I think that this thread will explain pretty much everything.
Trying to see if our CPO Roadster ideal mile range loss/CAC value decrease is real... - Page 5
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New Roadster Goodies for 2014
- Thread starter hjr
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Trying to see if our CPO Roadster ideal mile range loss/CAC value decrease is real... - Page 5
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
Fabrizio
Member
Raffy.Roma
Rome (Italy)
I don't have a Roadster now. What is the meaning of Est. Range? (I mean I know the meaning but in this particular case what does it stand for?)
Well of course they're honoring the extending warranties. That's not the same as a battery replacement option, is it? Where did anyone say anything about them not honoring extended warranties?
That's totally different than the point being made of some owners feeling Tesla owes them something after a business deal has been concluded. You're talking about a business deal in play. I know you understand that. Soooo... just looking for an argument? 'Cause on this forum, it's easy to find one.
Apropos of nothing, I don't know how many times I've seen that clip and this is the first time I've noticed they are sitting in Saarinen tulip chairs.
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djp
Model 3 Performance
Estimated range. It's the projected range based on actual energy usage over the past 40km.
chickensevil
Active Member
Raffy.Roma
Rome (Italy)
HA! I don't think people want to drive 25MPH just to go 400 miles on a single charge
Agree. Thank you for making me understand how the Roadster works. :smile:
chickensevil
Active Member
Yeah it was meant as a joke I'm sure. It is the same in the Model S with the 30/15/5 mile graphs (or whatever the km equivalents are). And someone proved the range in a real world test in Florida back when the Model S first released and got 400+ miles on a single charge. But he drove with him and his son going 30MPH the whole way. So when they say 400 it wither means ideal or rated and given the example of SF to LA they liked mean more the rated. Which should get you there if you go 65 the whole time.
Fabrizio
Member
Why wait for a 400 mile battery pack? Mine with 68,000 miles does that.
When you drive from Temecula, CA to Palm Springs, CA via CA-371/CA-74 the last 33 miles will see a drop in elevation of about 4500 feet. Doing 65 miles/hour with that elevation change, my Roadster's regenerative braking during the decent extended the estimated range to over 400 miles. This is why whenever someone asks how far I can go on a single charge I qualify my answer by explaining that I have never drained my battery to zero charge and in real usage your range is determined by how fast you drive. You can go 400 miles on a level road if you do not exceed 20 mph or you may not get to 50 miles if drive over 100 mph for an extended time.
With a larger capacity battery pack that Elon eludes to, you would be able to drive the Roadster faster for a longer time as well as extending the useful life of the battery since the battery's range would diminish over time.
strider
Active Member
Woah, hang on. My posts have been in the context of Tesla owing Roadster owners special treatment, upgrades, etc. due to the assertion that they "saved" Tesla. If you have a warranty/contract with them then of course they owe you what they've committed, full stop. And if you have to take them to court to get them to fulfill their side of the contract then that really sucks but you should absolutely do that.
My and others views on this thread are that this 400-mile pack announcement was for this exact reason. They have folks w/ battery warranties. The current cells in the Roadsters are unavailable. So they need to create a pack using newer cells. I'm no EE but it makes sense to me that it would easier to keep the same number of cells and just adjust the software to deal with the higher capacity/voltage. This also avoids the problem of triggering new crash tests if the weight changes too much.
I haven't read the thread on your car but I'm wondering if Tesla has run out of Roadster cells/packs and they're dragging their heels while they cobble together a pack with newer cells? Maybe you'll get a 400-mile pack out of the deal after all?
If someone other than Tesla considers making a Roadster battery pack (as has been suggested could be doable), I would be very interested. 24 kWh without advanced cooling system could be enough for me if the performance/cost is good.
Earlier on this thread a light weight battery has been discussed. This could make the car faster, give better handling and hopefully be much less expensive. Of course it depends on what battery and cost Tesla comes up with.
