FW updates OTA vs WiFi?

[NigelM]

Back when I worked for a major bank we'd distribute firmware to remote branches via usb for updating ATMs that still had dial up modems. Numerous safeguards existed and it never was a problem.

The car has connectivity. If a usb update is attempted the car can phone home to ensure the update is valid before proceeding. Any evidence of tampering would cause it to abort and fail.

Distributing files via usb internally in a company = no problem.
Distributing FW that controls a Model S = hack risk and/or reverse engineering risk.

So, you're also suggesting that if an update was via usb then it could not take place unless the car had a 3G signal? The point up-thread was that people needed a usb update as in some circumstances (such as your garages etc) they couldn't get a 3G signal.

I'll still bet you a cup-holder it doesn't happen.

 

[brianman]

(A) Back when I worked for a major bank we'd distribute firmware to remote branches via usb for updating ATMs that still had dial up modems. Numerous safeguards existed and it never was a problem.

(B) The car has connectivity. If a usb update is attempted the car can phone home to ensure the update is valid before proceeding. Any evidence of tampering would cause it to abort and fail.

(A) I've watched tech talks about how easy it is to hack those ATMs because of the USB ports and the phones in them.
(B) You're assuming that people will only try to hack the USB key when connected to the car. I don't for one second agree with this assumption.

 

[Klaus]

The car has connectivity. If a usb update is attempted the car can phone home to ensure the update is valid before proceeding. Any evidence of tampering would cause it to abort and fail.

We all know how well such a system of "phoning home" to validate update files has worked out for Apple's mobile devices being unable to be hacked - NOT. Now all we need to do is assume that Tesla's engineers are much more versed in security ...

I think you're smoking wishful thinking ...

 

[techMology]

I'm not disappointed. I just think it's silly. Not everybody has access to WiFi in their garage.

100% agree. I have a standalone garage away from my house. WiFi doesn't reach there. Now I'm most likely going to install an AP there. I'm lucky enough that I have the option (but it will require a very long Ethernet run!

 

[brianman]

100% agree. I have a standalone garage away from my house. WiFi doesn't reach there. Now I'm most likely going to install an AP there. I'm lucky enough that I have the option (but it will require a very long Ethernet run!

Proof that OCD thrives @ TMC.com -- gotta have my updates as fast as electronically possible.

 

[techMology]

Prefer that OCD thrives @ TMC.com -- gotta have my updates as fast as electronically possible.

Well, when you drive a Spaceship, you expect updates to be delivered as fast as possible.

 

[montgom626]

baseless speculation that TM will start charging for 3G

Does exist, V5.0 firmware just happened.
On other hand, I welcome the WiFi addition because I've got better WiFi coverage in my garage than I do 3G (or 4G for that matter).

I know 5.0 exists. I am referring to rampant paranoia that TM will charge for 3G. We all welcome WiFi. I do not welcome the ongoing baseless speculation that TM will start charging for 3G as there is not one shred of evidence that TM is going to charge for 3G.

 

[brianman]

I know 5.0 exists. I am referring to rampant paranoia that TM will charge for 3G. We all welcome WiFi. I do not welcome the ongoing baseless speculation that TM will start charging for 3G as there is not one shred of evidence that TM is going to charge for 3G.

We're a bit off-topic, but there is some evidence. There was a leaked(?) pricing plan a bit back.

 

[dsm363]

I know 5.0 exists. I am referring to rampant paranoia that TM will charge for 3G. We all welcome WiFi. I do not welcome the ongoing baseless speculation that TM will start charging for 3G as there is not one shred of evidence that TM is going to charge for 3G.

What do you mean by 3G? Basic telematics and software updates? If so then you are right. If you are talking about Slacker, web browser.....etc then they have said for over a year that there will be a charge for connectivity.

 

[Rodolfo Paiz]

100% agree. I have a standalone garage away from my house. WiFi doesn't reach there. Now I'm most likely going to install an AP there. I'm lucky enough that I have the option (but it will require a very long Ethernet run!

Not necessarily. There's plenty of solutions which will allow you to use directional (eg yagi) antennae to link your house with your garage. Just a thought.

 

[WeazL]

One would think that with WiFi now fully functional that updates would deploy nearly immediately for those with WiFi active. My MS has a connection anytime it is home, yet I'm still waiting for 5.9. I understand that with rollouts, large companies stagger delivery to devices to prevent servers from overloading--but that's when there's an enormous audience receiving the data. At this point we're talking about a relatively small volume of downloads in comparison to something such as a Windows/Mac OS update.

 

[Todd Burch]

One would think that with WiFi now fully functional that updates would deploy nearly immediately for those with WiFi active. My MS has a connection anytime it is home, yet I'm still waiting for 5.9. I understand that with rollouts, large companies stagger delivery to devices to prevent servers from overloading--but that's when there's an enormous audience receiving the data. At this point we're talking about a relatively small volume of downloads in comparison to something such as a Windows/Mac OS update.

WeazL, with the risk of inconveniencing a large number of customers with a fast rollout, they still want to roll it out somewhat slowly. Now that most use Wi-Fi, bandwidth isn't the issue. But remember that lots of different cars out there have different hardware configurations. Tesla still wants to catch issues with a certain hardware configuration before it's rolled out to the entire fleet, so the updates start out relatively slowly.

 

[einTier]

My car is on wi-fi every night and still waiting on 5.9.

 

[Kraken]

I've said this before, but it is possible it is being blocked somewhere in your network by a firewall or a setting on the modem. It is possible it isn't tesla... Although it might be.

 

[WeazL]

Thanks for your input, Todd & Kraken. Todd, good point.

 

[scaesare]

I've said this before, but it is possible it is being blocked somewhere in your network by a firewall or a setting on the modem. It is possible it isn't tesla... Although it might be.

If you can remotely get to the car via the smartphone app while it's connected to your WiFi infrastructure, it's not being blocked anywhere.... that connection is via the encrypted tunnel from your S to the Tesla Mothership...

 

[Rodolfo Paiz]

Updates do -- and should IMHO -- roll out slowly. I'd rather have a slower rollout than a broken car.

And for those who are still waiting, it does appear to be rolling out slowly. My car is also on WiFi and just got the update last night.