Clean Title but was declared a total loss by insurance. Tesla rep says no supercharging. Are they wrong?

[zlindy]

Hey everyone, first post, and proud owner of my first Tesla as of two weeks ago. Found tons of valuable info here as I was researching, thanks to everyone.

Q: Recently purchased a used 2020 Model 3 SR+ with ~14,000 miles. It has a clean title but Carfax history shows it had a "minor to moderate" collision in late 2021 at the front driver side fender and was claimed "total loss" by insurance at the time. However, it has since been repaired and somehow(?) still has a clean title.

The original owner purchased and drove the car in TX (actually, I think it may have been leased). Best I can tell from the Carfax, after the accident it was sold, fixed, and resold to a second owner in CA. The second owner then traded it into a dealer in CA, which is where I bought it. I've wanted a Model 3 for years now and finally decided to pull the trigger.

We take semi-frequent longer roadtrips (300-500 miles) and so Supercharging is fairly important to us. I did a ton of research before buying a used Model 3 and thought I was safe with this car because despite it having a previous accident, it still has a clean title. We have a roadtrip coming up in about 2 weeks, so I went to test out the Supercharging a few days ago and when I plugged it in, the screen gave me a message "Supercharging Not Enabled. Try AC Charging." Thought it was maybe because I hadn't set up a payment method yet, so I did that, and still received the same message. So I call Tesla and they tell me the vehicle has a salvage title. I explain that I'm aware it had a prior accident but it actually has a clean title. This seemed to shock the rep I was speaking with, and he said he had to talk to his manager and would get back to me. A few days later I get an email from who I assume was his manager and it just said "Our records are not wrong. We cannot clear the title. Call the person you bought the vehicle from."

So now I'm concerned that I may have missed a nuance during my research and that it's not just salvage title vehicles that can't supercharge, but any vehicle that has had an accident or that Tesla deems unfit.
Does anyone know any more detail about being able to supercharge a car with clean title that has had an accident?
Is the Tesla rep I spoke to wrong?
Can they in fact update the title in their system to be clean and re-enable supercharging?
Or is there any sort of inspection I can have them do to clear it for supercharging? If so, any idea on cost?
There are no other public non-Tesla "superchargers" we can use are there?
This would be a huge bummer for us if we couldn't supercharge, hoping I didn't fail in my research and buy a car that can't supercharge :/.

Thank you!

Z

 

[FFCars]

Go with an eBay claim. The dealer disclosed the issue. He’s not going to anything. Why would he?

 

[bradtem]

Well, while the risk of fire could be a concern, Tesla could (but won't) offer a service where, for a fat fee, they inspect the car and its charging system to certify it as OK to supercharge. They might decline if the accident damaged the pack. People would pay this.

However, other than the fee, Tesla is probably happy to disable the salvaged car, because it's one less car on the used market which competes when their sale of new and non-salvaged cars.

Now, if fire risk is real, all fast charging stations will want to block salvage cars from charging. At present they have no way to do that, though. Tesla does.

 

[BigNick]

oof, that eBay posting is ROUGH.

Anyone using "B4" in a professional manner should not be trusted...lol

Reading that ad sets off scam alerts in my brain.

 

[rosinhound]

So I took a screenshot of the listing (bought on eBay) right after we purchased it. Attached a copy below. The listing clearly states "CAR HAS CLEAN TITLE BUT CARFAX SHOWS TOTAL LOSS. PREVIOUS OWNER PURCHASED THAT CAR IN DIFFERENT STATE WITH CLEAN TITLE."

I also attached a copy of the Used Vehicle Damage Disclosure we signed as part of the purchase docs, stating that the vehicle has suffered previous damage which may affect the future value of the vehicle.

We did have the vehicle inspected by a mobile mechanic before agreeing to purchase, FYI. His report was that the vehicle ran great with only minor cosmetic issues and no mechanical issues.

