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My experience taking Tesla to court about FSD
- Thread starter edb49
- Start date
shahryaran
Member
Lol
Don't worry. Once you got your money back, you'll go ahead and buy it again.
Don't worry. Once you got your money back, you'll go ahead and buy it again.
ACarneiro
Active Member
If he wants to, he will.
The key is that he now knows what product (or the promise thereof) he is buying and how likely he is (or not) to actually get it in a reasonable time frame.
I am not entirely clear as to the intent of your post, if I’m honest.
Nobody in their right mind would buy FSD in its current state here.
*maybe* it becomes better in the future. If it does, then it becomes worth it. Until then, promises and 'coming soon' don't mean squat.
*maybe* it becomes better in the future. If it does, then it becomes worth it. Until then, promises and 'coming soon' don't mean squat.
Indeed. Even the claims that it would get more expensive over time and cost $100k in the end was just a scare tactic to get more sales before the price increases come. Now they've got it working quite well in the US they've been reducing the price to get more sales.
Same thing really, just they don't need the money as much as they need the training data having more cars using FSD brings. The free 1 month trial also both helps get more data and also hopefully convince more to shell out for it.
I agree though. In this case it's not about more revenue but more cars using it to speed up development.
Billbrown1982
TM3 LR 2021 | Red | FSD
Screw it. I'm gonna go for this. Knock my car down to EAP and should be due about £3400 plus interest. Just gonna have to scroll back to page 1 and start making notes 
shahryaran
Member
He/she can't use it, that's the point.
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You’re in the uk subforum and the implementation here (and everywhere except North America) is very different to that in the US. We get just about nothing different to what comes with EAP, and EAP today does even less than it did 6 years ago on cars without parking sensors. Tesla should not sell expensive options with the promise of “coming soon” when the timescales are measured in multiple numbers of years, for many that’s fraud and the courts are now of the opinion that it was at least mis-sold and are making Tesla refund the money.
Comments such as yours aren’t really helpful, they simply reflect a lack of understanding.
Probably not no as you have no direct contract/relationship with Tesla so it’s unclear what law you’d rely on to make your case.
Your contract is with whoever you bought the car from ultimately.
No idea why you got "disagreed" when you're stating plain facts.. hey ho.
Even EAP/FSD with parking sensors does less than it did several years ago. It got a significant downgrade back in 2019, and has had several more regressions since then due to regulations. I've seen no evidence to suggest it is moving in any positive, less restrictive direction here in Europe. It has not improved in any measurable way in the 4 years I've had mine, and no amount of "wait for single stack", "Dojo changes everything", etc cheerleading alters that fact.
Hokay. So, I’m on the other side of the pond, running the FSDS 12.3.6 package, and the car’s running around the landscape doing a pretty decent job driving through whatever the local DMVs and other drivers throw at it. In fact, tomorrow I’m planning on driving a couple hundred miles for a relative visit north of here. And back a few days later.
So, in terms of existence, Tesla is selling FSDS cars. FWIW, I assisted a family friend in her ordering of a MY, including some test drives. And she states that once the first three months of the referral FSDS trial expires, she’s planning on purchasing the package. Price drop, I guess. And I did warn her that it still makes errors, just rarely, now.
But you guys are all acting like the restrictions on FSDS in GB is some kind of malicious choice on Tesla’s part, where they offer you all this wonderful package, take your money, then fail to deliver. As if it was true vaporware. Which it isn’t.
My understanding was that delivery of FSDS in GB was a matter of government denial of the use of the package. Is that the case? Or does the reported reason have to do with driving on the left?
Musk/Tesla haven’t met the current regulations very well let alone negotistes with regulators about extended ones. The x times safer than humans also doesn’t wash over here because our regulations already make our roads multiple times safer than US roads.
But back to the point, if Tesla know the regulations don’t allow it, why sell it with the promise of it coming soon? We’re not experts in the law or what’s happening, or at least we shouldn’t have to be, yet we seem to understand it more than a company selling the product that needs to comply with the law. And when a date is set with a judge to decide, Tesla payout on the condition that people don’t disclose their settlement, so they know they’d lose, but they’ll still take other peoples money. If you think that’s the actions of a good company, you’ve a different perspective to us over here
The issue isn't that it isn't a capable system. If we had FSD Beta or even anything approaching it here in Europe I would be perfectly happy with what I paid 4 years ago and this thread would be irrelevant to me (and I suspect others).
The issue is that Tesla have been selling "Full Self-Driving" as an option here, and in Europe, for several years, knowing full well that it was impossible to deliver. You are correct that it is UNECE regulations that are ultimately preventing it being deployed, but Tesla knew that already. They are arguably the closest and most informed party to the decision making, and how fast (or not) it is relaxing. Despite knowing they could not deliver FSD Beta in these markets in any reasonable period of time, they have continued to sell it, at full price, hiding behind an "Upcoming" clause.
When I bought my M3P back in 2020 Tesla sold FSD to me as "Coming later this year". The website explicitly used those words. It also included a video that has since been stated (by a Tesla employee no less) to have been simulated.
With the greatest of respect I think anyone in the States isn't really in a position to comment on this thread, because everything you've got over there is basically everything Tesla is capable of delivering, without restraint or restriction. In fact the only thing I can think of where you guys actually lag behind Europe is in "adaptive headlights", but it took over 3 years after they started fitting the hardware for Tesla to even deliver that to us.
Tesla shouldn't be selling FSD (the option) in Europe. I'd argue that given how badly Summon is gimped, even EAP is a stretch. They ought to just sell a Europe-specific "Advanced Autopilot" option which does Navigate on Autopilot, because everything else is either useless, doesn't work at all (if you have a non-USS car) or doesn't exist (FSDb)
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That's exactly what it is. Yes the regulations stop it but it's not like Tesla doesn't know those regulations exist. They are still happy to take peoples money in the UK and they do then fail to deliver it.
Even when the regulations change, doesn't mean Tesla will instantly bring it to the UK. Our roads are quite different to what you have in the US, add to the fact that we drive on the other side of the road. It's vapourware until they have a product they can and do deliver in the UK.
That is a very accurate and succinct summary of the issue.
I assume that you are referring to me since at the moment I am the only dissenting comment.
Most of the US law is based on UK law. In the US you can absolutely have a claim against a manufacturer without being the first hand owner. In fact you can without being any owner: for example if you borrow a product or are injured by someone else. You can even have a claim against the supplier of a manufacturer.
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