Upper Rear Link Build (Reduces rear camber to improve tire wear)

[harry]

Based on the discussion in this thread, I had a set of +.21" longer upper links made for one of our S's, and they work great for us. I can get these made and shipped (within N.A.) for $650 per set. They have new bushings and there is no core charge -- the price is the total. If you want some, let me know. There's a picture of them here:

Upper Suspension Links +.21

PM me if you are interested.

 

[artsci]

Sorry, was on the road and missed a lot of this.....
I did some links for myself and a few others but passed on doing any more for liability reasons. Chris was kind enough to pick up the ball but there simply appears to be too little demand especially when you consider that the newer outboard ball style link requires a third design (original soft rubber, improved harder rubber and now hard rubber inner and ball style outer). I can not imagine trying to stock all those links when it is hard to sell even the first run.

I agree with the out of warranty point but would also add it is likely the MS crowd is not the suspension DYI'rs ala Porsche and such. The GT3 guys do not even have their first cup of coffee before considering what suspension change to do that day

It is a bit of a shame as my cars handle flawlessly with no perceptible change in driving dynamics while not chewing up rears. It's a no brainer until you actually think about the idea of changing out factory designed suspension bits. I'm ok with it but it appears as though most are not.

Regrettably I think a lot of owners don't care or are even aware of the difference. I think it's safe to say most owners don't drive the car at anything approaching your level of skill and expertise. They don't know camber from shamber

 

[Denarius]

Based on the discussion in this thread, I had a set of +.21" longer upper links made for one of our S's, and they work great for us. I can get these made and shipped (within N.A.) for $650 per set. They have new bushings and there is no core charge -- the price is the total. If you want some, let me know. There's a picture of them here:

Upper Suspension Links +.21

PM me if you are interested.

do the bushings match the + suspension or standard?

 

[jerry33]

Regrettably I think a lot of owners don't care or are even aware of the difference. I think it's safe to say most owners don't drive the car at anything approaching your level of skill and expertise. They don't know camber from shamber

And others are concerned about the warranty aspects.

 

[artsci]

And others are concerned about the warranty aspects.

No doubt about that, but it's often way overblown. Given all the modifications I've made to my Model S one might assume that I would be denied service or my warranty would be invalidated. But there's been nothing of the kind, not even a hint of it. My SC knows everything I've done and when my car comes in for service (not often I have to say) it gets attention because of it. Of course, I've been very careful not to mess with mods that effect in any way the basic operating systems. Now and then there's a service aspect that's denied, for example because I have the adjustable rear links installed they won't do an alignment anymore. But that's not a problem as I have it done locally at a much higher level of accuracy.

 

[lolachampcar]

I have found Tesla to be unbelievably flexible and accommodating when it comes to my cars. I start by making sure they know I take full responsibility of anything I have done. If something I did fails or causes a Tesla part to fail, it is on me. If they employ my alignment specs, any wear or performance related issues are on me. Tesla is unlike any other auto manufacturer that I have dealt with in that they will at least have the conversation and are perfectly reasonable in their responses.

What is important to note, not to really beat up the issue, is that anything you do is on you and Tesla needs to know you know that. MS is not like your normal tuner car where owners are accustomed to mucking with things. As pointed out above, most MS owners have no idea what upper links and alignment geometry are nor do they wish to. It was not surprising to me that very few availed themselves of the camber links even though the cost of a set installed was nearly if not absolutely less than a set of rear PS2s. Nothing wrong with that but it is something to consider before heading off to make aftermarket suspension parts for the car.

 

[jerry33]

Now and then there's a service aspect that's denied, for example because I have the adjustable rear links installed they won't do an alignment anymore. But that's not a problem as I have it done locally at a much higher level of accuracy.

On that note, they are now charging for alignment even if you have prepaid service (which was supposed to include "everything but tires"). This makes getting the rear links much more likely because if I'm going to pay, I'm going to pay someone who does it more accurately. It's annoying that I'll have to drive 50 miles to do so, but that's the closest place I have confidence in.

 

[pimp-boy]

do the bushings match the + suspension or standard?