What do you guys make of these? Was the dealer supposed to disclose anything more than they did, or am I out of luck here and failed in my due diligence? Do they need to disclose that it should have a salvage title, or that the title was washed? I 100% would not have bought it if I knew that. I feel bad because my experience with the dealer was great throughout, but if they did something wrong, I don't want to get stuck holding the bag for it.

Thanks again.

View attachment 848898

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View attachment 848900

Definitely ask the mobile mechanic why testing if it charges isn’t part of his routine.

 

[bobkravetz]

Hey everyone, first post, and proud owner of my first Tesla as of two weeks ago. Found tons of valuable info here as I was researching, thanks to everyone.

Q: Recently purchased a used 2020 Model 3 SR+ with ~14,000 miles. It has a clean title but Carfax history shows it had a "minor to moderate" collision in late 2021 at the front driver side fender and was claimed "total loss" by insurance at the time. However, it has since been repaired and somehow(?) still has a clean title.

The original owner purchased and drove the car in TX (actually, I think it may have been leased). Best I can tell from the Carfax, after the accident it was sold, fixed, and resold to a second owner in CA. The second owner then traded it into a dealer in CA, which is where I bought it. I've wanted a Model 3 for years now and finally decided to pull the trigger.

We take semi-frequent longer roadtrips (300-500 miles) and so Supercharging is fairly important to us. I did a ton of research before buying a used Model 3 and thought I was safe with this car because despite it having a previous accident, it still has a clean title. We have a roadtrip coming up in about 2 weeks, so I went to test out the Supercharging a few days ago and when I plugged it in, the screen gave me a message "Supercharging Not Enabled. Try AC Charging." Thought it was maybe because I hadn't set up a payment method yet, so I did that, and still received the same message. So I call Tesla and they tell me the vehicle has a salvage title. I explain that I'm aware it had a prior accident but it actually has a clean title. This seemed to shock the rep I was speaking with, and he said he had to talk to his manager and would get back to me. A few days later I get an email from who I assume was his manager and it just said "Our records are not wrong. We cannot clear the title. Call the person you bought the vehicle from."

So now I'm concerned that I may have missed a nuance during my research and that it's not just salvage title vehicles that can't supercharge, but any vehicle that has had an accident or that Tesla deems unfit.
Does anyone know any more detail about being able to supercharge a car with clean title that has had an accident?
Is the Tesla rep I spoke to wrong?
Can they in fact update the title in their system to be clean and re-enable supercharging?
Or is there any sort of inspection I can have them do to clear it for supercharging? If so, any idea on cost?
There are no other public non-Tesla "superchargers" we can use are there?
This would be a huge bummer for us if we couldn't supercharge, hoping I didn't fail in my research and buy a car that can't supercharge :/.

Thank you!

Z

Sounds like someone jumped around the various states hoping the original salvage classification wouldn't catch up with the title. Stolen cars are sometimes done this way since a few states have to hand search titles. I'd talk to the insurance company that gave it the salvage title classification and look for an answer. It could be the crash wasn't so minor and damaged the battery pack or it's a case of ignorance of EV's by the insurance company's claims department. Your seller might never have known. There has to be a way to correct the situation and be able to get back to charging at the superchargers. Or try this from a Google search:

You can't remove a salvage title from a car, but it can be rebranded as rebuilt after undergoing repairs and passing a state inspection. A car receives a salvage title after it suffers damages that exceed 75% of its total value.Jun 21, 2021

 

[Jstar97]

This is a really good point. CCS is inferior to Tesla Supercharging, but vastly better than no DC charging at all

Agreed, and for some of us a with a budget of about $30, a salvaged Tesla model 3 or a Chevy bolt are our options for an effective EV with decent range.

 

[Said Ka]

Hi zlindy, first and foremost, you are correct, if you received a clean title, that means you have a clean title. Please dont listen do all the false advise I've been reading in this forum. im truly shocked about the information provided to you, people just talking with no clue about this topic. The title was not sent to you by the gobbler next door. The DMV is the one who decides to keep it a clean title, or to change it to a salvage title. If you received the title to your name as a clean title, that means its a clean title PERIOD.

