My 2013 60 with 163k miles (2nd owner) Gets around 190 @ 100% (According to the GOM). Is the GOM saying 164, or is that what you experience? Do you use the climate control? What's your average Wh/Mile?
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Are you still on the original battery pack with your 2012-2015 Model S?
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My 2013 60 with 163k miles (2nd owner) Gets around 190 @ 100% (According to the GOM). Is the GOM saying 164, or is that what you experience? Do you use the climate control? What's your average Wh/Mile?
I'm assuming GOM stands for the "Guess O Meter" and if so then yes, my GOM says 164 @ 100%. Yes, I use the climate control. I live in AZ and it stays set @ 72 degrees. I'll have to wait until I get the car back from the Tesla service center to accurately answer the Wh/Mile question. It's having a new drive unit insatlled....again.
And that's 164 RATED miles on the GOM....I refuse to use the "ideal" setting for my range display.
Helpful. AZ is significantly hotter than San Francisco. I very rarely use the climate control. My range (in the rated setting) is dead on if I'm on flat highway driving at 65 with the climate off. I usually average right around 350 wh/mile in mixed driving, which would translate to around 171 miles at 100%, so actually pretty close to your rated range. Flat highway @ 65 gets me down around 300, which would be right at 200 miles.
CO2Saver
Member
2015S 85D, 8-1/2 years, 55K miles.
Original 100% indicated range was 265 miles, which I always considered a bit optimistic, but probably doable at 50 mph with all accessories off.
100% charge now indicates 245 miles. So my battery has declined only 7.5%. Really? No way.
A number of owners on this thread appear to be judging their battery's condition via the small decline in the full-charge claimed range, and they're fooling themselves.
Yes, even an old battery will charge to its rated voltage; it will not, however deliver as many kWH due to ever-increasing internal resistance.
To get a realistic number do this: Charge to 100% and note the claimed range; then run it down to some low charge value and compare the actual miles driven versus the decline in range. In my case, running down from a start of 245 to 45 would hopefully mean I've driven 200 miles. But NO, it's taken only 130 miles of actual driving to burn off 200 miles of claimed range. Therefore, I would judge the battery's condition to be 130/200 = 65%.
Li-ion batteries are known to decline about 5%/year just from normal use and charging. Again in my case, 5% over 8.5 years would be .95^8.5 = 0.646, which corresponds.
My battery's down to 65 percent by both prediction and actual measurement.
Original 100% indicated range was 265 miles, which I always considered a bit optimistic, but probably doable at 50 mph with all accessories off.
100% charge now indicates 245 miles. So my battery has declined only 7.5%. Really? No way.
A number of owners on this thread appear to be judging their battery's condition via the small decline in the full-charge claimed range, and they're fooling themselves.
Yes, even an old battery will charge to its rated voltage; it will not, however deliver as many kWH due to ever-increasing internal resistance.
To get a realistic number do this: Charge to 100% and note the claimed range; then run it down to some low charge value and compare the actual miles driven versus the decline in range. In my case, running down from a start of 245 to 45 would hopefully mean I've driven 200 miles. But NO, it's taken only 130 miles of actual driving to burn off 200 miles of claimed range. Therefore, I would judge the battery's condition to be 130/200 = 65%.
Li-ion batteries are known to decline about 5%/year just from normal use and charging. Again in my case, 5% over 8.5 years would be .95^8.5 = 0.646, which corresponds.
My battery's down to 65 percent by both prediction and actual measurement.
You are mixing up two different things here. The indicated range of 265 and 245 you mention is the rated range for the car and is the number displayed next to the battery icon. These values correspond to the amount of energy available in the battery as determined by the BMS, which is normally pretty accurate. They do not represent how far you will drive because that is dependent on many driving factors, including how fast you drive, the incline, etc., and will vary significantly from drive to drive dependent on the particular driving conditions. The 85D had an original rated range of 270 miles, so your battery degradation should be about 245/270 or a little over 9% from new.
Your test getting only 130 miles of actual range vs. 200 miles of rated range does not indicate the actual degradation because it was just one test under certain driving conditions. How close you get to matching your rated range of 245 miles can be calculated by observing your Wh/mi achieved when driving, but it needs to be calculated from a continuous drive with minimal or no stopping. This is because the display won’t include energy lost when not driving, which can be significant, especially if there is a lot of time between drives.
As I mentioned, for the 85D, the original rated range was 270 miles. The conversion factor from rated range to energy in the battery is 290 Wh/mile for your car. But because the 4.0 kWh hour buffer is not included in the SOC calculation, you would need to drive about 274 Wh/mi to achieve the 245 miles indicated by the battery when driving from 100% to 0%.
So, for example, if you did a continuous drive at 274 Wh/mi, you should match rated range mile for mile, and you should go 200 miles while using 200 miles of rated range. But if you drove at 330 Wh/mi, you would only go about 166 miles while using up 200 rated miles, as calculated by 274/330 x 200 rated miles = 166 miles driven.
You didn’t mention what your driving Wh/mi was, but it would be interesting to see if it is consistent with what you get for your actual range vs. the rated range.
henderrj
Active Member
December 2014 build 85 with AP1. Currently has 279,424 mi on the original battery. Although I am on my third drive unit, if I recall correctly. We did have to pay for the last one.
This was super charged extensively when we had it. Mostly at an Urban supercharger, but still a lot. Easily 500 times. I bought it in late 2015, again working from memory, with 38,000 miles. Like most, it had a rated range of around 265. Haven't checked the rated range in a long time, actually sold it to my brother, but I believe it's a little over 200.
