HPWC Warranty Question

[DarkNightP3D]

We have two Gen3 HPWCs in our garage at home. We have two EVs. One Tesla, one Kia EV6 GT. I recently noticed the charge rate was being dropped on the HPWC the Kia charges on (with an 80A rated Tesla-to-J1772 adapter). I contacted Tesla and let them know I was seeing the one flashing red light and charge rate was being reduced. They advised the connector was sending a high temp in the handle and throttling back the rate of charge. I was then told that because I have used a J1772 adapter even ONE TIME, the warranty is voided on the HPWC. This bothers me for a few reasons. 1. Tesla includes the same adapter with its vehicles, just reversed for Tesla cars to charge on J1772 AC chargers. The guy I spoke with had the attitude that Tesla cars using an adapter to charge at non-Tesla L2 chargers is fine, but using an adapter on a HPWC is some warranty voiding sin makes me mad.

2. There is no sign of physical damage to the charging wand, charger itself, or the vehicle.

3. I’ve never actually felt any high temperature on anything whether that is the car itself, wall connector face plate, wiring going into the HPWC, or the vehicle’s charge port.

4. He told me even if this overheating issue happens when charging our Tesla, warranty is still void on the HPWC.

Has anyone else been told even if the adapter didn’t cause any damage, simply using a HPWC with a non-Tesla vehicle voids the warranty? Has anyone else experienced this issue and found a solution besides replacing it?

 

[E90alex]

I agree that it’s ridiculous, but you shouldn’t have volunteered that information. Unless it’s a J1772 version of the wall connector, it’s not designed to be used with non-Teslas and such adapters are not sanctioned by Tesla (currently at least) or else they would have sold one themselves.

Does it still give an error when you use the WC in question to charge the Tesla instead of the Kia?

 

[DarkNightP3D]

I agree that it’s ridiculous, but you shouldn’t have volunteered that information. Unless it’s a J1772 version of the wall connector, it’s not designed to be used with non-Teslas and such adapters are not sanctioned by Tesla (currently at least) or else they would have sold one themselves.

Does it still give an error when you use the WC in question to charge the Tesla instead of the Kia?

I’ll have to try tomorrow when it is hot outside. They can tell by the logs if a Tesla or non-Tesla is charged on the WC. I’ve tried three different adapters and it’s done it all three times. It’s ridiculous to me they allow the WC to charge non-Teslas if this means your warranty is void. I would’ve purchased the J1772 WC if I had been able to use the $250 charger credit from our most recent Y purchase I had from Tesla, but of course it doesn’t apply to that specific version of the WC. L

 

[DarkNightP3D]

I agree that it’s ridiculous, but you shouldn’t have volunteered that information. Unless it’s a J1772 version of the wall connector, it’s not designed to be used with non-Teslas and such adapters are not sanctioned by Tesla (currently at least) or else they would have sold one themselves.

Does it still give an error when you use the WC in question to charge the Tesla instead of the Kia?

I plugged in the Kia when I got home and so far it has charged for the past 1.5 hours without an issue. I bought an IR thermometer and the highest temp I’m seeing is on the charging wand itself, right at the end, and it’s about 128°F. Ambient temps in the garage are around 93°F. It doesn’t feel any warmer than when plugged into the Tesla. Kia’s charge port pins are about 107°F, adapter pins are about 118°F. Nothing seems out of the ordinary as far as temps are concerned.

 

[RTPEV]

Setting aside the reasonableness of Tesla's attitude towards warranty work here for a moment, let's be honest here:

1. Tesla includes the same adapter with its vehicles, just reversed for Tesla cars to charge on J1772 AC chargers.

This is completely untrue. Something that is reversed is not the same thing, and more to the point: it's not a Tesla manufactured product, which is more likely Tesla's real concern.

The thing that we need to keep in mind is that there are so many cheap adapters and parts of questionable quality out there, that it is actually somewhat understandable that there would be concern if you plugged in some arbitrary adapter you bought off of Temu that even though it has words on it that say 80A probably doesn't actually live up to that standard. You can easily find pictures online of melted adapters that look identical to the true Tesla J1772 to NACS adapter. Remember these aren't low power things we're talking about here...we're talking about running an electric stove's or more worth of power through this adapter for hours at a time. This is not a place where you want to cheap out on construction and material quality.

And while you say you never felt any heat on the adapter, that may be true at the surface of the adapter, but what about right where the connectors meet (which is also where the temperature is sensed)? A casual examination of temperature of the outside of the connector is not going to reveal any issues within the connector itself while in use. Even your measurement of the temps of the pins is likely not indicative of the temperature while in use. Even a slightly loose fitting connector (that could have been caused by using an adapter with a pin size slightly out of spec) can cause a temperature issue (or worse).

