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Problem w/ just looking at a map is that it doesn't convey well the topography. I would love to skip Hawthorne or SJC when headed to Tejon, but because of the 50mi of hilly/mountainous terrain on the way to Tejon superchargers, one has to do a pit stop somewhere along the way from San Diego. If only CA were as flat as Florida in terms of EV-driving (but it would lose much of its geographic charm)...
Just did our first supercharging the past weekend after owning our P85 for a year and went though Hawthorne on the way up and back from San Diego to the Central Coast. No slots closed on Friday or Monday and didn't have to wait either time, but did get the last slot on Friday. It was way busier than Buellton which had one other model S each time we stopped.
Being a supercharger newbie and having my family with me, we charged to almost 100% in each circumstance. With experience, I might have unplugged early. Also, we ate both times while charging which nullifies the time lost during charging. In both cases, after a regular meal we found the car just about 100% after the 1 hour to walk to a place, eat, and use the bathroom.
I work at a company which provides free level 2 charging. I don't use it because I don't need it and because the EV drivers are so so rude. Many don't charge at home. They all feel entitled to free fuel because they've chosen an EV. They have an elaborate protocol for who parks where, how long to charge, etc. They will unplug you if they think you have "enough". It is truly horrible.
I think as people become more accustomed to how this works, it will be just like the queue at the grocery store - some people will be aware of their fellow shoppers and yield their spot in line for someone with a light basket or with kids. Others will be jerks. You can't legislate manners.
Being a supercharger newbie and having my family with me, we charged to almost 100% in each circumstance. With experience, I might have unplugged early. Also, we ate both times while charging which nullifies the time lost during charging. In both cases, after a regular meal we found the car just about 100% after the 1 hour to walk to a place, eat, and use the bathroom.
I work at a company which provides free level 2 charging. I don't use it because I don't need it and because the EV drivers are so so rude. Many don't charge at home. They all feel entitled to free fuel because they've chosen an EV. They have an elaborate protocol for who parks where, how long to charge, etc. They will unplug you if they think you have "enough". It is truly horrible.
I think as people become more accustomed to how this works, it will be just like the queue at the grocery store - some people will be aware of their fellow shoppers and yield their spot in line for someone with a light basket or with kids. Others will be jerks. You can't legislate manners.
Good points all around, especially about legislating manners. I do think Tesla could do well to explain better how charging works so people don't waste as much time.
As for your charging to 100% for safety, check out http://evtripper.com. It's a great tool and will save you a lot of time in the long run by keeping you from wasting time at the charger. You can plan your whole trip and how much you'll need to charge at each stop or you can simply plan the next leg while you're charging.
I would suggest that Tesla should be charging an at cost fee to use the Superchargers, negating people being stingy and antisocial. If they don't do this, Superchargers will become a nightmare when there are 150,000 Tesla vehicles on the road.
They could also link up a a Tesla mobile App based alert when a certain threshold is reached to summon you back to the car.
There should be a proportionate increase in the number of Superchargers with sales...
They should also have a display that shows the expected time to go until the charge is finished as a courtesy to newcomers.
They could also link up a a Tesla mobile App based alert when a certain threshold is reached to summon you back to the car.
There should be a proportionate increase in the number of Superchargers with sales...
They should also have a display that shows the expected time to go until the charge is finished as a courtesy to newcomers.
The only time I've done a long distance trip north from San Diego, I had no trouble getting from Tejon Ranch from Del Mar. I think I have about 30 mile of range left when I pulled in.
Using EVtripper, with a speed rating of 1.25 (80mph on the highway segments), it shows 256 Rated miles. Since I rarely (never?) get through LA at 80mph, it's reasonably safe trip with a Range Charge at home.
Oh please, this is nothing like giving up your seat for a pregnant woman.
I do self checkout at the grocery store. But yes those people have the right to do that, I also have the right to be patient or move along.
Del Mar to Tejon supercharger is 186 miles according to Google Maps.
La Jolla to Tejon supercharger is 196 miles.
But, one burns more than 10 miles of range on the battery just driving out of hilly La Jolla onto I-5 then up to Del Mar. More like 20mi range.
So yeah, it's a little dicey doing La Jolla straight to Del Mar unless it was like 3 in the morning (zero traffic) but even then I've learned the hard way that there can be huge traffic jams at 3 in the morning in LA because they close a freeway for overnight road construction and there's only 1 lane for the exit detour....
C'mon Tesla, come out with a 100+ kWh battery
Also don't underestimate how many people are stretching (and by how much) to drive a Model S. I didn't have to sell any limbs to own one, but some people seem to come close to that.
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Do the math?
(60 kWh x 70% / 300 Wh/mi)
140mi is the maximum distance they should have between superchargers.
And they should probably trim that if it's not a straight line between them on a flat road where the speed limit is 50mph (so that you can get "Rated" while driving 55mph) or the weather isn't 55-65F year-round.
Agreed, but most don't (surely not for a 120ish mile trip)...and if someone else needs only a quick charge and the last 5% takes a loooong time, it's not unreasonable to want to be able to get a quick charge. IMHO, anyway. And I doubt any of those people were expecting one person to stop charging for 40 minutes...come on, no one said that.
Of course they're not responsible for broken equipment. That doesn't mean that one or two of them couldn't have been a little more helpful. Not everything has to be all-er-nuthin'.
