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New owners and early adopter owners: Do I detect a major difference?

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This is just an intuitive hunch but my reading of posts on this web site and my experience with actual owners suggests a major difference between those of us who were among the early Tesla adopters (2013) and those who came later. Motivation for buying the car and attitudes about Tesla seem to be very different. It's difficult to summarize and gross generalizations are always risky and unfair, but I do think there's a notable difference. Early adopters seem to be more grateful to have the car, less likely to complain, and more interested and supportive of other owners and the Tesla community. Newer owners seem to be more status driven, more likely to complain about service and other matters, more concerned about "luxury" appointments and the like. Of course there are always major exceptions but this is a pattern that seems to hold true.

Opinions? Let the flaming begin:)

Yes, I see this too and said this back in Sept:

Here's my analogy: When I first joined, it was a small town that had struck gold. Originally, the gold claim was small (Roadsters) and practically everyone was helpful and considerate. The old gold claim was recently exhausted but I came not for the old claim, but a new one just discovered over a hill close by (Model S). I was surrounded at that time by many old timers, and really enjoyed it here and learned a lot from them about panning for gold. It was always hoped the new gold claim would be big, but it turned out to be huge. As such, the small friendly town grew rapidly and with that rapid growth came growing pains. Crimes that were once rare or non-existent became commonplace and now there were fights at the local beer parlor almost nightly. The jail that in the past was only used infrequently (snippiness thread) had to be expanded to make room for more offenders. And those who tried to protect the old town's heritage, and in particular it cherished town square icon, were called "fanboys".

That's about where we are now so I don't know how the story ends but I guess we're going to find out.

How about timeouts for constantly disruptive folks? - Page 2
 
And now those cranky old timers are sitting on the porch, lamenting how things aren't like they used to be when the town was small and everyone knew everyone else and a representative of the benevolent mining company would come to your home to personally shoe your horses. The mine grew rapidly, and the town grew large along with it, and there was Progress! And Progress was good for humanity, even if it meant Change, and Unwashed Masses, and no more farrier service. Those who dared point out the mining company's growing pains were called "complainers."

I'll stop now. :smile:
 
And now those cranky old timers are sitting on the porch, lamenting how things aren't like they used to be when the town was small and everyone knew everyone else and a representative of the benevolent mining company would come to your home to personally shoe your horses. The mine grew rapidly, and the town grew large along with it, and there was Progress! And Progress was good for humanity, even if it meant Change, and Unwashed Masses, and no more farrier service. Those who dared point out the mining company's growing pains were called "complainers."

I'll stop now. :smile:
Build that wall! Now!
 
Early adopters seem to be more grateful to have the car, less likely to complain, and more interested and supportive of other owners and the Tesla community. Newer owners seem to be more status driven, more likely to complain about service and other matters, more concerned about "luxury" appointments and the like.

I'd say I fall partially into both categories, and that some of the characteristics of each apply to me, and some most definitely do not.

I was an early adopter of the P85D, ordering it almost immediately after the D announcement, and taking delivery in December, 2014, but I absolutely would not consider myself an early adopter.

I would not say that I am "grateful" towards Tesla for allowing me to purchase my car. I am impressed by what Tesla has accomplished, but I purchased the car with my money, and paid quite a bit for it. Tesla did not do me a favor by selling me the car. In fact my attitude is that for what I spent on the car, Tesla should be providing world-class customer service, and to date that most definitely has not happened. (I'll expand on that in a minute.) Though I'm not an early adopter, I do think that I have become extremely supportive of other users here. I came knowing nothing, wanting to learn everything I could about my car. Over time, and through the ridiculous amount of time I've spent here, I've come to learn a lot, and feel that now I need to "give back", to repay forward what was done for me when I was a newbie. I try hard to do that.

