Did Tesla design cars to be able to take a range extender just incase?

[FastLaneJB]

Okay, maybe not change in rate of growth, but you are still playing with percentages and making possibly invalid assumptions.

It's somewhat similar to the statement that food causes cancer, because in 100% of the cancer cases, the patient ate food. The researcher forgot to look at the other side of the equation.

Just because the percentage year of year are less, doesn't mean that people have reduced buying EVs. It could mean something as simple as "there wasn't as many used EVs for sale". It also could mean that the EV sales are up, but ICE was up more. And that may be because people were buying new EVs and there were more cheaper ICEs on the market.

And then you even have to question what an EV is in any study. BEV, PHEV, HEV?


All of this started with a question from you, a person who has severe range anxiety.

Nothing is going to be good enough for you. You have already proven that you are not open to stretch your envelope.

So many inaccuracies here.

The chart I posted comes from the SMMT which as I know you are from the US is described as "The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT) is the trade association for the United Kingdom motor industry.". It shows and I've mentioned new car sales only, used cars have nothing to do with this so not sure why people keep bringing them up.

As I've also already mentioned. EV includes PHEV vehicles so it's not just pure BEV's. The data is easy to understand, the percentage of EV's being sold to private sellers as a ratio of new car sales has dropped.

Take a look at Carwow that tracks all 0% APR car deals in the UK. What trend do you see around the power trains of those cars?

CarWow 0% APR Deals

I started this post as just an interesting thought that the under floor storage in the boot is rather large to the point that a small range extender engine could probably fit in there. It's a theoretical question as none of us really know the answer but if the world decided to go range extenders, PHEV's would Tesla have to throw their model 3 / Y design out or would they go "Actually we can fit a small engine in the rear so all good".

That then got twisted into me having severe range anxiety because I dared to even mention range extender and Tesla in this forum. I don't have severe range anxiety, I can merely see a place at least currently for PHEV vehicles.

 

[UkNorthampton]

So many inaccuracies here.

The chart I posted comes from the SMMT which as I know you are from the US is described as "The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT) is the trade association for the United Kingdom motor industry.". It shows and I've mentioned new car sales only, used cars have nothing to do with this so not sure why people keep bringing them up.

As I've also already mentioned. EV includes PHEV vehicles so it's not just pure BEV's. The data is easy to understand, the percentage of EV's being sold to private sellers as a ratio of new car sales has dropped.

Take a look at Carwow that tracks all 0% APR car deals in the UK. What trend do you see around the power trains of those cars?

CarWow 0% APR Deals

I started this post as just an interesting thought that the under floor storage in the boot is rather large to the point that a small range extender engine could probably fit in there. It's a theoretical question as none of us really know the answer but if the world decided to go range extenders, PHEV's would Tesla have to throw their model 3 / Y design out or would they go "Actually we can fit a small engine in the rear so all good".

That then got twisted into me having severe range anxiety because I dared to even mention range extender and Tesla in this forum. I don't have severe range anxiety, I can merely see a place at least currently for PHEV vehicles.

So started off with the idea of fitting a fire risk (range extender) and most people thought it was a daft idea.

Next it moves to private sales of EVs, ignoring greater propensity for more expensive EVs to be classed as fleet even for privately sourced as more likely to be leased (more expensive, harder to finance the extra cost, FUD/risk, dealer hostility from lack of service income).

Also ignored how EV sales in UK are growing year on year as percent of market with no new subsidies.

On another thread I noted that of 70 models that I got on a recent discount email, only one was an EV (BMW iX1).

Loads of VW group, Honda, Ford, Mazda with discounts often above 20%. All ICE.

Carwow link is interesting, seems like manufacturers happy to subvent some EV interest rates rather than reduce cost. Not sure why, perhaps they want to portray EV versions as being so much more expensive.

When you click on CarWow's best deals, ICE dominate with large GBP discounts.

Silly marketeers with their funny little ways. Makes the Tesla way even more attractive (direct sales, no negotiation, no commission driven sales tricks).

Best new car deals and 73-plate deals

Compare all the best new-car deals available through carwow. Receive offers from official UK dealers and save an average of £3,600 on your brand-new car.

www.carwow.co.uk

 

[FastLaneJB]

So started off with the idea of fitting a fire risk (range extender) and most people thought it was a daft idea.

Next it moves to private sales of EVs, ignoring greater propensity for more expensive EVs to be classed as fleet even for privately sourced as more likely to be leased (more expensive, harder to finance the extra cost, FUD/risk, dealer hostility from lack of service income).