When I PM'ED Harry, the bushings are aftermarket. So no clue of the bushings actually are stiffer, equal, or more forgiving. Also, the hole size diameter he mentioned may be different for these bushings. So you can't just press your existing ones out and put them in the new upper links. I wish I bought the ones lolachampcar and Chris made before it was discontinued. Argh.....

 

[Denarius]

When I PM'ED Harry, the bushings are aftermarket. So no clue of the bushings actually are stiffer, equal, or more forgiving. Also, the hole size diameter he mentioned may be different for these bushings. So you can't just press your existing ones out and put them in the new upper links. I wish I bought the ones lolachampcar and Chris made before it was discontinued. Argh.....

Agreed. Has anyone who installed these links offer any input on how the bushings compare?

 

[lolachampcar]

I did not realize the links were using non-Tesla bushings. This could be a good thing (say they are using BMW style ball joints like the current MS uses on the outside) or a bad thing if they are trying to use a polyurethane type bushing (you really need angular misalignment capability in the bushing). Knowing what they are doing would remove a huge unknown as would knowing what material they picked and how it is finished. I ended up using 6061 to make sure I exceeded the strength of the Tesla extrusion then had to anodize it for corrosion protection. The OpenEVSE folks took a similar approach but really upped the game on finish quality.

 

[harry]

do the bushings match the + suspension or standard?

Standard, early VIN cars. Beyond that I have no idea.

 

[Sunfishsolar.ca]

Hi, Lola or Harry,
Got .210 longer links put in. They got the camber down to .9, but they said they could only get the tow to .5 tow out. Out of adjustment room on the esentrics. Do you think they alined at the wrong height or the car has warn bushings somewhere in the rear suspension not allowing for the adjustment, I think the rear tow should be .15 tow in? Getting new tire tomorrow and I'm thinking I'd like to be there for another try at aligning.

 

[lolachampcar]

When I was designing my first set of links I tried some 0.250" longer links and found there was insufficient toe adjustment and thus reverted to the 0.210" longer arms. I've used 0.210" longer arms on four of my cars now with only one problem. On my P+, I had to loosen the four power unit cradle bolts to allow the assembly to re-center as I could get one side set with toe in while the other side ran out of adjustment. When I loosened the bolts, the drive assembly literally snapped back into a centered position and then both left and right toe were easily adjusted.

 

[Sunfishsolar.ca]

I will have the mechanic try that. .47 total toe out seems like a lot. I don't really want to leave it like that. Thanks, Greg

 

[linkster]

Got .210 longer links put in. They got the camber down to .9, but they said they could only get the tow to .5 tow out. Out of adjustment room on the esentrics.

This is backwards. When one installs longer ULs, you have the possibility of maxing out the toe-out eccentric (forcing one into a toe-in condition). Time to find a new alignment shop? (champ or Hyper can explain this in much better detail!)

 

[Hank42]

The thought just came to me that I've had success with "downloading" parts from designers (in Germany) prior to local fabrication for my other hobbies - why not for my Tesla?
Aside from making money, any interest in creating a 3D render of the links suitable for download (for free? opensource license? donationware?? etc..) that one could use to 3d print a set of (obviously non-functioonal) "coffee table conversation pieces " for one of several reasons:
1. A plastic 3d replica for a local shop to produce(copy) <- thus limiting liability to some degree
2. Allow for tweaks before printing and sending to shop for fab
3. Art!


H-

 

[lolachampcar]

Take about ten minutes in solid works as the part is an actual extrusion

 

[Bennny]

Is it a noticeable difference in handling, taking out the camber?

 

[lolachampcar]

No
The camber is used by MFGs to pass stability control regs. Before you worry, consider that an S on coils can easily have -1 from the factory so it is safe.

 

[Bennny]

No
The camber is used by MFGs to pass stability control regs. Before you worry, consider that an S on coils can easily have -1 from the factory so it is safe.

Why do Tesla set them up with camber from factory?

I presume for better handling, but if the handling is the same anyway, might as well have none and save tyres.