I agree that I and perhaps other newcomers like me may complain more than some of the true early adopters. In my case my feelings evolved. I heard nothing but stellar reports of Tesla service, and how easy everything would be, and how Tesla always made everything right. My first experience, like many P85D owners, was being told the six-figure car I ordered would be delivered with inferior seats, and that the better seats--the ones I had paid for--would be installed at a later date. I wasn't given a choice about this, though I guess I could have refused delivery. No timeline was given, but I think most of us expected the delay would be a few weeks to a couple of months, at the most. I, like many others, waited five months for the seats I had paid for. And when they were delivered, Tesla offered not a penny as compensation. World-class customer service? The bloom was off the rose.

I won't list all the other areas Tesla has fallen short in my eyes. I've complained about all of them in various threads. My point is that I came to Tesla as high on Tesla as a person could be. It was first-hand experiences that changed my attitude. Was I expecting too much? I don't think so. I was expecting a level of customer service commensurate with the price I had paid for my car. My expectations would have been lower if I had purchased a $30,000 Ford.

Tesla is playing in the big leagues. There is no doubt in my mind that Tesla can be hugely successful. The products are so good, and so much better than anything else out there, they've given themselves a huge head start. I think if Tesla can just learn to stop alienating customers, and figure out how to turn customers like me who have become somewhat jaded back into the Tesla evangelists we once were, there's no limit to what they can achieve.
 
I'd say I fall partially into both categories, and that some of the characteristics of each apply to me, and some most definitely do not.

I was an early adopter of the P85D, ordering it almost immediately after the D announcement, and taking delivery in December, 2014, but I absolutely would not consider myself an early adopter.

I would not say that I am "grateful" towards Tesla for allowing me to purchase my car. I am impressed by what Tesla has accomplished, but I purchased the car with my money, and paid quite a bit for it. Tesla did not do me a favor by selling me the car. In fact my attitude is that for what I spent on the car, Tesla should be providing world-class customer service, and to date that most definitely has not happened. (I'll expand on that in a minute.) Though I'm not an early adopter, I do think that I have become extremely supportive of other users here. I came knowing nothing, wanting to learn everything I could about my car. Over time, and through the ridiculous amount of time I've spent here, I've come to learn a lot, and feel that now I need to "give back", to repay forward what was done for me when I was a newbie. I try hard to do that.

I agree that I and perhaps other newcomers like me may complain more than some of the true early adopters. In my case my feelings evolved. I heard nothing but stellar reports of Tesla service, and how easy everything would be, and how Tesla always made everything right. My first experience, like many P85D owners, was being told the six-figure car I ordered would be delivered with inferior seats, and that the better seats--the ones I had paid for--would be installed at a later date. I wasn't given a choice about this, though I guess I could have refused delivery. No timeline was given, but I think most of us expected the delay would be a few weeks to a couple of months, at the most. I, like many others, waited five months for the seats I had paid for. And when they were delivered, Tesla offered not a penny as compensation. World-class customer service? The bloom was off the rose.

I won't list all the other areas Tesla has fallen short in my eyes. I've complained about all of them in various threads. My point is that I came to Tesla as high on Tesla as a person could be. It was first-hand experiences that changed my attitude. Was I expecting too much? I don't think so. I was expecting a level of customer service commensurate with the price I had paid for my car. My expectations would have been lower if I had purchased a $30,000 Ford.

Tesla is playing in the big leagues. There is no doubt in my mind that Tesla can be hugely successful. The products are so good, and so much better than anything else out there, they've given themselves a huge head start. I think if Tesla can just learn to stop alienating customers, and figure out how to turn customers like me who have become somewhat jaded back into the Tesla evangelists we once were, there's no limit to what they can achieve.