As far as the total loss goes, it is very possible for an insurance company to pay out the owner of the vehicle by declaring it a total loss, when the repairs may actually not exceed 75% or whatever formula they use to actually salvage it. The insurance company actually minimizes their loss by taking ownership of the vehicle to avoid paying for repairs, then reselling it through an auction for example. Total loss does NOT equal Salvage!

Now coming to the dealer, while he was correct about the clean title, he must by law declare that it was deemed a total loss despite the clean title. They must have shared the CarFax with you, have they? if they concealed this information from you, you definitely have a cause of action against them. I'd call the dealer and ask. My assumption, if they haven't told you is, that they made you sign a paper where it is declared, and you didn't read it. Dealers can be sneaky. If you call them and they pretend that they told you and say they have a contract where it was declared, request a copy, and if they have it, id drop it. Id call and check what they say. dont go to a lawyer first (terrible advise)

 

[stopcrazypp]

Hi zlindy, first and foremost, you are correct, if you received a clean title, that means you have a clean title. Please dont listen do all the false advise I've been reading in this forum. im truly shocked about the information provided to you, people just talking with no clue about this topic. The title was not sent to you by the gobbler next door. The DMV is the one who decides to keep it a clean title, or to change it to a salvage title. If you received the title to your name as a clean title, that means its a clean title PERIOD.

Not true at all, someone already linked up thread there is something called title washing:
What Is Title Washing?

Given this car was totaled in Texas (which would have branded the title in Texas), repaired and resold in California, it is a prime candidate for title washing (moving the car between states is the most common way to wash a title). Presumably the OP has no access to the original title information in Texas, so there is no way to find out more.

For Tesla's purposes, a title washed vehicle is still a salvage vehicle. Tesla doesn't recognize rebuilt title vehicles as "clean" either. In both states, rebuilt vehicles are still salvage vehicles, Texas calls them "rebuilt salvage", California calls them "revived salvage":
Rebuilt Vehicles | TxDMV.gov
Branded Titles - Look Before You Buy - California DMV

The only way it would remain a "clean" title vehicle is if insurance company never actually totaled the vehicle (so they never reported it to DMV), but the only way there is a way to prove that is if the car stayed in one state (so current owner can request title history from DMV).

As far as the total loss goes, it is very possible for an insurance company to pay out the owner of the vehicle by declaring it a total loss, when the repairs may actually not exceed 75% or whatever formula they use to actually salvage it. The insurance company actually minimizes their loss by taking ownership of the vehicle to avoid paying for repairs, then reselling it through an auction for example. Total loss does NOT equal Salvage!

For both states the OP's car was in, total loss equals salvage.

In Texas, even if the original owner does not retain the title, the title is branded as salvage when the car is declared a total loss and the insurance company sells or transfers it (there is specifically a category for that case):
Salvage Vehicles | TxDMV.gov
By Texas state law, the insurance company must get a salvage title if they sell/transfer the vehicle after retaining ownership. If owner retains vehicle, they must report it within 31 days (which would also brand the title as salvage):
Texas Administrative Code
By California state law, the insurance company or owner is required to file for a salvage certificate within 10 days of settlement:
19.075 Salvage Certificate - California DMV

In either state, there legally is no such thing as a totaled vehicle (that is still on the road) that is not salvage (regardless of if owner retains ownership or not).

Now coming to the dealer, while he was correct about the clean title, he must by law declare that it was deemed a total loss despite the clean title. They must have shared the CarFax with you, have they? if they concealed this information from you, you definitely have a cause of action against them. I'd call the dealer and ask. My assumption, if they haven't told you is, that they made you sign a paper where it is declared, and you didn't read it. Dealers can be sneaky. If you call them and they pretend that they told you and say they have a contract where it was declared, request a copy, and if they have it, id drop it. Id call and check what they say. dont go to a lawyer first (terrible advise)

 

[EfficientWatts]

Tesla to allow salvaged vehicles back on Supercharger network

Tesla is establishing a process to allow salvage vehicles back on the Supercharger network after being banned for the last two years.

electrek.co

Some news on this front. Looks like there may be a process to actually get supercharging reenabled (finally). When that's available you may be able to give that a shot; hopefully it passes for you with no issues.

