The direct cable would be the sane choice because with a can adapter you'd need both the adapter and a Mennekes-Mennekes cable. A Mennekes-Tesla cable makes so much more sense.
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The direct cable would be the sane choice because with a can adapter you'd need both the adapter and a Mennekes-Mennekes cable. A Mennekes-Tesla cable makes so much more sense.
felixtb
RsEU502,Sp+14274,XpEUSig4
sorry for the late reply. and thanks for the clarification. when will you clarify these more specific issues and options with the eu version compared to the us version of the model s?
It's going to be a different proprietary plug I imagine. This is a long video but the guy in it is the Tesla engineer whose job it is to design the plug. Apparently he wasn't finished with the design at the time the video was shot.
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/11636-Stanford-Seminar-Dave-Duff-Tesla-Motors
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/11636-Stanford-Seminar-Dave-Duff-Tesla-Motors
Norwegian pages on teslamotors.com is now updated and the text saying upgraded wheels are included in perf-package is now gone. So no 21" wheels for us who made a reservation well ahead of the price increase.
Gotta say im really disapointed and feel the 1700€ "rebate" is more or less an insult and poorly executed marketing spin now. Performance package is a much more expensive deal in europe than in the US. Price is higher and includes less options....
Woopdidoo:crying:
Gotta say im really disapointed and feel the 1700€ "rebate" is more or less an insult and poorly executed marketing spin now. Performance package is a much more expensive deal in europe than in the US. Price is higher and includes less options....
Woopdidoo:crying:
Taxes are a percentage, not a fixed price. Proportionately the difference between the prices of the 85kWh Standard and Performance is exactly the same in both countries.
It's a shame about the 21" wheels though.
I dont know why you mention taxes here. Prices in us and norway is without any taxes that i know of!?
At this moment in time the perf in the us inludes 3500$ worth of wheels that we dont get here. So the deal is definately worse here. That is in addition to the car beeing more expensive in the first place. The latter was expected though.
I'm not saying it's not a worse deal, but compared to the standard model the upgrade cost isn't any more than the US. In Norway, the Performance model is 117% the price of the Standard model, and it's 121% in the US. So the Norway pricing is actually slightly cheaper. That 4% difference happens to be kr. 20,000, which is almost the same cost as the 21" wheels
Correct me if I'm wrong though.edit: This only works if the federal tax credit is taken into account. It might just be a coincidence.
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Might be true. Havent done a similar check myself. All I know is that I wont finalize anything until all relevant info is released. I simply dont trust the info so far seeing that they only use google translate when publishing new info here.I'm not saying it's not a worse deal, but compared to the standard model the upgrade cost isn't any more than the US. In Norway, the Performance model is 117% the price of the Standard model, and it's 121% in the US. So the Norway pricing is actually slightly cheaper. That 4% difference happens to be kr. 20,000, which is almost the same cost as the 21" wheels
We also dont have any details on warranty, servicing, battery replacement, winterwheels(infopage mentions allseason tires which I dont know if is even legal here. Most likely google translate), superchargers and other things that are important for me.
The price itself is something I could live with. I could even pay more if it had some of the missing equipment I want. But right now I've gone from counting the seconds to delivery to thinking I might just risk waiting for Model S2.0 or the X. I simply dont like being treated this way. Other companies I have bough cars from have added extras or reduced pricing when dealing with delays, not removing extras and increasing price.
But enough of my whining here. I believe I have expressed my feelings for now. At least I wont be a "salesman" for Tesla in the future like I have been for a long period now. I have personally talked 4colleagues into looking into or actually making reservations, and will be sure to let them know what to expect now. I refuse to be the bad guy if they dont get what they originall wanted.
Laumb
smrtass.
Check out "Markedsføringsloven". Something there might give you the possibility of getting the free wheels anyway, since they advertised them as included at the time you agreed to reserve the car.
I saw Tesla has some disclaimer for these things - but In Norway you cannot agree yourself away from the benefits of the law. It would be breaking the law.
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Tapatalkin' from iTalatut.
I saw Tesla has some disclaimer for these things - but In Norway you cannot agree yourself away from the benefits of the law. It would be breaking the law.
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Tapatalkin' from iTalatut.
I don't think one can force Tesla to include the wheels, as long as it is a reservation, not a purchase agreement.
If the reservation holder doesn't like the final purchase agreement, they can just say no and get the reservation amount returned. (Maybe one could demand interest on the reservation amount, though. But it wouldn't be worth pursuing, I would think.)
I belive it is wise that Tesla does not include 21" wheels with the P.
Instead they have lowered the base price of the performance and made it optional to have (or not) the 21" wheels.
the price difference bewteen a 85 and a P85 is lower now - expecially if you already did plan the active air and leather. making it almost a bargian
stop crying and be realistic, there is no such thing as free lunch. if the 21" was included, whey would simply have a higher starting price sticker - now we can enjoy the lower sticker price of a P85 than otherwhise posible.
Instead they have lowered the base price of the performance and made it optional to have (or not) the 21" wheels.
the price difference bewteen a 85 and a P85 is lower now - expecially if you already did plan the active air and leather. making it almost a bargian
stop crying and be realistic, there is no such thing as free lunch. if the 21" was included, whey would simply have a higher starting price sticker - now we can enjoy the lower sticker price of a P85 than otherwhise posible.
EcoHeliGuy
Member
+1 I get tired of reading what people believe they are in titled too.
