The article says that Honda bought credits from Tesla because they couldn't sell enough fuel-cell cars. (Not surprising!) But now that they're going to start selling EVs, they won't be buying any more credits. Other auto makers will follow suit. That's probably why Tesla does not expect to sell (many) credits earned by the Model S. Once the demand has been filled, or disappears as other car makers no longer need to buy them, the income stream for Tesla from credits dries up.
The requirements to sell ZEVs increases with time, but the market for credits will depend on whether or not other car makers increase their sales accordingly. And how long it takes for GM to sue CARB again and get the requirement overturned.
So, yes, Tesla getting $35,000 for every Model S sold is indeed, "too good to be true." They got a nice little windfall from the Roadster's credits, but it won't continue. Certainly not at the rate of $35K per S.
The requirements to sell ZEVs increases with time, but the market for credits will depend on whether or not other car makers increase their sales accordingly. And how long it takes for GM to sue CARB again and get the requirement overturned.
So, yes, Tesla getting $35,000 for every Model S sold is indeed, "too good to be true." They got a nice little windfall from the Roadster's credits, but it won't continue. Certainly not at the rate of $35K per S.
Thumper
Active Member
Closed down .96 today at 29.12. What does TM have to do to get some love? Only good things have happened recently and have even had some analyst say it is time to buy. I am surprised. Not that it matters to me. I won't sell until late 2013 at the earliest and probably not even then.
I will just leave it to my kids.
I will just leave it to my kids.
CyberDutchie
Active Member
Hopefully the money will flow in tomorrow, after today's positive Morgan Stanley research note "Tesla Motors Inc 1Q12: Elon Shows Making Cars ain't Rocket Science".
They moved their 12-18 months price target from $44 to $45, a whopping $1 increase! :wink:
They also raised their Model S unit forecast for the year to 3,000 from 2,000 units (20 in 2Q, 980 in 3Q and 2,000 in 4Q).
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
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