No problems of any kind but long before the warranty went out I bought the wk057 tech warranty. Hopefully I won't need it! Since we aren't entirely sure we can even get it. Haven't heard from Jason Hughes in a long time. As it happens I've met him, as a person he's definitely trustworthy. But as a corporation, I'm not sure they can carry out what he planned.
This was super charged extensively when we had it. Mostly at an Urban supercharger, but still a lot. Easily 500 times. I bought it in late 2015, again working from memory, with 38,000 miles. Like most, it had a rated range of around 265. Haven't checked the rated range in a long time, actually sold it to my brother, but I believe it's a little over 200.
No problems of any kind but long before the warranty went out I bought the wk057 tech warranty. Hopefully I won't need it! Since we aren't entirely sure we can even get it. Haven't heard from Jason Hughes in a long time. As it happens I've met him, as a person he's definitely trustworthy. But as a corporation, I'm not sure they can carry out what he planned.
Tesla batteries do not degrade at 5% per year. That is not typical at all. It is 5% first year and 1% annually after that.
My 2015 70D is dead now secondary to a collision. I was 240 original down to 220. I could absolutely get 220. The BMS is quite good as reporting degradation. I was not "fooling" myself as I made these drives.
Now - to be completely accurate - most of my traveling was at 75 mph mixed with some 50 mph. At that speed, I could do about 200 (with 220 new). I have a second home that is 150 miles away and I went to 50 on arrival. I could get rated at about 66 mph at modest temps. There are times when I was not fully charged and would arrive with 10-20 miles and this correlated well to my starting.
I drove my car to below 10 a few times in the last 2 years of its life.
I had 110k miles on the car when I was T-boned.
My 2015 70D is dead now secondary to a collision. I was 240 original down to 220. I could absolutely get 220. The BMS is quite good as reporting degradation. I was not "fooling" myself as I made these drives.
Now - to be completely accurate - most of my traveling was at 75 mph mixed with some 50 mph. At that speed, I could do about 200 (with 220 new). I have a second home that is 150 miles away and I went to 50 on arrival. I could get rated at about 66 mph at modest temps. There are times when I was not fully charged and would arrive with 10-20 miles and this correlated well to my starting.
I drove my car to below 10 a few times in the last 2 years of its life.
I had 110k miles on the car when I was T-boned.
This has been my experience. I can absolutely maintain just under 300 wh/mi on flat ground @ 65mph which would translate to a little more than the rated range displayed at 100%. Yesterday with a lot of stops in between, I drove 65 miles and used 79 miles indicated, lots of hills as well.
Mjsais
Member
I own a 7/2013 built Model S 85 since new. It currently has 72,700 miles and still have the original battery. I typically charge to 90% (225 miles rated). Max usable capacity in scan my tesla is 251 miles. The last time I tried to charged to 100%, it stopped charging at 247 miles and 98%.
Want to thank everyone for Posting.
1 question please. Does Tesla call it a Remanufactured Batt Pack, or Rebuilt Pack?
Two different repairs. REMAN is when Company takes item apart and tests everything on it, replacing all parts at Manufacturer Specs. A REBUILT is when Company finds internal part that caused failure and replaces only that part.
Being in Automotive business (Master Tech, Australia Mangr Parts) it is a huge difference in price percentage wise of 2 different repairs.
1 question please. Does Tesla call it a Remanufactured Batt Pack, or Rebuilt Pack?
Two different repairs. REMAN is when Company takes item apart and tests everything on it, replacing all parts at Manufacturer Specs. A REBUILT is when Company finds internal part that caused failure and replaces only that part.
Being in Automotive business (Master Tech, Australia Mangr Parts) it is a huge difference in price percentage wise of 2 different repairs.
GHammer
Dark Star
From all available information, by your definition, they do a rebuild. They do not replace the battery cells. They repair/replace BMB's, fix sense wires, remove failed modules from 400v packs and reuse the packs as 350v packs.
I believe this to be true also but have we ever found any confirmation of this - even someone with (claims) knowledge speaking off the record? I've also heard that they mix and match modules to make 400V packs work. If they do, hopefully they have some rigs to measure the CAC and match accordingly. They do need them to last 4 years or the margins get trimmed a bunch...
BrokerDon
Active Member
2015 Model S P85D on original HV battery.
- 80,000 miles
- 90% charged at home at 64A / 240V on Tesla Gen 1 and Gen 2 Tesla Wall Connector on 100A breaker (80A max charge rate)
- Ludicrous upgrade
- coastal SoCal (mild temperatures + low humidity)
Darn ! And I was annoyed that my 2015 Model S70 caps at 224 miles (-2 addt. miles right off the street)
iCAR
Member
This is all great information for us lucky ones still with original batteries in 2012-2015 vehicles. It would be helpful to build a spreadsheet including the month&year delivered, battery size & Revision(from battery sticker), current range and mileage.
If you had a failure and replaced or repaired the original battery, note that as well and the mileage at failure.
I have a 2014 S 85, 126,000 miles, Rev E battery, current rated range of 247 miles(less than 7% degradation), 35% supercharging(DC) based on SMT data.
If you had a failure and replaced or repaired the original battery, note that as well and the mileage at failure.
I have a 2014 S 85, 126,000 miles, Rev E battery, current rated range of 247 miles(less than 7% degradation), 35% supercharging(DC) based on SMT data.
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