Why do people say Teslas are heavier than ICE cars? Model Y LR weight is the same as a Ford Edge.
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Does your state charge you a penalty for owning a Tesla?
- Thread starter mm9351
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Model Y 4.1kb to 4.4klb
Edge is 4.1klb to 4,5klb
Venza max 3.9klb. Venza is hybrid only
Model Y 187″ L x 76″ W x 64″ H
Edge 189″ L x 76″ W x 68″ H
Venza 187″ L x 73″ W x 66″ H
The Edge is a bit longer and taller. It's always been rather obese.
For comparison, my Kona EV is somewhere in the range 3,715 to 3,836 lbs. Same model year gas version is 2,890 to 3,276 lbs.
EVs of same models are clearly heavier.
HankE-LA
Member
Louisiana. $110 road use fee annually for an EV. $60 for a hybrid. Gasoline tax is 20 cents a gallon.
In Texas, under 6000 lbs vehicle registration fee + taxes + fees is usually around 75, heavier vehicle will be more but EV is 200, we also pay 20 cents tax per gallon for gas but since EV doesn't use any gas, so the government figured out the extra 125 dollars will cover the gas tax for the EV owners, whether it is fair or not depends on how much we drive and comparing to any ICE vehicle that we might have been using as an alternative. Lots of toll roads here in the metroplex, the additional fees add up quickly no matter what we drive.
Other than the other myriad of reasons Oklahoma is.. well, you know. They now charge $144 for "EV infrastructure" when you register the car. Which is hilarious, because there is basically zero infrastructure here. The nearest Supercharger to me is 91 miles away in OKC, then after that it's ~150+ miles in Tulsa. The ACTUAL closest Supercharger to me is in TX, go figure, lol.
Luckily we're finally leaving soon, but I thought this was funny when I went to register my MYP this year.
Luckily we're finally leaving soon, but I thought this was funny when I went to register my MYP this year.
Roads are EV infrastructure. They're not EV *only* infrastructure like chargers, but still infrastructure.
The roads here ain't great either, haha. But I see your point.
A little late to the fun on this thread. A couple years ago there was an ad in the local newspaper looking for volunteers for a study, run by the, "Eastern Transportation Coalition", for a Mileage-Based User Fee.
The main landing page is at The Eastern Transportation Coalition MBUF Pilot - Paving the way to fair transportation funding..
The States involved go from Texas, around the Florida peninsula, and up to Maine.
The ideas are fairly straightforward. People with petroleum-based vehicles pay taxes at the pump. Got a big vehicle? One ends up using more fuel. Small vehicle? Less fuel. Drive a lot? Use more fuel. Drive hardly at all? Use tiny amounts of fuel. Since the taxes go with the fuel, as much as we all don't like hydrocarbons around here, the money more or less tracks usage, wear, and tear on the roads. So, in this imperfect world, taxing at the pump isn't half bad.
Extraordinarily high MPG vehicles like, say, a Prius, tend to throw sand in the gears; plug-in hybrids tend to throw pebbles; and BEVs flat-out hit the gears like metal bars. At the top end of, "whoa, there!" we have a fully loaded Tesla Semi as Exhibit A: Big semis definitely damage roads more than itty bitty sporters, and, well, there one is.
The Coalition study, in which I participated, was kind of interesting. No actual money changed hands, although I think I got something like a $50 gift card at the end. There were various methods of collecting data, including sticking a module into the OBDII port in those cars that supported same. For a Tesla, they asked for (and got) access to the Tesla Mothership and recorded one's mileage.
At the end of every month one would get an electronic "bill" (remember, no money is changing hands, here) where the mileage recorded would be multiplied by a cents-per-mile number provided by the State in which one lived. I vaguely remember that Pennsylvania was the highest at $0.10/mile; others were as low as $0.02/mile.
With the Tesla, there was no GPS involved, so I was being "charged" for trips outside of the State, which I thought mildly unfair. I would rather have any travel in a given state, sent to that state, rather than the one I lived in.
I have no idea how any of this integrates with toll roads.
Heavier vehicles got a higher charge than lighter vehicles, so they were trying to account for that. There's also a semi-related bunch of studies where people are thinking about getting Big Trucks involved with this approach.
There were surveys done at the beginning, middle, and end of the study, mostly asking how people felt about the whole MBUF business.
From my view, the most "fair" approach would involve GPS working out where one was. But that brings up the Big Objection: Some government agency having data on where, exactly, one was at every instant. The danger of getting hit by speeding fines or just being tracked by some out-of-control bunch of three-letter agencies whose records, shall we say, aren't the best when it comes to not making $RANDOM mistakes.
In which case the registration fee approach taken by a bunch of states sounds like the next worst option.
The main landing page is at The Eastern Transportation Coalition MBUF Pilot - Paving the way to fair transportation funding..
