Real scare with Autosteer!

[apacheguy]

@Footbag, @BobV, can you please report your experiences as well to [email protected]?!

They are watching this thread already as I linked to it in my report to them; in my case, Tech Support Specialists responded to my email and asked for additional details - precise location, time, road conditions, etc. - to help with further diagnosis.

Shouldn't they just be able to pull up the AP data stream coming from your car? Something like that should've sent up a flag in their system.

 

[BobV]

Eh? I can't see any hard left into the left-hand lane. I can't see anything except a momentary discontinuation of linear travel with the car never leaving its lane. I even slowed the video to 1/4 speed to make sure I wasn't missing anything.

I already had my hands on the wheel as habit due to AP's initial exit-diving behavior, so the car didn't get too far over the line. That momentary discontinuity was alarming enough that I didn't have to wait for my coffee to kick in.

It is related to where the dashed line was on the hood.

Exactly.

Shouldn't they just be able to pull up the AP data stream coming from your car? Something like that should've sent up a flag in their system.

Presumably this is the kind of stuff that goes into the machine-learning feedback loop, but since this was such an abnormal and alarming behavior on a regular drive that's usually unremarkable, I figured it never hurts to call it out.

 

[gg_got_a_tesla]

Shouldn't they just be able to pull up the AP data stream coming from your car? Something like that should've sent up a flag in their system.

I got the impression that they wanted me to pinpoint the precise time, location, etc. so that they could pull up the logs from right around then. I'm not sure they have set it up to be sophisticated enough to send up a flag automatically.

 

[electrish]

@ BobV

Regarding the video, I actually had to watch it several times before I saw the sudden jerk to the left. I am actually surprised about this behavior, because in my experience the vehicle usually does the opposite and slowly drifts to the side were it loses the lines (here, the right side), almost as if it expects the lane to be wider and trying to recenter itself in the lane. Since you just passed an on-ramp and probably lost the lines on the right side, AP should have just focused on keeping the same distance to the lines on the left, which it was presumably still seeing. So lane keeping seemed to have overcompensated to the left, or it may just have been confused by the shadows and the low sun coming in from the left.

I have tried out auto-steering on several roads with poor markings on one side or just curbs and I think that AP gravitates towards these ambiguous sides and rather should focus on keeping the same distance on the side where it still has appropriate information. Supposedly, it does that, as indicated by the blue lane markings on the screen, but I think this could use improvement. Also, when passing other cars that are clearly identified via the ultrasonic sensors, AP should nudge over in the lane a little bit to stay further away from these objects. Sometimes it feels like it is actually trying to hug these other cars.

 

[Soolim]

I consistently observe AP auto-steer ping pongs on undulating road with straight lane markings. Any explanation for such behavior experienced by others?

 

[Footbag]

So I grabbed the footage from my dashcam of my incident. Unfortuanately, my dashcam seems to be acting up (may need a new SD card), as the frame rate is low and audio was missing.

(it is unlisted, so please do not share link outside this forum)

The issue happens at the 12 second mark. Given the poor frame rate, it looks a little less dramatic than it actually was. Still, it does sharply go right, and then you scan see where autopilot was overridden as the maneuver slows and the car is pointed forward again.

I had recollected that conditions were optimal, yet the car veered right. The footage shows a slightly different story. The veer to the right happened in an intersection without lines. So that is likely part of the issue. I have driven through intersections similar to this countless times now, and never had it veer hard in a direction. Sure, sometimes it hunts for lines (thus the car goes back and forth left/right a little bit) and slight manual intervention might be needed to stay on course. Even if it did want to suddenly disengage, it should have done so, but not adjusted steering like it did in this scenario. So is this entirely user error, or somewhat a fault of Autopilot... thoughts? EDIT: Ok, apparently user error!

 

[bhzmark]

"in an intersection" .!? Don't use it to drive through intersections. That is off label usage.

In this case it seems that it wanted to follow the truck. It has a strong and understandable preference to follow another moving car.

 

[Max*]

Agreed. I've had some crazy stuff happen in intersections. It's not meant to be used there...

 

[ecarfan]

I have driven through intersections similar to this countless times now, and never had it veer hard in a direction.

Tesla is very clear that AP is NOT to be used on roads with intersections.
Why are you disregarding Tesla's specific instructions about when not to use AP?

 

[benf]

So I grabbed the footage from my dashcam of my incident.

While the video looks scary, I honestly think AP did exactly what was expected (from a computer programming standpoint, not a human behavior standpoint). When AP loses both lanes, if available, it tracks the car in front of you instead of the lanes. In this case, right when you lost the lanes, it locked on to the car in front of you and then centered itself on that car. From the computer's standpoint, it's better to follow that car than potentially drive you straight off the road it can no longer see.

 

[Canuck]

Unfortunately, instructions and warnings mean little to a lot of people. Combine that with the fact that the majority of driving is on roads with intersections and we don't have a good combination. This is why AP 2.0 with more cameras and sensors is really needed and why I think and hope it will be out soon.

 

[Footbag]

While the video looks scary, I honestly think AP did exactly what was expected (from a computer programming standpoint, not a human behavior standpoint). When AP loses both lanes, if available, it tracks the car in front of you instead of the lanes. In this case, right when you lost the lanes, it locked on to the car in front of you and then centered itself on that car. From the computer's standpoint, it's better to follow that car than potentially drive you straight off the road it can no longer see.

Good point. It just goes to show the exceedingly high number of situations that need to be considered.

 

[svp6]

Tesla is very clear that AP is NOT to be used on roads with intersections.
Why are you disregarding Tesla's specific instructions about when not to use AP?

Mine steers unpredictably when there is an exit lane from the highway - left or right. I am keeping my hands on the wheel at all times, so I correct it easily. It is though disturbing how forcefully / rapidly tries to steer. At this point I do not trust the autopilot and prefer not to use it. The TACC is great and enough for what I need.

 

[bhzmark]

I trust the autosteer to stay between lanes when they are marked clearly and when they are not marked clearly, like at exits, I trust that autosteer will make a decision on which way to go and if I disagree I may have to steer the way I want to go.