Also ignored how EV sales in UK are growing year on year as percent of market with no new subsidies.

On another thread I noted that of 70 models that I got on a recent discount email, only one was an EV (BMW iX1).

Loads of VW group, Honda, Ford, Mazda with discounts often above 20%. All ICE.

Carwow link is interesting, seems like manufacturers happy to subvent some EV interest rates rather than reduce cost. Not sure why, perhaps they want to portray EV versions as being so much more expensive.

When you click on CarWow's best deals, ICE dominate with large GBP discounts.

Silly marketeers with their funny little ways. Makes the Tesla way even more attractive (direct sales, no negotiation, no commission driven sales tricks).

Best new car deals and 73-plate deals

Compare all the best new-car deals available through carwow. Receive offers from official UK dealers and save an average of £3,600 on your brand-new car.

www.carwow.co.uk

You know an EV battery is also a fire risk. Yes I know it doesn’t ignite as easily as an ICE engine but when it does go, it’s far worse. I imagine over time they’ll solve this with different chemistries but they aren’t shipping yet. Also this is the first time anyone mentioned fire hazard of a range extender in this thread…

It was you that started spouting chosen stats on EV sales and ignoring the drop as a percentage of private sales compared to other fuel types recently in the UK. Even now in this post you are still ignoring that and trying to change the topic to your point of view by going on about fleet sales. Why?

Those discounts on Carwow are tiny when you consider you’ll pay far more in interest on higher APR deals than you will on the 0% deals on EV’s. They struggle to drop the price of EV’s because a lot of companies are already selling them for a loss or extremely minimal margin, they can make money on an ICE and discounting them a bit hence is possible. It’s not a sign of bad times for ICE, just a competitive market as discounts always existed before EV’s came along also.

Don’t forget that PHEV’s are also included in the EV bracket when comparing the mix of engine types in sales, PHEV sales are growing far more quickly than BEV. So rubbish my off the cuff thread about if they could fit a range extender in the boot by going off on how you think it’s a silly idea. Also not the point of the thread on if you think it’s a good idea, just if it’s possible. But market trends at the moment are showing that people are starting to prefer PHEV’s more over BEV’s. So you might think it’s stupid but many don’t.

 

[MrBadger]

Looks like some are seeing a tiger…

 

[UkNorthampton]

You know an EV battery is also a fire risk. Yes I know it doesn’t ignite as easily as an ICE engine but when it does go, it’s far worse. I imagine over time they’ll solve this with different chemistries but they aren’t shipping yet. Also this is the first time anyone mentioned fire hazard of a range extender in this thread…

It was you that started spouting chosen stats on EV sales and ignoring the drop as a percentage of private sales compared to other fuel types recently in the UK. Even now in this post you are still ignoring that and trying to change the topic to your point of view by going on about fleet sales. Why?

Those discounts on Carwow are tiny when you consider you’ll pay far more in interest on higher APR deals than you will on the 0% deals on EV’s. They struggle to drop the price of EV’s because a lot of companies are already selling them for a loss or extremely minimal margin, they can make money on an ICE and discounting them a bit hence is possible. It’s not a sign of bad times for ICE, just a competitive market as discounts always existed before EV’s came along also.

Don’t forget that PHEV’s are also included in the EV bracket when comparing the mix of engine types in sales, PHEV sales are growing far more quickly than BEV. So rubbish my off the cuff thread about if they could fit a range extender in the boot by going off on how you think it’s a silly idea. Also not the point of the thread on if you think it’s a good idea, just if it’s possible. But market trends at the moment are showing that people are starting to prefer PHEV’s more over BEV’s. So you might think it’s stupid but many don’t.

I don't like cherry picked stats. That's what the Daily Hate's comment section is for.

EV sales are growing as percentage of new car sales in the UK. Private sales are a subset of private users sourcing new cars, as many use leases for higher cost & to reduce tech risk.

Engines run hot, even a small lawnmower - daft to put something that hot in a Tesla. Should be obvious. Might be a prelude to suggesting how great hybrids are. Hybrids are a terrible choice, two drivetrains, expensive maintenance, frequent cycling of small batteries leads to batteries failing quicker than a pure EV.

 

[FastLaneJB]

I don't like cherry picked stats. That's what the Daily Hate's comment section is for.

EV sales are growing as percentage of new car sales in the UK. Private sales are a subset of private users sourcing new cars, as many use leases for higher cost & to reduce tech risk.