I guess I'm trying to put myself in your shoes but I'm not seeing what their is to be really upset about. Disappointed? Perhaps, but upset? Ehhh... Whatever the delay was with the seats what would the alternative have been? Waiting 5 months longer before getting your car? How were your truly inconvenienced? Having a car delivered with different seats, using them for 5 months and then getting brand new ones? I've spent time with both seats. The Next Gens might look nicer but other than better side bolsters they're hardly anything more than an aesthetic upgrade and their omission certainly doesn't ruin the car. I think there's a whole lot of very well articulated complaining about nothing in your post and again, I can certainly understand the disappointment but the bloom was off the rose? This really set you that far back? Maybe you have other stories to tell but this one, the one you chose as your example for disappointment, doesn't seem really bad at all. I've experienced worse with my BMWs.

Let me offer a slightly different perspective. I just bought a low VIN 2013 S85. I bought it from an early adopter who said he never had any issues with it. Well, as it turns out, the drive unit makes a noise at part throttle that my higher VIN S85 didn't. A tech went on a drive with me, told me it was perfectly normal and harmless and then offered to swap out the drive unit nonetheless. That's akin to me taking my M5 to BMW complaining of an injector ticking and them telling me it's totally fine but oh yeah, if you want us to replace the engine for you we'll totally do that.

In my experience Tesla has gone above and beyond to address problems that pop up. And right they should. Their future is contingent on our happiness. Anyone that owned an original iPhone can probably attest to how lax Apple used to be with their warranties. You could go in there on day 364 and tell them the phone was verbally abusing your wife and they'd scold it front of you and then proceed to replace it with a brand new one. And they needed to do this because it was new technology that people were on the fence about. So it was absolutely mission critical that people that had the iPhone love the iPhone. Now you can walk into an Apple store with your phone spitting flames out the lightning port and they'll tell you to make a genius bar appointment to get it looked at next week only to then offer to fix it for your first born and $600.

The point is, Tesla is in that early stage where they're fixing problems no matter how trivial. Let's not confuse the growing pains of a company making their first car with straight up incompetence or intentional unwillingness to help the customer. This is a company that made their first car arguably the safest car on the market and one of the best overall cars in the world. When you look at companies like Fisker and just how wrong things can go so easily, it is absolutely mind blowing that Tesla didn't only just put out an acceptable car as their first offering but a critically acclaimed vehicle.

Keeping all this in mind? I guess I don't get why you'd get too bent out of shape over seats that arrived 5 months late, especially when you had full use of your car.
 
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I couldn't possibly disagree more with this sentence. If you think it's just a car then you are totally missing the point. A BMW is just a car, a Porsche is just a car, so is a Ford, and so on and so forth...

Jeff
you are correct they are all just cars, the only difference between a tesla and those gas cars is the source of energy for propulsion. if some of you want to wave the enviro banner great, many of us aren't as zealous about the "cause" and some people just bought a tesla in order to have the "coolest" gadget on the road.

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I'm gonna get flamed for taking on the Great Bonnie (much respect): I'm sure you're downplaying the guy's behavior but this comes across as quite condescending and unlike the Bonnie I've seen on here for years. As I say of everything in life, "it's all relative". Devil's advocate.... Would Steve Jurvetson call you an early adopter by your metric above? I hope he would.
I think elitist covers it
 
That's disappointing, although not surprising, to hear about the "D" event behavior.

My wife considers me to be an early adopter, and I do consider myself to be that when it comes to the Model S, but I'm not one to consider myself special because of that. (Although I do grin when I see an IL electric plate that is far higher than mine!) I think there is an important difference between those two types of people. And, yes, being "early" is relative.

I used to wave to Tesla owners on the street or strike up conversations at the SC. I don't anymore because I'm not sensing the community as much. It's different on TMC, but out in the wild - even in Chicago where Teslas aren't a dime a dozen (like SoCal) - either people think it's just another performance sedan or don't care to connect.
 
Well since we've already started with calling people complainers, status-driven, nerds, sycophants ... I think it probably won't fizzle. But I'd love to be wrong!

I have noticed some people (not thinking of anyone in particular at the moment I'm terrible with names) who seem to have sort of an entitlement attitude. I have seen some people rant about what I consider rather minor flaws or compare the Model S creature comports unfavorably with other $100K cars. I think a fair number of these people are fairly recent buyers and are used to very expensive cars.

