Stop the Press! Tesla announces REAL HP numbers for P85D and P90L

[Canuck]

"Despite its defence of the claimed figures, Tesla is in the process of organising a buy-back. The Tesla spokeswoman concluded: “Customer satisfaction is of the utmost importance to Tesla. In the rare case when a customer finds their Model S isn’t for them, we’ll do what we can to help them move on.”

This is great news and is exactly what I said should happen. I do need to admit that I was wrong on my prediction that Tesla would do nothing. I'm glad they stepped up to the plate to put this issue to an end. Tesla should be applauded for this. I can't imagine any other business taking a step like this.

This also makes your option very clear and there should be no doubt about it -- you must move on from Tesla. There's no partial cash back and keeping your car, or even buying another. The words "move on" were carefully selected.

Now we'll see the actual numbers of people who take Tesla up on this. I agree with Tesla that it will be the rare case.

 

[tomas]

People should not read too much into a few words. Organize a buyback can mean many things. Especially the way brits use the word organise.

 

[Canuck]

People should not read too much into a few words. Organize a buyback can mean many things. Especially the way brits use the word organise.

Agreed. I also have my doubts. And if it is true, I can only imagine the Release you must sign to take them up on this offer.

 

[gsxdsm]

"Despite its defence of the claimed figures, Tesla is in the process of organising a buy-back. The Tesla spokeswoman concluded: “Customer satisfaction is of the utmost importance to Tesla. In the rare case when a customer finds their Model S isn’t for them, we’ll do what we can to help them move on.”

This is great news and is exactly what I said should happen. I do need to admit that I was wrong on my prediction that Tesla would do nothing. I'm glad they stepped up to the plate to put this issue to an end. Tesla should be applauded for this. I can't imagine any other business taking a step like this.

This also makes your option very clear and there should be no doubt about it -- you must move on from Tesla. There's no partial cash back and keeping your car, or even buying another. The words "move on" were carefully selected.

Now we'll see the actual numbers of people who take Tesla up on this. I agree with Tesla that it will be the rare case.

I think the quote from that article was just about a buy-back for that one particular owner - I don't believe there is a large scale buy-back.

But it does go to the point you and I were making earlier - I believe the remedy for unhappy owners will be a buy-back and a polite refusal of Tesla to do business with a customer in the future (in the case of a law suit or other legal threats).

 

[lolachampcar]

That would be consistent with a Silicon Valley "my way or the highway" approach to solving a problem. Regretfully, this approach leaves little room for either side needing to resolve something less than a catastrophic issue. I suspect there will be a full spectrum of ways to move forward provided your issue does not raise to the level of organized consumer complaint or threatening legal action.

 

[Johan]

Agreed. I also have my doubts. And if it is true, I can only imagine the Release you must sign to take them up on this offer.

Hopythethically speaking, would it be possible for Tesla to offer a disgruntled owner a buy-back of a P85D on the condition that this person 1) will not be sold a car from Tesla in the future and 2) Committ to not buying a Tesla on the second hand market?

 

[Canuck]

Hopythethically speaking, would it be possible for Tesla to offer a disgruntled owner a buy-back of a P85D on the condition that this person 1) will not be sold a car from Tesla in the future and 2) Committ to not buying a Tesla on the second hand market?

Tesla doesn't need you to agree to (1). It can refuse to sell a vehicle to anyone it wants or blacklists provided the reason is not based on discrimination which doesn't apply.

With regard to (2): I doubt it. What is more likely is Tesla saying "moving on" means that if you take the buy back and then buy one used (since that's tempting to recover depreciation), they will refuse to service that vehicle, except for warranty or recall issues as required by law.

That's just my 'off the cuff' personal opinion on those issues.

 

[3mp_kwh]

I think it's silly, to go down the "no future business" road. Tesla won't do this, with the experience I've had. It isn't "Tesla, and you", or "Tesla vs. you", where both acknowledge a transaction and the will to go back over its parts. Resolution can have many ingredients, notwithstanding that some people's expectations may have been unreasonable. I am just not that cynical about how many walk around thinking they're going to "get even with Tesla", or that they are going to get something from their hide. Happy owners and sellers can still be an outcome. An outcome for parties who fundamentally did not want to be in this situation.

 

[Canuck]

I think it's silly, to go down the "no future business" road. Tesla won't do this, with the experience I've had.

They have done it. So you can't say they won't do it again. You could try to distinguish the reason they have blacklisted people in the past, but you can't say they won't blacklist because we know they do.

 

[P85DEE]

"Despite its defence of the claimed figures, Tesla is in the process of organising a buy-back. The Tesla spokeswoman concluded: “Customer satisfaction is of the utmost importance to Tesla. In the rare case when a customer finds their Model S isn’t for them, we’ll do what we can to help them move on.”

This is great news and is exactly what I said should happen. I do need to admit that I was wrong on my prediction that Tesla would do nothing. I'm glad they stepped up to the plate to put this issue to an end. Tesla should be applauded for this. I can't imagine any other business taking a step like this.

This also makes your option very clear and there should be no doubt about it -- you must move on from Tesla. There's no partial cash back and keeping your car, or even buying another. The words "move on" were carefully selected.

Now we'll see the actual numbers of people who take Tesla up on this. I agree with Tesla that it will be the rare case.

Might turn out to be the best thing to come out of this matter, and if this discussion had anything to do with it, then might also be the best thing to come out of this discussion.

 

[P85DEE]

They have done it. So you can't say they won't do it again. You could try to distinguish the reason they have blacklisted people in the past, but you can't say they won't blacklist because we know they do.

I don't think Tesla is going to take this sitting down, because they don't have to.

