SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
No burden. The are paying the true cost of fossil fuel rather than dumping externalized costs on others.Your low cost is an artifact of Norway government 's policy to burden the ICE drivers with road tolls and gas taxes
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No burden. The are paying the true cost of fossil fuel rather than dumping externalized costs on others.Your low cost is an artifact of Norway government 's policy to burden the ICE drivers with road tolls and gas taxes
I'm glad you like your car but your post said Toyota had cars which got 100-300 mpg and that they were far ahead of everyone else in technology.Yes, I know. I own the car and drive it to work.
90 mile commute, lifetime MPG 110.
Do the math for a more average 30-40 mile commute between charges.
Thanks to @DaveT for bringing this article to my attention in his weekly email newsletter: Toyota chairman: Battery technology must evolve before widespread electric vehicle adoption
How can Uchiyamada not know about that? Or is he just saying those things publicly to try to confuse people and make excuses for Toyotas failure to bring BEVs to market?
Yeah. The Prime is pretty far down my list of PHEVs I would consider. A few I would rather go for:I'm glad you like your car but your post said Toyota had cars which got 100-300 mpg and that they were far ahead of everyone else in technology.
Just about every automaker has a plug in hybrid which if you only drive a short distance will use the battery and get a fantastically inflated mpg. Toyota has nothing special.
R=Ring GearThanks for posting the link. Can you also explain what it means? That graphic is totally incomprehensible to me, with things labeled C S and R with no indication of what they are or what they do. I assume the MG things are motor generators, connected to a mysterious S thing, whatever that is. The Rs seem to be connected to a ground, so they may have something to do with electricity?
Yeah. The Prime is pretty far down my list of PHEVs I would consider. A few I would rather go for:
- Hyundai Ioniq plug-in hybrid
- VW Golf GTE
- VW Passat GTE
- Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV
- Audi A3 e-tron
- BMW i3 REX
- BMW 330e
- Volvo XC90 T8
- Mercedes C350e
- Kia Optima plug-in hybrid
- Kia Niro plug-in hybrid
- etc
It's almost difficult to think of car companies who don't have better options.
I was reading a Toyota website comparing Prius to Ford Fusion. They actually said that the Fusion had more power but that was wasn't necessary!Agree. We drove a Prius with one of my colleague and it even makes us laugh every time we were just accelerating a little bit and the engine starts to roar like crazy. I do not want to sound like a jerk but really, I wonder how someone can purchase this thing... It would be pretty, at least, but even that, it is hard to make worse looking car inside and outside...
A Golf / Passat GTE though (or Audi A3 eTron), THAT, that are well made hybrid enjoyable to ride.
Charging time is not a solved issue. When a BEV can go from empty to full in 5 minutes or less it will be a solved issue. Right now it is a reframed issue ("but everyone stops for a toilet break and a meal")....solved issues...
Charging time is not a solved issue. When a BEV can go from empty to full in 5 minutes or less it will be a solved issue. Right now it is a reframed issue ("but everyone stops for a toilet break and a meal").
Right now an ICE can "recharge" almost anywhere in 5 minutes. BEVs simply can't.
I partly agree with you; as to time, at least. A 500 mile trip takes about 90 minutes longer with Super Charger stops than the one fueling stop my wife's Lexus requires. Yes, we have to stop every couple of hours anyway in the ICE for toilet breaks and to stretch our legs, but that's 5 minutes each time, not 30.Charging time is not a solved issue. When a BEV can go from empty to full in 5 minutes or less it will be a solved issue. Right now it is a reframed issue ("but everyone stops for a toilet break and a meal").
Right now an ICE can "recharge" almost anywhere in 5 minutes. BEVs simply can't.
You should also count the time you save every week by not having to drive to the gas station and fill up the car. This can more than make up for a longer travel time on long trips.I partly agree with you; as to time, at least. A 500 mile trip takes about 90 minutes longer with Super Charger stops than the one fueling stop my wife's Lexus requires. Yes, we have to stop every couple of hours anyway in the ICE for toilet breaks and to stretch our legs, but that's 5 minutes each time, not 30.