I'm not a Tesla owner yet, but I plan to be one of those new owners one of these days. But I'm not into feelings of entitlement. I probably will be a bit more concerned about keeping it looking nice because it's going to cost 5X what my last new car cost me. But if some misfortune like a door ding or something happens, I'll be miffed initially, but it's the hazards of owning a car, regardless of the price.

As for tech adoption, that's a different thing. I'm an engineer and programmer by profession, but I'm not an uber techno geek. I have very few of the newest gadgets and even though I have 6 operational computers in the house, none have an OS newer than Windows 7 and I only went to that reluctantly.

I prefer to be a bit behind the cutting edge of new technologies because I don't like being the final beta tester for new products. I have to deal with alpha and beta stuff with work all the time, I don't want to do it in my spare time too. I like to have a life outside of work.

Back to the point... Whenever you're talking about any population of people, almost any statement about that group that has "all" or implies "all" is almost certainly wrong. People vary too much. Different populations have different characteristics, if you're talking about a certain ethnic group you can't say all of them like spicy food, but you might find more people in that group like spicy food than some other ethnic group you compare them to.

I have noticed the early Tesla owners seem to be more Zen about problems with their car and tend to express happiness that they have had a wonderful car for a few years now and newer owners tend more towards entitlement thinking. However there are always exceptions in both camps and people in both camps that don't fit either attitude too. Just my anecdotal observation of the trends in the population.
 
I have noticed some people (not thinking of anyone in particular at the moment I'm terrible with names) who seem to have sort of an entitlement attitude. I have seen some people rant about what I consider rather minor flaws or compare the Model S creature comports unfavorably with other $100K cars. I think a fair number of these people are fairly recent buyers and are used to very expensive cars.

I'm not a Tesla owner yet, but I plan to be one of those new owners one of these days. But I'm not into feelings of entitlement. I probably will be a bit more concerned about keeping it looking nice because it's going to cost 5X what my last new car cost me. But if some misfortune like a door ding or something happens, I'll be miffed initially, but it's the hazards of owning a car, regardless of the price.
For me those are just reasonable expectations and not some kind of entitlement. When I'm paying premium price for a good or service then I also expect quality in return. Doesn't matter if that's a nice hotel compared to a model, riding first class vs. 2nd class or just buying groceries e.g. some fresh meat from the butcher and not the freezer at a supermarket.

If I'm at a nice restaurant where I pay 5x as more as your average restaurants around the corner, then I expect top quality food and perfect service. Sure every waiter makes mistakes and cooks are humans, too, but if something goes wrong then I also expect them to take car of it and still make it a pleasant experience for more.
 
I guess I'm trying to put myself in your shoes but I'm not seeing what their is to be really upset about. Disappointed? Perhaps, but upset? Ehhh... Whatever the delay was with the seats what would the alternative have been? Waiting 5 months longer before getting your car? How were your truly inconvenienced? Having a car delivered with different seats, using them for 5 months and then getting brand new ones? I've spent time with both seats. The Next Gens might look nicer but other than better side bolsters they're hardly anything more than an aesthetic upgrade and their omission certainly doesn't ruin the car. I think there's a whole lot of very well articulated complaining about nothing in your post and again, I can certainly understand the disappointment but the bloom was off the rose? This really set you that far back? Maybe you have other stories to tell but this one, the one you chose as your example for disappointment, doesn't seem really bad at all. I've experienced worse with my BMWs.

Let me offer a slightly different perspective. I just bought a low VIN 2013 S85. I bought it from an early adopter who said he never had any issues with it. Well, as it turns out, the drive unit makes a noise at part throttle that my higher VIN S85 didn't. A tech went on a drive with me, told me it was perfectly normal and harmless and then offered to swap out the drive unit nonetheless. That's akin to me taking my M5 to BMW complaining of an injector ticking and them telling me it's totally fine but oh yeah, if you want us to replace the engine for you we'll totally do that.