The moral of the story is you want to be very cautious of using any third-party equipment, especially in these high power situations. If I foresee huge problems when people start using 3rd party CCS adapters at Superchargers.

 

[DarkNightP3D]

Setting aside the reasonableness of Tesla's attitude towards warranty work here for a moment, let's be honest here:



This is completely untrue. Something that is reversed is not the same thing, and more to the point: it's not a Tesla manufactured product, which is more likely Tesla's real concern.

The thing that we need to keep in mind is that there are so many cheap adapters and parts of questionable quality out there, that it is actually somewhat understandable that there would be concern if you plugged in some arbitrary adapter you bought off of Temu that even though it has words on it that say 80A probably doesn't actually live up to that standard. You can easily find pictures online of melted adapters that look identical to the true Tesla J1772 to NACS adapter. Remember these aren't low power things we're talking about here...we're talking about running an electric stove's or more worth of power through this adapter for hours at a time. This is not a place where you want to cheap out on construction and material quality.

And while you say you never felt any heat on the adapter, that may be true at the surface of the adapter, but what about right where the connectors meet (which is also where the temperature is sensed)? A casual examination of temperature of the outside of the connector is not going to reveal any issues within the connector itself while in use. Even your measurement of the temps of the pins is likely not indicative of the temperature while in use. Even a slightly loose fitting connector (that could have been caused by using an adapter with a pin size slightly out of spec) can cause a temperature issue (or worse).

The moral of the story is you want to be very cautious of using any third-party equipment, especially in these high power situations. If I foresee huge problems when people start using 3rd party CCS adapters at Superchargers.

There’s really no difference between using a third party adapter with a Tesla HPWC and using Tesla’s adapter on a third party J1772 charger. Does every destination charger have its warranty void as soon as it leaves the factory because someone may use an adapter on it? Tesla is playing two sides of the same coin here. They’re saying our adapter is fine to use on non-Tesla charging equipment, but your non-Tesla adapter is not okay to use on our charging equipment even though they are going to be fine with adapters starting next year at superchargers when Ford, GM, Mercedes, etc. start handing them out to customers.

I have used an IR thermometer to measure the temperature at the pins (literally aiming it at the pin and inside of the female end on the adapter) immediately after disconnecting the adapter, checked the temp inside the J1772 end of the adapter, the charger wand and the vehicle’s chargeport. The highest temperature anywhere was 128°F in the charging wand itself. Considering ambient temps were around 100°F in the garage, that’s not a very large difference after charging at 48A for a couple of hours. There are numerous people with this same issue dating back several years since the introduction of the V3 HPWC, too, which leads me to believe this is a faulty unit. Our other HPWC is a newer revision and it doesn’t have the same issue with the same adapters.

 

[Rocky_H]

There’s really no difference between using a third party adapter with a Tesla HPWC and using Tesla’s adapter on a third party J1772 charger.

Yes there is. One is using official OEM adapters that they built and know. The other is using some unknown product they can't guarantee or certify.

Does every destination charger have its warranty void as soon as it leaves the factory because someone may use an adapter on it?

This isn't about "may use". It's about "did use". It happened.

They’re saying our adapter

(built by Tesla)

is fine to use

but your non-Tesla adapter

(built by who knows what Joe Schmo under who knows what level of expertise or cost cutting shortcuts, etc.)

is not okay to use

There. See the difference?

even though they are going to be fine with adapters starting next year at superchargers when Ford, GM, Mercedes, etc. start handing them out to customers.

Those will also be OFFICIAL adapters built by the manufacturers!!

 

[DarkNightP3D]

Yes there is. One is using official OEM adapters that they built and know. The other is using some unknown product they can't guarantee or certify.

This isn't about "may use". It's about "did use". It happened.

(built by Tesla)


(built by who knows what Joe Schmo under who knows what level of expertise or cost cutting shortcuts, etc.)

There. See the difference?

Those will also be OFFICIAL adapters built by the manufacturers!!

Interesting how they allow you to unlock and use destination chargers in the Tesla app with these shoddy charging adapters. The adapter I have is made by Lectron, not some random person in a garage. Tesla owners have no problem using Lectron adapters at CCS or Chademo stations.

You seem to be one of the folks that will make any excuse for Tesla. We don’t know who is going to be making the adapters for other companies. I’m sure they’ll be bought off the shelf.

 

[Rocky_H]

Interesting how they allow you to unlock and use destination chargers in the Tesla app with these shoddy charging adapters.

Because there's no "unlock". They don't have it blocked. The Gen3 wall connectors can use a whitelist for specific VINs, but that doesn't work on a public charging point.

The adapter I have is made by Lectron, not some random person in a garage. Tesla owners have no problem using Lectron adapters at CCS or Chademo stations.

