NEMA 14-50 Location

[teknoprep]

I have a very reasonable licensed electrician who has given me 2 quotes for a NEMA 14-50 outlet in my garage. I'm very lucky - breaker box is new, located right next to my car, and requires minimal work. No permit required.

However, the breaker box is housed near the front-left of my car. He said it (obviously) would be much cheaper to install the outlet next to the breaker box:

14-50 Outlet - $30
50-amp Breaker - $20
6-Gauge Wire - $20
Labor - $180
TOTAL - $250

If I want to run it to the rear of my car, it would involve going into the attic and running approx. 50 ft of wire. He estimated 1/2 a days work, and double the price - $500.

For those who have their outlet at the front, is it worth the extra $250 to move it to the rear? My garage is kind of tight, so don't want too much of an inconvenience of unplugging and moving the cable, but would like some recommendations before spending the extra money.

Thanks!

 

[davewill]

Leaving it at the front of the car will work, but I'd think it would be worth the difference both to not have to unwind as much cable, and to be able to reach the driveway in a pinch. I don't understand why he wants to run the wire up into the attic and back down. He should be able to run it along the wall in conduit, like this:

 

[BOBEDIGITL]

I have a very reasonable licensed electrician who has given me 2 quotes for a NEMA 14-50 outlet in my garage. I'm very lucky - breaker box is new, located right next to my car, and requires minimal work. No permit required.

However, the breaker box is housed near the front-left of my car. He said it (obviously) would be much cheaper to install the outlet next to the breaker box:

14-50 Outlet - $30
50-amp Breaker - $20
6-Gauge Wire - $20
Labor - $180
TOTAL - $250

If I want to run it to the rear of my car, it would involve going into the attic and running approx. 50 ft of wire. He estimated 1/2 a days work, and double the price - $500.

For those who have their outlet at the front, is it worth the extra $250 to move it to the rear? My garage is kind of tight, so don't want too much of an inconvenience of unplugging and moving the cable, but would like some recommendations before spending the extra money.

Thanks!

Definitely isn't necessary. The cable that comes with the vehicle is 25 feet. You're going to be paying $250 more for the convenience. That's what the real question boils down to.

 

[albtrssp]

The Model 3 is a very easy car to back into a garage. I'm not one of those guys who back into every parking space, but decided backing it into my garage put the charging port in a better location, and have never had an issue doing that. The backup camera is excellent, and I just put a few pieces of tape on the floor to show exactly where to aim.

 

[Runebane]

We have the Tesla 25' (or is it 20'?) at the front of the garage. That's a lot of cable to wind up. But we have 2 model 3s and we were hoping to reach both of them with the location, but we failed on our measurements and have to swap garage locations anyway to charge. If we had to do it over, I would have put it closer to the rear of the car.

 

[davewill]

The Model 3 is a very easy car to back into a garage. ...

In his situation, I don't think backing in is an improvement since the charge port would then be on the opposite side of the car.

 

[teknoprep]

Leaving it at the front of the car will work, but I'd think it would be worth the difference both to not have to unwind as much cable, and to be able to reach the driveway in a pinch. I don't understand why he wants to run the wire up into the attic and back down. He should be able to run it along the wall in conduit, like this:

View attachment 424038

I think mainly for aesthetic’s. Running into attic would have more of a “built in” look.

 

[brkaus]

Front of garage on charge port side or no?

If on charge port side I’d probably leave at front.

Advantage of closer to the door is you can also charge a friend in the drive.

Second thought, I’d pay the extra $250.

 

[ReddykwRun]

I have a very reasonable licensed electrician who has given me 2 quotes for a NEMA 14-50 outlet in my garage. I'm very lucky - breaker box is new, located right next to my car, and requires minimal work. No permit required.

However, the breaker box is housed near the front-left of my car. He said it (obviously) would be much cheaper to install the outlet next to the breaker box:

14-50 Outlet - $30
50-amp Breaker - $20
6-Gauge Wire - $20
Labor - $180
TOTAL - $250

If I want to run it to the rear of my car, it would involve going into the attic and running approx. 50 ft of wire. He estimated 1/2 a days work, and double the price - $500.

For those who have their outlet at the front, is it worth the extra $250 to move it to the rear? My garage is kind of tight, so don't want too much of an inconvenience of unplugging and moving the cable, but would like some recommendations before spending the extra money.

Thanks!

I am sure that was a typo on the breaker size, did you mean to say 60 AMP Breaker? ( 60 AMP minus 20% constant load = 48 )

 

[earthwormjim]

Why would it be 60 amps? NEMA 14-50 means 50 amps max, not 50 amps continuous. Continuous current rating for 14-50 is 40 amps, not 48 amps.

You should not install a breaker with a higher current rating than the maximum allowable current on the plug receptacle.

 

[teknoprep]

Front of garage on charge port side or no?

If on charge port side I’d probably leave at front.

Advantage of closer to the door is you can also charge a friend in the drive.

Second thought, I’d pay the extra $250.

Ha! Both are on the left side of the car. So either front-left for $250 or rear-left for $500

 

[teknoprep]

I am sure that was a typo on the breaker size, did you mean to say 60 AMP Breaker? ( 60 AMP minus 20% constant load = 48 )

Tesla’s guide recommends 50-amp:

https://www.tesla.com/sites/default.../NEMA_14-50_installation_guide_NA_US_2017.pdf

I think the max my Model 3 can do is 32-amp

 

[brkaus]

Ha! Both are on the left side of the car. So either front-left for $250 or rear-left for $500

Ok. Charge port side. Either will work, just put a hook on the back and leave the cord there. If you put it by the door you can charge sitting in the drive too.