In my experience Tesla has gone above and beyond to address problems that pop up. And right they should. Their future is contingent on our happiness. Anyone that owned an original iPhone can probably attest to how lax Apple used to be with their warranties. You could go in there on day 364 and tell them the phone was verbally abusing your wife and they'd scold it front of you and then proceed to replace it with a brand new one. And they needed to do this because it was new technology that people were on the fence about. So it was absolutely mission critical that people that had the iPhone love the iPhone. Now you can walk into an Apple store with your phone spitting flames out the lightning port and they'll tell you to make a genius bar appointment to get it looked at next week only to then offer to fix it for your first born and $600.

The point is, Tesla is in that early stage where they're fixing problems no matter how trivial. Let's not confuse the growing pains of a company making their first car with straight up incompetence or intentional unwillingness to help the customer. This is a company that made their first car arguably the safest car on the market and one of the best overall cars in the world. When you look at companies like Fisker and just how wrong things can go so easily, it is absolutely mind blowing that Tesla didn't only just put out an acceptable car as their first offering but a critically acclaimed vehicle.

Keeping all this in mind? I guess I don't get why you'd get too bent out of shape over seats that arrived 5 months late, especially when you had full use of your car.

In and of itself the seat issue was not that big of a deal, and if it were the only issue I've experienced I expect I'd still be a dyed-in-the-wool Tesla evangelist. But just to elaborate a bit on why the seat issue bothered me, I felt like Tesla was displaying an attitude of not caring about me as a brand new customer. They had fallen short. Agreed--not all that short--but short. My car was not delivered as ordered. They should have done something - ANYTHING - some small gesture - to acknowledge that the mistake was theirs, that they were sorry, and that they valued my business. At the time there were lots of small gestures Tesla could make being discussed in various threads. Ideas ranged from some small credit in the Tesla store to short extensions of the warranty, etc. No one was asking for or expecting anything significant, because we all, for the most part, agreed, as you point out, that the inconvenience was not great. We were just looking for a gesture that was never made.

I don't want to turn this thread into a debate on all the negative issues of the past several months. But you talk about Tesla going "above and beyond" while that has not been my experience. So I will just list briefly some of the other issues. Again, I do not want to get into a major discussion of any of them, and one of them I'm not going to type another word about in this thread after this, as there are PLENTY of other threads discussing the topic. (I'll place an asterisk by that one, in case anyone has any difficulty figuring out which one I'm talking about. :) )

--Efficiency issues - My car is not as efficient as it was advertised as being. Also, when originally delivered, it had no Torque Sleep functionality at all, so was actually significantly less efficient than it is now, yet Tesla did not explain this at all until some time later, at which point they acknowledged that Torque Sleep would be available soon. It made me wonder what kind of company delivers less than their customers have paid for but says nothing, in the hopes the customers won't notice. The answer was not the kind of company I had heard and believed Tesla was.

--Center console issue--I had planned to purchase the obeche matte center console from the time I ordered my car. For months it was shown as "coming soon" in the Tesla Store, and I was on the waiting list. The date I'd be able to get it kept getting pushed back. Then eventually Tesla decided they would not produce it at all, leaving me without an option for a Tesla Center Console that actually matched my trim.

--Ranger / Valet issue--Before purchasing my car I was told I'd have ranger service come to me at no charge (or at most a $100 charge at times) and that if the ranger service could not provide the needed service my car would be valeted to a service center and a loaner car provided and that there would be no charge for this. Living more than 200 miles from the nearest service center this information was material in my decision to purchase a car that could not be serviced anywhere else. Now Tesla is saying that valet service will cost $3.00 per one-way mile, which would cost me more than $600 any time my car needs service. The fee has been waived once, but it's not clear what the future holds. My position is that Tesla can change their policy going forward, for new customers, if they must, but that promises made to existing customers, that the existing customers made purchase decisions based on, should be honored.