If the battery weight is reduced by 300 kg/600 pounds, the 0-100 km/h speed could be reduced by 0.9 seconds.
Car Acceleration
(assuming the calculations are correct and that the back wheels are wide enough to avoid spinning)
It is a bit extreme weight reduction right now, but perhaps not in the near future.
The 24 kWh battery pack used in the Nissan Leaf can pull 200 kW for 30 seconds according to a youtube video
My Civic EV Electric Car Project Part 14 Explaining the Batterys - YouTube
(I think it was this)
It is a cold climate where I live in Trondheim, Norway. the speed limits are low and I don't need to do fast charging, so an advanced cooling system should not be required for my usage.
I do have a Roadster that could be used as test mule, have access to some equipment/skilled people and >100 kWh of EIG cells ePLB-C020B (inside battery packs of 10 kWh each), perhaps also Nissan Leaf cells.
We repaired the PEM in my Roadster in 2011. I was the "project manager", it was the skilled people mentioned above that did the work. I know a PEM repair has been done later and reported in this forum, still I show some pictures from inside my PEM:
Dropbox - RepairPEM
Reason for repair: Car was exported and therefore not under warranty.
I don't think crash tests are required for a small series car like the Roadster.
Earlier on this thread a light weight battery has been discussed. This could make the car faster, give better handling and hopefully be much less expensive. Of course it depends on what battery and cost Tesla comes up with.
If the battery weight is reduced by 300 kg/600 pounds, the 0-100 km/h speed could be reduced by 0.9 seconds.
Car Acceleration
(assuming the calculations are correct and that the back wheels are wide enough to avoid spinning)
It is a bit extreme weight reduction right now, but perhaps not in the near future.
The 24 kWh battery pack used in the Nissan Leaf can pull 200 kW for 30 seconds according to a youtube video
My Civic EV Electric Car Project Part 14 Explaining the Batterys - YouTube
(I think it was this)
It is a cold climate where I live in Trondheim, Norway. the speed limits are low and I don't need to do fast charging, so an advanced cooling system should not be required for my usage.
I do have a Roadster that could be used as test mule, have access to some equipment/skilled people and >100 kWh of EIG cells ePLB-C020B (inside battery packs of 10 kWh each), perhaps also Nissan Leaf cells.
We repaired the PEM in my Roadster in 2011. I was the "project manager", it was the skilled people mentioned above that did the work. I know a PEM repair has been done later and reported in this forum, still I show some pictures from inside my PEM:
Dropbox - RepairPEM
Reason for repair: Car was exported and therefore not under warranty.
I don't think crash tests are required for a small series car like the Roadster.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
Agree 100%, on all counts. I've been wondering the same thing. Hard to imagine any plausible reason for a 4 week delay. I'd be livid at this point.
Roadster with 24kWh battery would only have about 45% of power and about 85% of weight == much less performance.
spaceballs
Member
Regarding power it depends on what type of batteries are used and how it's implemented, i.e. could still be 100% power output over x amount of certain time.
This is a great post and I'm glad someone else recognizes that range isn't all that important. But weight could be reduced with a minimal reductions in total energy storage just by using newer cells. Imagine a 50kwh battery which is about half the weight, provides slightly less power but the car is lighter enough that its still faster, better handling etc. I'd love to see this be available from OEM or aftermarket, but I don't see the aftermarket getting into it unfortunately. Which is why I was hoping Tesla would allow this as an option for those of us who don't want to pay 40 grand for 100 extra miles of range which almost nobody will ever use.
dhrivnak
Active Member
Are there any projections on price? With Nissan saying a new 24 kwh pack will be $6200 using an approximate ratio for a 96 kwh pack would be $24,800. It would be nice if the Tesla cost were to be a little less. 96 kwh should be close to 400 miles.
Note I believe the price includes labor and installation. And personally not sure I want to install a 1000lb battery myself anyway.
Note I believe the price includes labor and installation. And personally not sure I want to install a 1000lb battery myself anyway.
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