Any information on 7.2

[TaoJones]

Well, this bodes well for red light and stop sign recognition this year at least as was previously teased. Here's hoping for another October surprise.

So many SCs are empty while on the road that I can't yet get excited about the SC heads up referenced above - although I can see how it would help many in the denser areas and at peak times. Thing is, if you need, for example, the Barstow SC, then you need the Barstow SC. Planning ahead at Needles or at Cabezon only gets you so far. Still, more and *correct* information is better than less.

Hopefully at some point they'll code in a pop-up alert for when the routing changes otherwise without any notice whatsoever to a different or the previous SC. Often this is only manifested as an upcoming exit without indication that you've just been routed in reverse. Actually, the persistent/annoying reverse case is fairly noticeable - it's the lateral or alternative routing that can really trip you up. No pun intended.

 

[Todd Burch]

In order for the in-car Supercharger info to be truly useful, when you pull up info for a Supercharger they should incorporate the following info:

1) The number of operative stalls,
2) Cars currently using any stalls, and their estimated charge completion time (based on each car's set charge limit),
3) The cars who currently have that Supercharger as their navigation destination and their estimated arrival time/charge, and
4) Your arrival time if you were to immediately head there from your current destination.

Using this info, they could indicate where you are in the queue and give you an estimated wait time, all without entering any information.

It wouldn't be perfect (some would head there without it as their destination, others would have it as their destination but make stops along the way, etc) but it should be pretty good for a first attempt at the system, and would be much less hassle then implementing some sort of reservation system--especially since you might reserve a spot and then change your mind but fail to cancel your reservation, which might tie up a Supercharger that someone else could use.

As other drivers headed to that Supercharger cancel their destination, or make pit stops, or as cars unexpectedly pull into or out of stalls, etc...it could update you on your estimated wait time based on your updated expected arrival time.

 

[roblab]

Boy, do I see problems!

How ya gonna estimate all those that are on the road to the supercharger? Especially if they don't tell the car that they are going to supercharge, don't tell it minutes, don't have any idea what the car and the charger chose for charging current?

And knowing that the average car rotates out in about 20 - 30 minutes, if you're coming from 30 miles away, all the cars will be different. Never mind that you try to make a charging decision an hour and a half away.

I especially like the comment about Barstow. There aren't always alternate chargers. And if there are, if you choose an alternate, there are NOW no more alternates. You need a charge, or you don't. It's not like you have a choice. Then again, most charging sites are empty most of the day. So you wait a couple minutes. It's not the end of the world.

This fantastic map app doesn't do much for about 95% - 99% of the people. No, make that 100%. What I read was that it would tell when a charger was down, not occupied. Down does not change in 15 minutes. Down makes sense. And down hardly ever happens. If it does, you really should know.

 

[Todd Burch]

How ya gonna estimate all those that are on the road to the supercharger? Especially if they don't tell the car that they are going to supercharge, don't tell it minutes, don't have any idea what the car and the charger chose for charging current?

You could just use those who have it as their destination in nav. If you're navigating to a Supercharger, you probably intend to charge there. Won't catch everyone of course, but will be better than it is. And those who have it in their nav can already communicate their expected SOC when they arrive, and therefore you can at least get a rough idea of how long an estimated charge would take.

Of course it won't be perfect, but it doesn't need to be. That alone would be a big improvement.

And knowing that the average car rotates out in about 20 - 30 minutes, if you're coming from 30 miles away, all the cars will be different. Never mind that you try to make a charging decision an hour and a half away.

Again, if they have any of this I think it will just be to give you a rough idea. You'll be able to at least have an idea of whether a Supercharger is really busy, or relatively quiet. Which can help with a decision, but not make the correct one every time.

Live traffic shows you how traffic was a few minutes ago, not how it will be when you get there, yet it's still very helpful.

 

[DFibRL8R]

I think having the information is great, especially if it shows number charging and a cue waiting on site too. Having experienced this at Delaware before the (awesome!) upgrade, it would be nice to know and plan accordingly. Especially once there is a greater density of superchargers with fewer long distances between them which appears to be the plan. I could see Tesla eventually getting to the point where the route planning knows the status of superchargers and reccommends accordingly. I also suspect that most people are using the nav to the supercharger given the importance of knowing your SOC -v- miles remaining so there wouldn't be too many Model S's just showing up unannounced.