Only need to bring the UMC if your visiting someone with a plug. I don’t bother bringing mine even on trips anymore. It’s J1772 or Superchargers on the road.

Of course depends on where you live and how you travel.

 

[puckpurnell]

Brought my 220V / 50amp out of the basement and in conduit the length of the garage to a NEMA 14-50 plug. It runs along the knee wall of the garage foundation. Sits just forward of my charging port and is very convenient. Total cost was $338 and took the elcectrician about 2 hours. No problem charging when the car is on the other side of the garage as the cord reaches just fine.

 

[ReddykwRun]

Why would it be 60 amps? NEMA 14-50 means 50 amps max, not 50 amps continuous. Continuous current rating for 14-50 is 40 amps, not 48 amps.

You should not install a breaker with a higher current rating than the maximum allowable current on the plug receptacle.

You are so right, I brain farted about the plug. My bad. I guess my head was thinkiing how I wired my hard wired Wall Connector.

I.A.W. Step-by-Step Instructions for Tesla Wall Connector Guide

"The Wall Connector has an internal rotary switch that allows you to adjust its operating current (refer to Set the Operating Current on page 21). The circuit breaker should be rated for the continuous current of: 12, 16, 20, 24, 28,32, 36, 40, 48, 56, 64, 72, or 80A.Note: Refer to the circuit breaker current ratings specified on IEC 60898 when installing the Wall Connector. If in doubt, check with your local building electrical inspector"

For my MS 100D a 60 amp breaker is recommended for fastest charging. Be mindful of the 80% rule for the total circuit. I ran #6 gage wire. No telling what power requirements will be in a few years.

The load a circuit is to carry determines the appropriate size circuit breaker. For safety, the total circuit load should be 80 percent of the breaker's capacity. This allows for factors such as ambient temperature and its effect on the operation of the circuit, according to Electrical Construction & Maintenance.

Manufacturers print the amperage rating of appliances and electronics on the device. The amperage of the circuit is the sum of the appliances operating on it. If this number is greater than 80 percent of the capacity, one or more of the appliances should operate on a different circuit or the capacity of the circuit increased.

Increasing the capacity of a circuit requires more than just changing a circuit breaker in the electrical panel. Drawing too much power through a circuit produces additional heat, creating a fire danger regardless of the circuit breaker rating. Circuit breakers work to protect wiring and trip before overheating becomes a problem. A 15-amp breaker requires a minimum of a 14-gage copper wire. Increasing to a 20-amp breaker increases the minimum wire gage to a 12-gage.

Electrical codes specify the appropriate size breaker for each circuit. They require permanently installed and operated appliances like refrigerators and air conditioners to have a dedicated circuit

 

[qdeathstar]

$250 bucks? There is no way this dude is liscensed. Also, how do you know you do not need a permit? I wouldn’t take this guys word for it....

 

[teknoprep]

$250 bucks? There is no way this dude is liscensed. Also, how do you know you do not need a permit? I wouldn’t take this guys word for it....

He’s licensed, verified current license through the state - in fact he’s the person who wired my new home build 2 years ago (and passed all inspections). I live in a rural area which doesn’t require a permit for this type of change.

I think the biggest part of everything being so inexpensive is the location & new build. Just have to get a breaker, outlet, and some wire. No upgrades needed and the run will literally be 2ft. Which is why running through the attic would take much longer and cost more $$.

 

[Glamisduner]

The conduit might be easier to deal with later when you end up with a HPWC.

I'd have him install 6awg THHN wire in conduit if it is cheaper than running through the attic. This will allow you to upgrade to a HPWC and get 48 amps (with just a breaker change) later if you choose to go that route.

6awg wire is expensive, but convenience is probably more important.

 

[roblab]

Just think what people could do with a little education and experience! Most counties around here do not require an electrician to put in an outlet. Homeowners do this all the time in their own homes. Most counties do not require a permit.

I put in my own outlets when I wired my garage, and two were 50 amp services. Guess what! I have two EVs. I think I paid around $25 for each outlet, plus maybe 15' of #6 wire. Easy peasy, and cheap. For all you folk who plan to live any time longer, you might ought to take a few classes at your local junior college or high school so you could start doing your own wiring and save, what, $500, $1000, $2000?? I also installed a bunch of solar panels (68) and have them plugged into my breaker panel. 'Tain't hard. I'm afraid I don't even know who my local electricians, local plumbers, or local garage guy is (though I don't need those any more, do I?).

Just sayin', do it yourself is pretty easy for a lot of this stuff. Helped me afford a couple REALLY nice cars over time!

 

[mrau]

Sounds like your electrician is very reasonably priced, so it is worth it. I would have the 14-50 outlet placed where it is the most convienant and it will help make the whole EV experience much better. Also, with the outlet closer to the overhead door, you will be able to reach a car that is parked in the driveway. If you have a two car garage, the outlet may also reach over to the other bay in garage if you need to park there or get another EV.

It is a bit more work to have the outlet where you really want it, so it cost a bit more. But I think you will be much happier and in a week you’ll forget about the cost. Put it in the less convienent spot, and you will remember it every day you plug in.