Granted, we're hearing one side of things, so it may be more complicated than it originally sounded (e.g., "I'm going to San Diego" might've meant someplace far enough south that it was really a lot more than 120 miles..or it might've meant "I'm going to San Diego to pick up my friend and we're continuing on with no time to stop again"...or...etc.).
As I mentioned before, there should be no reason for anyone to charge to 100% at that station. I am planning a trip up the east coast with my 60. I have already done a few shorter trips between SCs and can tell you that I dont need a 100% charge to get from place to place. EXCEPT from St Augustine to Savannah. That is 173 miles and will be a challenge in the 60 but can be done with a 100% charge. But looking at the map, both east and west coast, there are no other places where someone would need a 100% charge. So again, looking at the map, I think these are people using the SC for a quick fix or probably locals for free juice. The travelers would be better served to take it to 70-80% and move on.
apvbguy
Banned
an example of needing to charge to 100% would be when I was at the very inadequate and very busy Newark DE supercharger.
Heading south on I 95 the next SC is Glenn Allen VA. which is a bit over 200 miles away. At Newark I needed to charge to 100% in order to make the run more comfortable with a small reserve of usable range. I arrived at Glenn Allen with a buffer of 37 miles.
I don't think that anyone has a right to say that I shouldn't have the option to charge to 100% because there are only 4 chargers at this location and people shouldn't be forced to wait while I get that 100% charge. does anyone really think that I should give up the spot at the SC so others who might just need a short charge can charge and go?
Heading south on I 95 the next SC is Glenn Allen VA. which is a bit over 200 miles away. At Newark I needed to charge to 100% in order to make the run more comfortable with a small reserve of usable range. I arrived at Glenn Allen with a buffer of 37 miles.
I don't think that anyone has a right to say that I shouldn't have the option to charge to 100% because there are only 4 chargers at this location and people shouldn't be forced to wait while I get that 100% charge. does anyone really think that I should give up the spot at the SC so others who might just need a short charge can charge and go?
Maybe we need the equivalent of the "ten items or less" queue at the supermarket - or rather a "please use bays 1 and 2 if you intend to charge above 90%"
That's a mouthful - how about a digital sign above each bay which shows "max charge available" followed by a percentage. This could vary across all the bays depending on time of day, recharging traffic, previously recorded recharging habits/use at these SC stations. One or two bays would always offer 100%.
These signs could also flash up the approximate countdown in minutes for the car which is currently plugged in.
Ideally a future smart system would know how many S's (and X's) are converging on that location and could adjust for that as well.
Wouldn't solve the problem caused in the OP due to broken SCs.
That's a mouthful - how about a digital sign above each bay which shows "max charge available" followed by a percentage. This could vary across all the bays depending on time of day, recharging traffic, previously recorded recharging habits/use at these SC stations. One or two bays would always offer 100%.
These signs could also flash up the approximate countdown in minutes for the car which is currently plugged in.
Ideally a future smart system would know how many S's (and X's) are converging on that location and could adjust for that as well.
Wouldn't solve the problem caused in the OP due to broken SCs.
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JJR64
28680
That would be a great idea. Based on some of the comments from some outlandishly self-centered sounding people on this thread, however, I'm not sure it would be overly effective.
apvbguy
Banned
that's an intriguing concept, maybe tesla should run models to see if it would be a viable solution at the busier locations
That seems like a good idea, it could be a 20 minutes or less line (or 30, I don't know what's reasonable). At least that would help keep the queue moving...assuming those chargers were functional.
Sorry, I wasn't clear.
It's not just a sign. The idea is that if you are using one of the XX% bays then the Supercharger and the car communicate/collude together so that charging shuts down when that SOC is reached - (There must be some sort of communication happening already to control the Supercharge throttle back - this just triggers a maximum throttle back/stall together with an appropriate message sent to the driver's dashboard/phone).
Drivers would be warned/reminded about this as soon as they plug in, of course. If they have set for 95% or 100% and they are connected to one of the 90% bays then the charge value would automatically reset to the correct figure and a message would pop up to point out the discrepancy/remind the driver that they are connected to a limited maximum charge bay.
If they want a higher charge, they have to join the queue for one of the unrestricted "100%" bays.
(Obviously the driver could set a lower % than the one set/posted above the bay if they know their route and are confident about charge/range)
In terms of effective and orderly queueing, the "drive-thru" design of bay is far better than the "reverse-into" type. To future-proof SC stations, they really need to mimic gas stations rather than parking lots in terms of traffic flow.
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There is a SC 100 miles away at Bethesda, on the way south. If I was at Newark coming south, all you need is about 125 miles on the dial to get to Bethesda and it would be a quick charge to get the next 130 miles needed to get to Glen Allen. Maybe it wasn't there when you made the trip, and that would be a different story. But on the East coast the SCs are within 100-130 miles apart, you don't need a 100% charge to move on. In fact, it is even to your advantage to come in with a lower charge level then to get it back up to the 130-150 miles you will need will be much faster and then off you go :biggrin:
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No one ever needs to charge to 100% if you understand time and speed. Once your charge rate is below maybe 50mph it is faster to leave the SC and drive slower than it is to wait for a 100% charge. the last ~2% does nothing to help your time...If you are leaving your house maybe the extra 3-4 miles rated will help (but not much)
waiting for the last couple percent is just pointless and dumb
waiting for the last couple percent is just pointless and dumb
dhrivnak
Active Member
And it would make Roadster owners happy as they are completely left behind with supercharging.
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