3) The cars who currently have that Supercharger as their navigation destination and their estimated arrival time/charge, and
4) Your arrival time if you were to immediately head there from your current destination.

Using this info, they could indicate where you are in the queue and give you an estimated wait time, all without entering any information.

I must admit though when I read this my first thought was the potential for increasing your speed if you see you and another driver are in bound at the same time for the last spot, not that I would ever do that of course!

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

I especially like the comment about Barstow. There aren't always alternate chargers. And if there are, if you choose an alternate, there are NOW no more alternates. You need a charge, or you don't. It's not like you have a choice. Then again, most charging sites are empty most of the day. So you wait a couple minutes. It's not the end of the world.
.

If you had perfect information you would know whether you should slow down to reduce charging time, or speed up to improve position in line.

Tesla has information on charging patterns. My hope is that they'd work towards a predictive model that would help minimize travel time. The first step would be letting cars know about _current_ traffic. The next step would be tying in navigation/Adventure Planner, to add information about cars expected through the Supercharger.

 

[Saghost]

If you had perfect information you would know whether you should slow down to reduce charging time, or speed up to improve position in line.

Tesla has information on charging patterns. My hope is that they'd work towards a predictive model that would help minimize travel time. The first step would be letting cars know about _current_ traffic. The next step would be tying in navigation/Adventure Planner, to add information about cars expected through the Supercharger.

Yes, a predictive model is what is needed, and I suspect you're correct that this real time feedback is the first step towards it.

I've posted on a number of occasions about how I would expect the eventual model to work - using historical patterns for local/non-Navigation charging and building an ETA database for cars running under Navigation, then using the same approach as the traffic avoidance systems to adjust navigation paths away from protected conflicts (or even try to time phase them out by suggesting charging more at some stations and less at others.)

The other pillar the predictive model rests on is a reliable navigation system with accurate energy use modeling (including some sort of real time verification to cover having extra passengers or a bike on a roof rack.) I'm sure they are building data on energy usage now - hopefully they are also updating the navigation routing.

 

[roblab]

So it looks like we've gone from "range anxiety" to "wait anxiety". I tell people that you only have range anxiety if you don't own a Tesla. And now, it's wait anxiety if you don't have predictive software. Both anxieties abide pretty much in people's heads, a fear of something that may happen and may be inconvenient at most. If I find I have to wait, I pull out a book or game. I notice that many people do a lot of waiting once they get home.

And it's not like you won't be waiting while you charge anyway. You still have to wait. Makes me think this whole thing is being pushed by the Koch brothers in Big Oil. "Never have to wait: Buy a gas car." Only that's not true.

I just can't understand this need to keep from waiting for a charger. What makes it even more interesting is that I have never waited but once in my years of driving Model S and charging at dozens of different chargers. Is that where the imaginary part of the fear comes in? Boogeyman at the SC site -- sounds like a movie.

 

[tezzla]

Remember these days?

 

[cpa]

Just my thoughts:

In May last year I pulled into Lovelock around 11AM on a Tuesday. Three of the four stalls were in use, so I grabbed the only open stall. Within 20 minutes one driver departed, and another car arrived to fill the available stall.

Similarly, in early August I arrived at Grants Pass around 5PM on a Monday afternoon. Again, 3/4 of the stalls were occupied. Shortly after I plugged in another driver arrived and had to wait.

I concede that these remote Supercharger locations generally do not receive as much activity as the ones in metro areas or on busy routes like I5 between LA and SF. However, it would be a good feature to have recent history appear on the touchscreen (maybe within 30 miles from the proximate Supercharger, and again at 10 miles) periodically to notify us if there has been a surge in use. At the least we would be aware of a possible wait or reduced charge rate at a paired stall.

I also concede that my experiences were likely isolated instances. But I think the day is coming when even these more remote locations will begin to see increases in activity, especially during prime vacation and holiday travel periods.

At least for me, I would welcome a notification when I was about 30 miles (and again at 10 miles) away from a Supercharger (whether I have locked into it on the navigation or not) that said something like "2/4 stalls in use currently; 6 charging sessions in the past 2 hours."

But this may prove to be impractical.

 

[apacheguy]

Yes, please. In car reporting of all the stalls including maximum available amperage at each. Makes selection of the correct stall much easier than having to do the inventory of cars yourself.