Lectron is just as random as the other half a dozen companies making and selling those, which the manufacturers don't have visibility or control of to see if they meet the required specifications.

You seem to be one of the folks that will make any excuse for Tesla.

That's a nonsensical accusation. This has nothing to do with Tesla. This is the case across most companies in most industries. They really don't like people using unknown unauthorized 3rd party accessories that they can't guarantee the quality of. Sure, many of them will work OK, but if they cause a problem, there won't be help or responsibility from the manufacturers. That's not a Tesla thing; it's just business.

We don’t know who is going to be making the adapters for other companies.

The manufacturers know. That's the point. They are using their contracted companies that they work with as suppliers.

I’m sure they’ll be bought off the shelf.

That's hilarious. They definitely won't.

Here's the article from Ford.

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2023/05/25/ford-ev-customers-to-gain-access-to-12-000-tesla-superchargers--.html

"A Tesla-developed adapter will provide Ford F-150 Lightning, Mustang Mach-E and E-Transit vehicles fitted with the Combined Charging System (CCS) port access to Tesla’s V3 Superchargers."

And here's the article from GM.

Site Maintenance

" In the future, GM will make adapters available for drivers of NACS-enabled vehicles to allow charging on CCS-capable fast charge stations."

Those are talking about the two opposite directions of adapters, but the point is the same, that as the OEMs decide and authorize support for the other charging standards, they are going to provide OEM authorized charging adapters for them.

 

[DarkNightP3D]

Because there's no "unlock". They don't have it blocked. The Gen3 wall connectors can use a whitelist for specific VINs, but that doesn't work on a public charging point.

Lectron is just as random as the other half a dozen companies making and selling those, which the manufacturers don't have visibility or control of to see if they meet the required specifications.

That's a nonsensical accusation. This has nothing to do with Tesla. This is the case across most companies in most industries. They really don't like people using unknown unauthorized 3rd party accessories that they can't guarantee the quality of. Sure, many of them will work OK, but if they cause a problem, there won't be help or responsibility from the manufacturers. That's not a Tesla thing; it's just business.


The manufacturers know. That's the point. They are using their contracted companies that they work with as suppliers.

That's hilarious. They definitely won't.

Here's the article from Ford.

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2023/05/25/ford-ev-customers-to-gain-access-to-12-000-tesla-superchargers--.html

"A Tesla-developed adapter will provide Ford F-150 Lightning, Mustang Mach-E and E-Transit vehicles fitted with the Combined Charging System (CCS) port access to Tesla’s V3 Superchargers."

And here's the article from GM.

Site Maintenance

" In the future, GM will make adapters available for drivers of NACS-enabled vehicles to allow charging on CCS-capable fast charge stations."

Those are talking about the two opposite directions of adapters, but the point is the same, that as the OEMs decide and authorize support for the other charging standards, they are going to provide OEM authorized charging adapters for them.

I am struggling with your reasoning that using a Tesla J1772 adapter on say, an EVGo, ChargePoint, SEMAconnect, EA, etc. charger is fine, but using anything non-Tesla with a Tesla made HPWC is unacceptable, even if it causes no damage. If third party NACS-to-J1772 adapters are so terrible, even name brand ones that are widely used with no problem, Tesla should sell their own.

There’s been reports of Gen 3 HPWCs overheating for years. Nearly all of them are similar to mine that the HPWC starts to overheat at the wand and throttle back amperage. The issue I have faced has nothing to do with use of an adapter. Using the same adapter on 10+ other HPWCs results in no overheating. The flaw is in the HPWC itself.

My H revision Gen 3 HPWC has no overheating issue, while the older G revision does.

 

[Rocky_H]

I am struggling with your reasoning that using a Tesla J1772 adapter on say, an EVGo, ChargePoint, SEMAconnect, EA, etc. charger is fine, but using anything non-Tesla with a Tesla made HPWC is unacceptable,

Struggling why? All companies do this.

even if it causes no damage.

There's no "news story" until it causes damage. If or when it does, and you then try to get a remedy from them, they will find that you were using their product with an unauthorized third party accessory that they think might have caused the problem, and they are off the hook from helping you because they had caution notices not to do that.

If third party NACS-to-J1772 adapters are so terrible, even name brand ones that are widely used with no problem,

Some might be OK, and some might be terrible. That's the point--it's unknown. There is not a technical reason why a really good one won't work, but it is a legal reason that manufacturers can't be (won't be) responsible for people's use of whatever adapters that the manufacturer doesn't know the quality of.

Tesla should sell their own.

Why? None of their cars have a J1772 port, so they don't have a compelling reason to provide that. People can get a J1772 plug station and use official adapters if they want. And now Tesla does sell a J1772 station!