The catch phrases "move on" and "part ways", don't leave a whole lot to the imagination.

 

[jerjozwik]

genius, they can buy back most of the early stock of 2014/2015 p85d, sell them as CPO and possibly get a few new orders for the p90dL which... would help them make end of year targets!

 

[P85DEE]

genius, they can buy back most of the early stock of 2014/2015 p85d, sell them as CPO and possibly get a few new orders for the p90dL which... would help them make end of year targets!

They could even add Luducrous or offer to add it pre sale to some of those buyback cars, prior to putting them on the CPO market, and possibly make out even better.

All while parting ways with at the very least a part of the small segment of dissatisfied P85D customers

 

[3mp_kwh]

They have done it. So you can't say they won't do it again. You could try to distinguish the reason they have blacklisted people in the past, but you can't say they won't blacklist because we know they do.

Canuck, I said "with the experience I've had". I don't believe the subject of this thread goes a path that would lead Tesla to do what you suggest. Maybe it is without legal process, but there's likely to be lots of middle ground before that outcome.

 

[Auzie]

Canuck, I said "with the experience I've had". I don't believe the subject of this thread goes a path that would lead Tesla to do what you suggest. Maybe it is without legal process, but there's likely to be lots of middle ground before that outcome.

The offer of discounted L upgrade is Tesla meeting customers on more than middle ground.

Some people's actions could have easily inflicted a disproportionate amount of damage to Tesla business over this issue. This saga reminds me of Shylock's demand of a pound of flesh.

Fool me once, it's on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. It is likely both parties to this saga will ponder if they were fooled in any substantial way and if it is worthwhile to be fooled again by the same party.

 

[Canuck]

The offer of discounted L upgrade is Tesla meeting customers on more than middle ground.

That was fair but I think that people like wk057, Andy and others that bought the car based on the hp and other representations that were misleading should get it for free. There's really not many of those people and it wouldn't make any difference to Tesla's bottom line. But Tesla obviously can't do that for some customers and not all. Even if Tesla reached out to those people confidentially, and had them sign a NDA about it being provided free of charge, it couldn't be kept under wraps. So that's out. That's what makes the all or nothing solution the only viable option, at least in my view.

 

[AnOutsider]

Some posts, and resulting discussion, went to snippiness. A contentious topic, no doubt, but if you can't be civil, it might be best to ignore the thread.

 

[redox]

Canuck, I said "with the experience I've had". I don't believe the subject of this thread goes a path that would lead Tesla to do what you suggest. Maybe it is without legal process, but there's likely to be lots of middle ground before that outcome.

That's way too reasonable!

 

[P85DEE]

I think the quote from that article was just about a buy-back for that one particular owner - I don't believe there is a large scale buy-back.

But don't you see, it begs the questions; "If they are willing to do this for that one particular owner, well then why not anyone else? What's so special about him?"

I think this might be the tip of the iceberg, and over the long haul, may make the best sense in a multi pronged method toward bringing this matter to a resolution before it can become a bigger headache.

Right now, it is likely a small problem, but better to nip it in the bud before it can become a bigger problem.

They have to know that anyone taking them up on their offer, an offer which would probably include an agreement that no future new Tesla vehicle would be sold to them, those former owners will go and buy something else. Any backlash will be short lived because the former Tesla owner will be in his BMW or Audi, etc., and will soon be complaining about nuances associated with it, as opposed to the prospect of not being able to purchase a new Tesla.

He will become their problem then, and not Tesla's.

Sure, a few people would say; "I complained, and Tesla blackballed me, and kept me from buying another new Tesla",....... but seriously, how long can they keep that up, or even will they keep that up, once they buy something else and potentially find things to complain about with it on it's respective message boards?

Giving disgruntled owners the chance to have the table set as if they had never purchased their cars, or as close to that scenario as is feasible, would allow them to go their way, and Tesla to go theirs.

And before anyone says; "That's too heavy handed, there has to be some middle ground, such as giving away Ludicrous for free, or some other gesture", well consider a couple things.

First, cutting the labor cost of Ludicrous completely out, may have been that gesture. When Ludicrous was first announced, it was $5K plus labor.

Secondly, those who got Ludicrous for free, how long would it be before some of them started up with; "free Ludicrous is not quite a big enough of a step in the right direction", and started to complain even more and more loudly, even after free Ludicrous had been given to them

How long before free Ludicrous, which even if they got, would not give them 691 horsepower, according to methods of measurement which tell them that they are short right now, how long before free Ludicrous was not enough, and this matter rears it's ugly head yet again?

Already the explanation given by J.B. Straubel didn't do much good. So how long after people got free Ludicrous, before the whole mess started up again?

No, better to give those who feel that they have been taken here, the opportunity to have things set to all square, and let those folks, in the words of the lady spokesperson, "move on".

Indeed, the words "move on", I agree with Canuck, were very carefully selected.

But it does go to the point you and I were making earlier - I believe the remedy for unhappy owners will be a buy-back and a polite refusal of Tesla to do business with a customer in the future (in the case of a law suit or other legal threats).

I don't know if the guy in that article has or has not threatened legal action, as the article does not say.

But this much we do know, whichever route he has indicated that he will be taking, whatever it is, in his particular case, it seems that the option for letting him "move on" has been put out there.

 

[AWDtsla]

Sure, a few people would say; "I complained, and Tesla blackballed me, and kept me from buying another new Tesla",....... but seriously, how long can they keep that up, or even will they keep that up, once they buy something else and potentially find things to complain about with it on it's respective message boards?

Seems to work for other car companies. I'll leave it at that, google can do the rest.