The States involved go from Texas, around the Florida peninsula, and up to Maine.
The ideas are fairly straightforward. People with petroleum-based vehicles pay taxes at the pump. Got a big vehicle? One ends up using more fuel. Small vehicle? Less fuel. Drive a lot? Use more fuel. Drive hardly at all? Use tiny amounts of fuel. Since the taxes go with the fuel, as much as we all don't like hydrocarbons around here, the money more or less tracks usage, wear, and tear on the roads. So, in this imperfect world, taxing at the pump isn't half bad.
Extraordinarily high MPG vehicles like, say, a Prius, tend to throw sand in the gears; plug-in hybrids tend to throw pebbles; and BEVs flat-out hit the gears like metal bars. At the top end of, "whoa, there!" we have a fully loaded Tesla Semi as Exhibit A: Big semis definitely damage roads more than itty bitty sporters, and, well, there one is.
The Coalition study, in which I participated, was kind of interesting. No actual money changed hands, although I think I got something like a $50 gift card at the end. There were various methods of collecting data, including sticking a module into the OBDII port in those cars that supported same. For a Tesla, they asked for (and got) access to the Tesla Mothership and recorded one's mileage.
At the end of every month one would get an electronic "bill" (remember, no money is changing hands, here) where the mileage recorded would be multiplied by a cents-per-mile number provided by the State in which one lived. I vaguely remember that Pennsylvania was the highest at $0.10/mile; others were as low as $0.02/mile.
With the Tesla, there was no GPS involved, so I was being "charged" for trips outside of the State, which I thought mildly unfair. I would rather have any travel in a given state, sent to that state, rather than the one I lived in.
I have no idea how any of this integrates with toll roads.
Heavier vehicles got a higher charge than lighter vehicles, so they were trying to account for that. There's also a semi-related bunch of studies where people are thinking about getting Big Trucks involved with this approach.
There were surveys done at the beginning, middle, and end of the study, mostly asking how people felt about the whole MBUF business.
From my view, the most "fair" approach would involve GPS working out where one was. But that brings up the Big Objection: Some government agency having data on where, exactly, one was at every instant. The danger of getting hit by speeding fines or just being tracked by some out-of-control bunch of three-letter agencies whose records, shall we say, aren't the best when it comes to not making $RANDOM mistakes.
In which case the registration fee approach taken by a bunch of states sounds like the next worst option.
Just do a search How Are Electric Vehicles Taxed in Your State?
It’s $140/year in NC. While the charges need to be roughly equal to gas road taxes, it’s not accurate to describe it as a “penalty.”
It’s $140/year in NC. While the charges need to be roughly equal to gas road taxes, it’s not accurate to describe it as a “penalty.”
The reason for the difference is a first year registration from a car purchased at a licensed dealer is a 2 year registration.
In terms of aligning costs with user fees, their goal isn't necessarily to have perfect accuracy. They just need to recover their road maintenance costs in some way that reasonably accurately tracks usage. There is a high privacy cost to getting that last digit of accuracy, so I guess the idea is to accept slightly less accuracy, but in exchange, there is much less chance of privacy-based objections.
Trips out of state don't inherently generate inaccuracy since all states have residents that travel to other states. But maybe tourism destination states like MT are car traveler net importers while states where wealthy tourists reside like NJ are car traveler net exporters. Even then, it's only the "net" portion that produces inaccuracy.
What's interesting is that these taxes are collected by the state, but then the road maintenance is determined by the municipality.
Our roads get destroyed by the Winter, so they're not great either... but we've got a neighboring city whose roads are *much, much* worse. As if the people that live there aren't buying gas.
Yea, missouri charges an ev tax, it went up to $270 for me this year and is expected to double (according to Lady from the dmv). My insurance is outrageous also, anyone getting a good rate? With what company?
Mrdrbot23
Member
New Hampshire recently added a surcharge to annual registrations for EVs and plug-in hybrids: $100 and $50, respectively. Article here. Annoying yet understandable since I no longer contribute to the state's coffers for road maintenance via gasoline taxes.
I just came across this map, which pretty much sums up the latest tax situation. Luckily I reside in a “green“ state, but the majority of states are moving towards additional fees for EVs. Like everything else, state governments have creatively discovered yet another source of revenue in addition to sales and property taxes 
Check out the complete article.
Check out the complete article.
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Interesting. I'm in New Jersey. Yep, the state hands out bonuses to buy a BEV.I just came across this map, which pretty much sums up the latest tax situation. Luckily I reside in a “green“ state, but the majority of states are moving towards additional fees for EVs. Like everything else, state governments have creatively discovered yet another source of revenue in addition to sales and property taxes
The chart mentions that the State of Washington has a sales tax exemption. Um. New Jersey's got that, too, but it's not mentioned.
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