--691 HP issue *

--Delayed Auto-Pilot issue--The auto-steer beta works very well. But it was demo'd more than a year before it was released, and talked about at the D presentation in the present tense. Tesla botched the expectations-setting big-time.

There are other issues as well, but I think the above are enough to demonstrate why my feelings towards Tesla have changed. Believe it or not, they could still change back, but for that to happen will take some work and some changes on Tesla's part.
 
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The comment from Andyw2100 highlights the differences between old and new car makers as well as tech and non-tech companies.
Maybe that is the source of different attitudes of customers?

If GM/Nissan etc made the Model S it probably would not have been released yet or if it had been released, the first 2014 Model S would be RWD with no autopilot but they may have revealed a concept that could have these features.
We wouldn't know about the next model, but the 2016 Model S would be rumored.
The firmware updates would be chargeable upgrades and all work would be done by local dealers.
We certainly wouldn't see hardware released to production that didn't have working software (like autopilot).

Tesla behave much more like a tech company, they announce way too early & always deliver late, find public beta releases acceptable, usually underestimate the customer impact.
We see more of "thats not working, change it on the fly", combined with changes that need to be re-changed on the fly based on feedback.
They have a platform where they have flexibility to treat hardware and software independently that can be OTA updated, and they leverage as part of the deployment model.

They are two radically different models with radically different customer expectation profiles. Its no wonder we are seeing different reactions :)
 
The comment from Andyw2100 highlights the differences between old and new car makers as well as tech and non-tech companies.
Maybe that is the source of different attitudes of customers?

If GM/Nissan etc made the Model S it probably would not have been released yet or if it had been released, the first 2014 Model S would be RWD with no autopilot but they may have revealed a concept that could have these features.
We wouldn't know about the next model, but the 2016 Model S would be rumored.
The firmware updates would be chargeable upgrades and all work would be done by local dealers.
We certainly wouldn't see hardware released to production that didn't have working software (like autopilot).

Tesla behave much more like a tech company, they announce way too early & always deliver late, find public beta releases acceptable, usually underestimate the customer impact.
We see more of "thats not working, change it on the fly", combined with changes that need to be re-changed on the fly based on feedback.
They have a platform where they have flexibility to treat hardware and software independently that can be OTA updated, and they leverage as part of the deployment model.

They are two radically different models with radically different customer expectation profiles. Its no wonder we are seeing different reactions :)

I don't get the highlighted mentality, you're conflating two separate issues.

Tesla (a tech company) went into the car maker business, selling cars, promising to remove all the negativity of buying a car, as such should not add more problems.

Tesla broke the car manufacturer mold, but that doesn't mean they need to destroy the tried and true approaches of delivering a working product.


Let's say, me as an engineer, decided I want to quit my job and become a professional photographer. I start charging my clients for photo shoots. Should I be given a break because I'm an engineer and not a photographer? But I'm charging people for my photography work... see the issue?
 
The comment from Andyw2100 highlights the differences between old and new car makers as well as tech and non-tech companies.
Maybe that is the source of different attitudes of customers?

If GM/Nissan etc made the Model S it probably would not have been released yet or if it had been released, the first 2014 Model S would be RWD with no autopilot but they may have revealed a concept that could have these features.
We wouldn't know about the next model, but the 2016 Model S would be rumored.
The firmware updates would be chargeable upgrades and all work would be done by local dealers.
We certainly wouldn't see hardware released to production that didn't have working software (like autopilot).

Tesla behave much more like a tech company, they announce way too early & always deliver late, find public beta releases acceptable, usually underestimate the customer impact.
We see more of "thats not working, change it on the fly", combined with changes that need to be re-changed on the fly based on feedback.
They have a platform where they have flexibility to treat hardware and software independently that can be OTA updated, and they leverage as part of the deployment model.