 

[brainhouston]

I'll believe it when i see it but glad the article is out n hope its for real.

Also, happy to see this, nice work electrek.co

 

[buckets0fun]

Tesla to allow salvaged vehicles back on Supercharger network

Tesla is establishing a process to allow salvage vehicles back on the Supercharger network after being banned for the last two years.

electrek.co

Some news on this front. Looks like there may be a process to actually get supercharging reenabled (finally). When that's available you may be able to give that a shot; hopefully it passes for you with no issues.

PSA: It's the same cost(and process) as the old High Voltage inspection, but renamed. 900$

 

[MP3Mike]

PSA: It's the same cost(and process) as the old High Voltage inspection, but renamed. 900$

But according to Electrek you have to have paid for and passed the HV inspection, which was $525, before you can pay for the Supercharging inspection.

 

[buckets0fun]

But according to Electrek you have to have paid for and passed the HV inspection, which was $525, before you can pay for the Supercharging inspection.

Believe what you want, I'm merely providing you with the SC's information on this new policy from 1hr ago.

 

[buckets0fun]

But according to Electrek you have to have paid for and passed the HV inspection, which was $525, before you can pay for the Supercharging inspection.

Go back far enough and it was over 1000 USD for an X(we only had experience with this on an X), after completed with no issues, it allowed supercharging to be reenabled.

The amount of misinformation on this is absolutely insane. One person "hears" someone say 'zomg salvage cars are a haz0rddddzzzz. be grEeN, buy a new car, don't be cheap. blahblahblah' and the internet treats it as if it was from Jesus herself's lips.

 

[MP3Mike]

Go back far enough and it was over 1000 USD for an X(we only had experience with this on an X), after completed with no issues, it allowed supercharging to be reenabled.

Yeah it has been through a few versions. I think the original one cost like $2,500 and on top of it you had to pay for a third party body shop to take your car apart so that they could take measurements and pictures for Tesla to review.

 

[DuncanM]

This article might be of interest;

Tesla to allow salvaged vehicles back on Supercharger network

Tesla is establishing a process to allow salvage vehicles back on the Supercharger network after being banned for the last two years.

electrek.co

(Sorry, I didn't update the page before posting)

 

[jjrandorin]

This article might be of interest;

Tesla to allow salvaged vehicles back on Supercharger network

Tesla is establishing a process to allow salvage vehicles back on the Supercharger network after being banned for the last two years.

electrek.co

Your quoting the same article that was already quoted (in post #69) and is currently being discussed.

 

[JollyBadger]

I bought a 2020 Model 3 with a salvage title in August of 2021. I got supercharging until May of 2022 when I got the vehicle back from Service. They gave me the High voltage Test and it came out clean, but they stopped giving me Supergharging privileges. There was a recent article that Tesla was going to give Tesla vehicles Supercharging again if they got the High Voltage Test and passed. I went and got to use the Supercharger again today. Success.

 

[brainhouston]

I bought a 2020 Model 3 with a salvage title in August of 2021. I got supercharging until May of 2022 when I got the vehicle back from Service. They gave me the High voltage Test and it came out clean, but they stopped giving me Supergharging privileges. There was a recent article that Tesla was going to give Tesla vehicles Supercharging again if they got the High Voltage Test and passed. I went and got to use the Supercharger again today. Success.View attachment 874606

Thanks for confirming thats good news!
Could you share how much u paid? and if u had to pay twice?

 

[buckets0fun]

Thanks for confirming thats good news!
Could you share how much u paid? and if u had to pay twice?

Pricing is different now than over the summer.
Expect around 900$, the battery doesn’t come out, they just look the car over much like a PPI would.

The cars call home every moment of every day that they’re on(slight hyperbole), mothership knows.