Yeah exactly. I paid about 59k after tax credit for a 60 even though I could get a 85 with other features for around the same price. The only reason why I didn't was for AP's futures. I hope I made the right decision!
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Tesla Model S CPO Website - Now Live
- Thread starter Benjamin Brooks
- Start date
P85D just popped up: 85 kWh Performance Model S P65127 | Tesla Motors
Not sure why you'd buy it though - Production times are around 4 weeks and the price is essentially the same as if you ordered the car like that brand new...
Not sure why you'd buy it though - Production times are around 4 weeks and the price is essentially the same as if you ordered the car like that brand new...
I thought the same thing. If you had the kind of scratch to afford that, I'd think you would at least want to pick the color.P85D just popped up: 85 kWh Performance Model S P65127 | Tesla Motors
Not sure why you'd buy it though - Production times are around 4 weeks and the price is essentially the same as if you ordered the car like that brand new...
P85D just popped up: 85 kWh Performance Model S P65127 | Tesla Motors
Not sure why you'd buy it though - Production times are around 4 weeks and the price is essentially the same as if you ordered the car like that brand new...
I agree. That price makes no sense unless someone is incapable of waiting 4-6 weeks. This is a CPO car so you loose out on about $10K in rebates depending on where you live. With the rebates included you can buy a brand new car for about the same cost that no one else had driven before. It's a not a great deal but I'm sure someone will buy it
jtpassat
Member
Drucifer
Active Member
BoerumHill
not great not terrible
Because a P85 is always a better buy than a S60, in every circumstance? So let's discount mileage (even though 25K miles is not insignificant...) and just line them up for now.
Tale of the tape
- P85 vs. S60 - this one shouldn't be close.
- Vin 17496 vs. Vin 44916 - these build dates are about 11 months apart. Fremont improves 20-30 parts or processes every week. This is not an insignificant consideration.
- Silver vs. solid White - the most subjective choice, but white - not Pearl W but just solid W - outpolls silver in the Deliver Tracker by a wide margin (better than 2:1 several quarters)
- body color vs. pano - about 1:4 or 1:5 is the common ratio here. Pano is a big part of the Model S identity IMO.
- same wheels, same performance leather - PUSH
- CF décor & CF spoiler vs. Piano black & matching yacht floor - edge P85
- Active Air (not SAS) vs. UHFS - PUSH
- The last two are apples vs. oranges but that's the problem with comparing apples and oranges
So it's a pretty bare bones P85 vs. an adequate S60 (though actually items like MYF & UHFS are super rare in 60s.) I dunno, doesn't seem crazy they are in the same strata.
At the end of the day, I feel like we don't have to right metrics and data points to evaluate the CPO yet, though. Like we should, by now, have figured out some rough guidelines along the lines of:
List price of this P85 = 96,470 - [{-600 x 23 months} + {-.60 x 34598 miles}] = 61911.20
List price of this S60 = 74,570 - [{-600 x 12 months} + {-.60 x 9116miles}] = 61900.40
(hypothetical list & depreciation factors, for illustrative purposes only)
I'm not suggesting depreciation rates of $600 per month or $0.60 per mile are the benchmark; I am merely pointing out that a proper methodology would use this kind of quantitative approach.
Wow, well done. What are your thoughts about the CPOs that are autopilot capable? What type of value do you see those bringing?
BoerumHill
not great not terrible
Insane
Banned
P85D just popped up: 85 kWh Performance Model S P65127 | Tesla Motors
Not sure why you'd buy it though - Production times are around 4 weeks and the price is essentially the same as if you ordered the car like that brand new...
This car is fully loaded. Adding 7,500 it comes to $ 118,400 Vs $ 126,750
Fair point. I guess I just discounted the fact that it has third row seats and cold weather package instinctively
You're right though - it's probably the perfect setup for someone!
Cyclone
Cyclonic Member ((.oO))
Fair point. I guess I just discounted the fact that it has third row seats and cold weather package instinctively
You're right though - it's probably the perfect setup for someone!
In particular if said individual can't fully take advantage of the tax incentives.
jtpassat
Member
They both have the same warranty so build quality should not be a factor, any issues just have Tesla fix it. The battery size difference alone is enough of a deal breaker for most IMO. 85kw vs. 60kw at the same price with the same warranty. That is a no brainer.
BoerumHill
not great not terrible
I see neither one of us is an owner yet, but based on other's experiences and watching videos, folks comparing their own vehicles to later build loaners note palpable differences in noise, tightness, parts, et al. So it's not true "there is no difference in build between 2013 and 2014." The car improves through OTA updates, but the build improves through process engineering and changing assembly parts (many unseen we're not aware of.)
In addition, 25,000 miles is not a small difference. I'm pretty sure that P85 with 34K is going to rolling down the road for a long, long time - but you can't simply dismiss a difference that large and pretend it isn't a factor in the price.
Most folks looking at 85s aren't considering 60s. That gap increases when we're talking about prospective P85 buyers vs. S60. But that's not the discussion. Getting back on point, the Q is does it make sense they would have the same price? I think I laid out a pretty solid argument it's not an anomaly, they should be in the price band. Your argument seems to be "Because 85" while ignoring all other data points.
Now if you and I are discussing what each of us personally would want to buy, we don't have a difference of opinion. I'm not so enamored with AP that I would buy a 60 just to get it, while foregoing the opportunity to drive a performance model that has 27% greater range and a WAY higher Teslagrin factor.
Drucifer
Active Member
That's where I landed. When I replace this car in maybe 4-5 years, and Gen 2 or 3 of autopilot hardware is being installed with Gen 5 or 6 of the AP software, I will be ready to have that. In the meantime I have a rather luxurious and badass Model S.
jtpassat
Member
BoerumHill
not great not terrible
Doh! Of course it doesn't...I never sort by that, but I see they're priced 72-86k before the deferred tax credit. I think I misremembered because the first follow up post asked about valuing the AP.
OK, that and I'm middle aged & forget s&*+ all the time...
I wouldn't go by statements, like this, if you are new to considering a Tesla MS. It makes it sound as though the car has been reinvented, and it hasn't. Features matter to some, like automatic folding mirrors, parking sensors or adaptive cruise control. Others might be more intent to pick up genuine improvements like bushings, the sub-frame and going from 90kw, to 115kw super-charging. Whether it matters, or not, you should end up with a list that isn't much more than a couple dozen items long.
Hank has done a great job of making it so that newbies don't have to know how the "Tech" package changed over time. Internal changes don't cause the fever around here as much, and for however many there may have been, most of the significant ones show up in the driving dynamics, and charging, sub-forums.
HankLloydRight
No Roads
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