So basically a 75 is exactly 75 kWh including the bricking buffer. Interesting that they underrate the 60.
Note that a 24 kWh LEAF only has ~22 kWh usable.
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Tesla Motors: PLEASE stop lying about specifications (60 to 75 upgrade)
- Thread starter wk057
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So basically a 75 is exactly 75 kWh including the bricking buffer. Interesting that they underrate the 60.
Note that a 24 kWh LEAF only has ~22 kWh usable.
Okies
So the rule of thumb is knock 5 off the kWh number, while the EPA range estimate stays as it is.
Talking of nice and honest, the Bolt has a 60kWh battery and its EPA figure is 238 miles
Tesla's 60 (true 62.6) kWh battery is only 210 miles (or 218 miles for the D)
I guess GM managed to fit a 70.95 kWh* battery into the Bolt and have shown remarkable restraint in not bragging about it.
How wonderfully public-spirited of them. How like GM to under-promise and over-deliver.
Amazing that they've managed to achieve that in spite of a Cd of 0.32
But then I guess Tesla's just been lying about the S's Cd of 0.24 as well
* (62.6/210)x238
jgillispie
Member
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
Very true, but that only provides an advantage in situations dominated by acceleration, but since these usually have to be followed by deceleration/regen, the benefit is not that marked.
However, once up to speed, long distance driving range at constant higher speeds is affected more by aerodynamics than by vehicle mass.
Folks
CoD is a measurement of the "dragyness" of a given frontal area. You must now apply the CoD to the actual frontal area to get net drag.
A battleship with a CoD of .2 is going to be significantly harder to push through the air than a skateboard with a CoD of .8
Absolutely, as explained here (and surprisingly the Model S still manages to beat the Nissan Leaf - which is a fair stand-in for the Bolt)
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Thinking about this further, Tesla (rightly) uses units with precise meanings in other situations:
-10/20/KW rated onboard charging for Model S
-48/72A charging capability for Model X
-UMC operational at up to 40A
-HPWC operation at up to 72/100A
-Various UMC adapters at 12/16/20/40A continuous current
Would anybody find it acceptable if those units weren't representative of the actual capability or rating of the product?
I wouldn't. If they opted to introduce the new 72A HPWC and simply call it V2 and simply round it up to 80 to match the old, I'd be upset.
Conversely the Chademo adapter is specified as providing "up to 150 miles of range per hour". So if that was actually 48kW vs 50kW, I would not care as much (provided it was actually capable of hitting that metric), as I don't feel like I was being sold something with an incorrect representation.
-10/20/KW rated onboard charging for Model S
-48/72A charging capability for Model X
-UMC operational at up to 40A
-HPWC operation at up to 72/100A
-Various UMC adapters at 12/16/20/40A continuous current
Would anybody find it acceptable if those units weren't representative of the actual capability or rating of the product?
I wouldn't. If they opted to introduce the new 72A HPWC and simply call it V2 and simply round it up to 80 to match the old, I'd be upset.
Conversely the Chademo adapter is specified as providing "up to 150 miles of range per hour". So if that was actually 48kW vs 50kW, I would not care as much (provided it was actually capable of hitting that metric), as I don't feel like I was being sold something with an incorrect representation.
@scaesare the problem is the bricking protection. Basically all EV manufacturers include the bricking protection in rated capacity. If we want to take on Tesla for this we need to take on Nissan, Chevy, Renault, etc
Case in point: With the 24 kWh electric vehicle battery (total capacity; usable battery capacity is about 21.3 kWh[33][34])
LEAF wikipedia
Case in point: With the 24 kWh electric vehicle battery (total capacity; usable battery capacity is about 21.3 kWh[33][34])
LEAF wikipedia
Don't cell manufacturers specify capacity from true 100% to completely dead, without regard for bricking?
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
Is this said tongue-in-cheek, out of ignorance, or simply trolling ?
In case it is the just lack of information, realize that the range estimate weights city and highway driving. Calculate highway to highway, consider the difference in weights, and your confusion will go away.
jgillispie
Member
Has there been testing done by other people? Does everyone's numbers match up? Any responses from Tesla?
Quite a few people have manually accounted for energy usage using the car's displays. WK's data is reported directly from the onboard BMS.
It seems the pretty much correlate to ~81kWh total (including 4kWh buffer) for the "85" pack. I know that I can't get more than that out of it.
Now what fun would that be? A rational, reasonable discussion? Boring!
Fortunately, we live in a bizarre and imperfect universe and it was that way before it became even more bizarre when Trump won -- with the help of Russia and because of an arcane, insane 18th-century idea called the Electoral College, after Hillary got 2M more votes -- but let's not nitpick! It's entertaining!
Glass houses.
Surfer boy carried a substantial majority while winning 40% of the vote. And he's busy trying to unilaterally rig the system so that he can hold a majority with even less of the vote. And then you've got Notley and Wynne... don't even get me started. The US system doesn't appear overly better or worse than ours. It's just different.Ah OK... you had said "the problem is the bricking protection"... which I took to mean addressing the problem bring brought up here.
While buffer might explain one or two specific cases, it doesn't explain the majority of cases, and hence the problem remains.
I asked about reasonable explanations.
I would not find that motivation by Tesla reasonable. Would you guys?
Frankly, it would be nice if wk057's data simply was wrong.
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