Tesla states the terms, we decided to sign the bottom line. Your deposits is nothing more then a place holder. We lend $5000 (or $40000) to have the option to get the car first when available in our area. That's it, there was no option pricing when you placed your deposit, and tesla never stated production for world makets would start in june 2012. No car maker offers the same features, pricing or even models in all markets.
Don't blame Tesla for sticker shock if you had been previously configuring you dream on non relevant US market information. You wouldn't buy a house in Maine, or Norway based on Vancouvers housing market.
Laumb
smrtass.
I'm not getting a P, so for me its "whatever", Im getting a 60kwh.
But the fact is Tesla shouldn't had Communicated it on the norwegian (and others?) pages In the first place. Thats where I think "Markedsføringsloven" might come In.
I remember a company offered a laptop for 8000NOK (over $1000) below their own buy price. The people who reserved it (wasn't ready for delivery at the moment) got it settled In court. Nobody got the computers, but they all got money they never paid back from the company.
Norwegian law is VERY customer friendly.
My point being, as I don't want to see Tesla hurt financially In any way, Tesla should really make absolutely sure they communicate all information absolutely correct and precise.
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Tapatalkin' from iTalatut.
But the fact is Tesla shouldn't had Communicated it on the norwegian (and others?) pages In the first place. Thats where I think "Markedsføringsloven" might come In.
I remember a company offered a laptop for 8000NOK (over $1000) below their own buy price. The people who reserved it (wasn't ready for delivery at the moment) got it settled In court. Nobody got the computers, but they all got money they never paid back from the company.
Norwegian law is VERY customer friendly.
My point being, as I don't want to see Tesla hurt financially In any way, Tesla should really make absolutely sure they communicate all information absolutely correct and precise.
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Tapatalkin' from iTalatut.
Is it ? Based on todays currency rates the P85 costs $15825 more than the regular 85kWh in Norway. I believe the US difference was $15000 with the 21" wheels included. We now have to pay $19850 extra here for the Performance version & the 21" wheels ($4025 for the wheel upgrade).
Try reading the pricing info on Teslas website - the blog from GeorgeB
Model S European Pricing | Blog | Tesla Motors
"There will be no difference between U.S. and European standard equipment and options packages. Our European websites have been updated to show pricing and options by country. All prices include delivery at your nearest Tesla Service Center".
As 21 inch wheels are standard on the US performance model I surely expect it to be on the European as well. Also in Denmark the law is very customer friendly and an official message like this sent from Tesla to the public certainly means that 21 inch wheels are included in the same configuration - assuming that the buyer can prove that the statement has been sent to the public. Would recommend all to print the pricing blog and the US specs.
Model S European Pricing | Blog | Tesla Motors
"There will be no difference between U.S. and European standard equipment and options packages. Our European websites have been updated to show pricing and options by country. All prices include delivery at your nearest Tesla Service Center".
As 21 inch wheels are standard on the US performance model I surely expect it to be on the European as well. Also in Denmark the law is very customer friendly and an official message like this sent from Tesla to the public certainly means that 21 inch wheels are included in the same configuration - assuming that the buyer can prove that the statement has been sent to the public. Would recommend all to print the pricing blog and the US specs.
Johan
Ex got M3 in the divorce, waiting for EU Model Y!
It's wise for Tesla if it turns out their margin on the Performance package while it still included the 21" wheels was severly below their target of 25% gross margin. And disastrous if the margin was in fact negative=loosing money.
Count me in the unhappy campers group as well. Why? Not because they are in fact changing their prices - they are in title to. But because of the fact that they are still honoring new US customers free 21inch rims 'for free' while the EU customers must pay extra - no matter how long ago the reservation was being made.
Based on this, I can not see how the 'lack of margin' argument would hold.
In addition:
George B, when announcing the EU prices, stated the following:
"There will be no difference between U.S. and European standard equipment and options packages."
With regards to the facts mentioned above - this would not be the truth.
Based on this, I can not see how the 'lack of margin' argument would hold.
In addition:
George B, when announcing the EU prices, stated the following:
"There will be no difference between U.S. and European standard equipment and options packages."
With regards to the facts mentioned above - this would not be the truth.
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Actually, it is pretty much exactly the truth.
citing 'Jolinar' on TM:
... Signature performance in EU before VAT is $109,748 (83409€ = 91750/1.1) price increase included, import duty (10%) excluded . That means Tesla increased price only by $1848 (1405€) as transport and other business expenses, which seems quite impressive. Other expenses can't be affected by Tesla
That's about 1.7%. Minus transport and final assembly, that comes to 0% price increase.
Your governments get pretty much every Euro of the increase, in other words.
These posts sum up the reason for me being irritated here quite nicely.
Its the principal of the thing that annoys me. I dont really care about the price itself since I can easily afford that, but being taken for a ride makes me angry.
As others have pointed out:
1. Perf still includes 21" in the US so any argument for margins is irrelevant in my mind. Right now its playing favorites on US-customers. Its that simple.
2. George B explicitly wrote that options would stay the same. I know the answer here will be that "after price increase they are the same", but that doesnt change the fact that right now the options arent the same for those that reserved early.
3. Options page in Norway actually stated that upgraded wheels was included for a short while.
All of this comes down to poor communication. I realize now that many here are so invested in Tesla and their mission that they find positive in everything no matter what, but the fact of the matter is the things ar far from perfect. Reminds me of apple vs android and similar discussions where people defend their favorite now matter what shortfall a product might have.
Will I still buy the car? Yes, most likely.
Am I disappointed/annoyed? Yes.
Will I continue to be a local "spokesperson" for Tesla? Not for a long while.