They are two radically different models with radically different customer expectation profiles. Its no wonder we are seeing different reactions :)

I agree with this.

I would add that there are easy and essentially free things Tesla could do to allow themselves the flexibility of behaving like a tech company, without disappointing customers that are expecting a more traditional approach. And that is --COMMUNICATE--!

A perfect example is what Tesla did (or more accurately didn't do) when they delivered the first P85Ds.

Tesla had missed on Torque Sleep. It wasn't ready yet, so they delivered the cars without it. Not a big deal, in the big picture. But why say nothing about it, hope your customers don't notice, and leave them all wondering why their cars are much less efficient than they were supposed to be? Why not simply communicate, at delivery time, "We're still perfecting Torque Sleep, and it will be available in about two months, via our industry-leading over-the-air firmware update system."

Good communication goes a long way towards making things better. Poor communication just makes things worse.
 
We received our Tesla in May 2014. VIN a little over 40,000. Anyway, here in California the DMV issues license plates sequentially in ascending NLLLNNN order. The earliest purchasers received license plates with a "6" as the initial digit followed by the three letter sequence at the tail end of the alphabet. The plates kicked into the "7" series around April 2013, and our car's plate is 7FRS---. Cars purchased in the last month or so of 2015 now are receiving plates with the 7N sequence. So, it is pretty easy to extrapolate how long a driver has owned his Tesla in California by the license plate.

I have Supercharged about 150 times in 18 months, mostly around the state, but also on some road trips out-of-state. Early in my ownership, owners that I encountered at the California Superchargers were enthusiastic about their car and wanted to talk. I thought it was a great way to meet new people, share stories and ideas, and just while away the time. I met some really neat people--perhaps one or two of you! I have noticed that recently with the explosion of Teslas here, the newer owners (based upon license plate) don't even bother to acknowledge anyone else. They stay locked in their car or plug in and vamoose. No smiles or waves or nods or anything! Yet the "earlier" owners still have that camaraderie. Maybe this is coincidental, but most of the newer owners appeared to be 30-45, while 18 months ago most appeared slightly to much older. I am 62.

Curiously at Superchargers away from California, it is like old times when I met fellow owners, regardless of age.

Tesla owners in California are such a**holes! lol... just kidding... I live in Arizona and we all wave at each other, flash our lights, etc. I noticed that in California, people don't do that. And you're right, I saw a lot of people just sitting in their cars not wanting to interact with anyone. I walked up to a few people as they plugged in to try and strike up a conversation, but they looked at me like I came from Mars or something. Very stand-offish and not what I'm accustomed to here in Arizona, where we have meet-ups and treat each other as if we are members of the same family.

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I agree with this.

I would add that there are easy and essentially free things Tesla could do to allow themselves the flexibility of behaving like a tech company, without disappointing customers that are expecting a more traditional approach. And that is --COMMUNICATE--!

A perfect example is what Tesla did (or more accurately didn't do) when they delivered the first P85Ds.

Tesla had missed on Torque Sleep. It wasn't ready yet, so they delivered the cars without it. Not a big deal, in the big picture. But why say nothing about it, hope your customers don't notice, and leave them all wondering why their cars are much less efficient than they were supposed to be? Why not simply communicate, at delivery time, "We're still perfecting Torque Sleep, and it will be available in about two months, via our industry-leading over-the-air firmware update system."

Good communication goes a long way towards making things better. Poor communication just makes things worse.

... and no communication is better than poor communication, in my opinion. Perhaps that's why Tesla has been so quiet the last few months. The less Elon opens his mouth sometimes, the better. I notice that he has been doing that a lot less in the last 3-4 months. I actually notice when Musk has not said something for a while because he used to be so free-flowing before.

I just checked Tesla's Corporate Director page. Does anyone else find it curious that there are only two people on that page, JB and Elon, when previously there used to be 4-5 people mentioned on that page in years prior?

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