On the other hand, we save about $60 to $75, depending on gasoline prices, so we get "paid" $40 to $50 per hour for the extra time.
I completely agree with your post, although the charging time "burden," such as it is, is even less for me. A 500 km (300 mile) trip starts out with ~ 220 miles of range, so if I figure 4 miles per minute charging I have to charge en-route ~ 20 minutes -- which is time I already spend during breaks.And for those, you can do 500km 5 hours driving with one 15mn stop and a full lunch / dinner stops= as much as you want. I do not see this 15mn additional stop as a huge burden considering it is even healthy and safer to cut anyway a 4-5 drive with a pause.
Do you not stop for a meal ?I partly agree with you; as to time, at least. A 500 mile trip takes about 90 minutes longer with Super Charger stops than the one fueling stop my wife's Lexus requires. Yes, we have to stop every couple of hours anyway in the ICE for toilet breaks and to stretch our legs, but that's 5 minutes each time, not 30.
On the other hand, we save about $60 to $75, depending on gasoline prices, so we get "paid" $40 to $50 per hour for the extra time.
250 km each way without charging would be a bit much, but I take impulsive 200 km trips all the time. 400-500 km realistic range will be the norm in a few years, even among cheaper BEVs.A significant portion of my work involves driving 250km+, working for 4 hours and then driving back with NO superchargers or fast chargers en route. These journeys are not yet compatible with BEVs without an overnight stay at a destination charger.
I've also had trips where I've "drained the tank" to 10km of range and then needed to go elsewhere immediately and simply couldn't.
Both these scenarios are no issue to ICE vehicles. They can be recharged in 5 minutes. BEVs just can't... yet.
The last episode of Grand Tour Season 1 showed this up beautifully with a spontaneous 200km one way trip between a BMW i3 and an ICE which highlighted that you can't just simply "go" with a BEV like you can with an ICE.
Until such time as a BEV can fully charge in 5 minutes anywhere, including at home, the charging problem is not yet fully solved.
(Note: we have 2 BEVS and 0 ICE cars - some journeys are just not possible for us but would be if we still had an ICE vehicle).
Using an i3's limited range and slow charge rate as an example of BEV charging limitations is disingenuous at best.The last episode of Grand Tour Season 1 showed this up beautifully with a spontaneous 200km one way trip between a BMW i3 and an ICE which highlighted that you can't just simply "go" with a BEV like you can with an ICE.
"Anywhere"? ICE vehicles cannot refuel "anywhere".Until such time as a BEV can fully charge in 5 minutes anywhere, including at home, the charging problem is not yet fully solved.
For the vast majority of charging, time is not even an issue because the charging is done when you not using the car.Charging time is not a solved issue. When a BEV can go from empty to full in 5 minutes or less it will be a solved issue. Right now it is a reframed issue ("but everyone stops for a toilet break and a meal").
Right now an ICE can "recharge" almost anywhere in 5 minutes. BEVs simply can't.
There are extreme scenarios where any vehicle would not work. That does not make it not work for the other 99% of the time.A significant portion of my work involves driving 250km+, working for 4 hours and then driving back with NO superchargers or fast chargers en route. These journeys are not yet compatible with BEVs without an overnight stay at a destination charger.
I've also had trips where I've "drained the tank" to 10km of range and then needed to go elsewhere immediately and simply couldn't.
Both these scenarios are no issue to ICE vehicles. They can be recharged in 5 minutes. BEVs just can't... yet.
The last episode of Grand Tour Season 1 showed this up beautifully with a spontaneous 200km one way trip between a BMW i3 and an ICE which highlighted that you can't just simply "go" with a BEV like you can with an ICE.
Until such time as a BEV can fully charge in 5 minutes anywhere, including at home, the charging problem is not yet fully solved.
(Note: we have 2 BEVS and 0 ICE cars - some journeys are just not possible for us but would be if we still had an ICE vehicle).