Engines run hot, even a small lawnmower - daft to put something that hot in a Tesla. Should be obvious. Might be a prelude to suggesting how great hybrids are. Hybrids are a terrible choice, two drivetrains, expensive maintenance, frequent cycling of small batteries leads to batteries failing quicker than a pure EV.

No you just like to ignore stats that you don't tell the story you want to put across. It's not stats I generated, it comes from the SMMT and it's them putting that opinion across, I'm just repeating it.

You're still going on about private buyers inside fleet sales where they can get an incentive to buy an EV. How about talking about the point that I made that private sales without incentives are dropping as a percentage of new car sales. Do you have an opinion on that or you just want to change the topic again?

Why is it daft to put a hot engine in a car? I think mankind's been doing that for over 100 years. Also in your opinion hybrids are a terrible choice but the growth rate is faster than pure EV's so at the moment the general population doesn't agree with you. Still also doesn't really answer the theoretical question at the start of this topic which was not if people think it's a good idea or not, merely if it might be possible. If you don't have an opinion on that, maybe you should stop trying to derail this thread and just let it die.

 

[UkNorthampton]

No you just like to ignore stats that you don't tell the story you want to put across. It's not stats I generated, it comes from the SMMT and it's them putting that opinion across, I'm just repeating it.

You're still going on about private buyers inside fleet sales where they can get an incentive to buy an EV. How about talking about the point that I made that private sales without incentives are dropping as a percentage of new car sales. Do you have an opinion on that or you just want to change the topic again?

Why is it daft to put a hot engine in a car? I think mankind's been doing that for over 100 years. Also in your opinion hybrids are a terrible choice but the growth rate is faster than pure EV's so at the moment the general population doesn't agree with you. Still also doesn't really answer the theoretical question at the start of this topic which was not if people think it's a good idea or not, merely if it might be possible. If you don't have an opinion on that, maybe you should stop trying to derail this thread and just let it die.

"where they can get an incentive to buy an EV" - I'm talking about private car users leasing and therefore not being counted as private buyers for the reasons I gave including financing, dealer ineptitude/hostility and new tech FUD angst.

Hot engines have to be designed in. retrofitting is just dangerous. If this isn't obvious, I don't know what is. Your original post is fanciful.

"There's a rather large space at the back of the car for under boot storage. If they had to, a small range extender petrol engine might potentially fit there?"

Then you said "sales aren't going in the right direction" - yes they are from SMMT figures. No changes to tax in UK and the percentage of EV new car sales is growing.

@ewoodrick answered well...

"One quarter of slightly softer sales by some manufacturers does not a failure make.
And definitely not a panic reaction does it require.

A range extender is just a patch for range anxiety.

Right now, there is a uniformed public opinion that there isn't enough charging locations. That's changing at a rapid pace.
Paradigm shifts don't happen overnight.

And when I bought my Model 3 only six years ago, the concept of an EV being the #1 selling car in the world was a completely foreign concept. I doubt that even the most forward-thinking people dared to make the statement.

The best path, stop making up idle FUD, Social Media searches the forums for statements like this, magnifies it and then makes it to the broader press.

When EV adoption is up, titles such as EV Failing get the news."

 

[FastLaneJB]

"where they can get an incentive to buy an EV" - I'm talking about private car users leasing and therefore not being counted as private buyers for the reasons I gave including financing, dealer ineptitude/hostility and new tech FUD angst.

You are talking about buyers which get an incentive to buy an EV due to salary sacrifice reducing their 40%+ tax bill on their wages and a very small BIK of 2% currently. Same story over and over, they are financially motivated to buy EV's, it doesn't mean they all want an EV. Take those incentives away and it can make more financial sense to have an ICE, those people would switch to ICE cars.

You talk like everyone wants an EV because it's an EV. Many only get an EV because of the financial incentives to do so.

Hot engines have to be designed in. retrofitting is just dangerous. If this isn't obvious, I don't know what is. Your original post is fanciful.

Right and maybe they designed the chassis for this as a just incase. Don't see why you think this is so dangerous, the BMW i3 REX had a tiny small engine in the back that did exactly this. They didn't all explode or kill their owners.

Then you said "sales aren't going in the right direction" - yes they are from SMMT figures. No changes to tax in UK and the percentage of EV new car sales is growing.

You are like a broken record. I said PRIVATE sales NOT fleet sales were going in the wrong direction. I don't dispute that overall they grew if you include FLEET sales but those buyers have TAX BREAKS to steer them to EV's. Take those away, I think you'd find fleet sales might follow the private buyers trend.

@ewoodrick answered well...

"One quarter of slightly softer sales by some manufacturers does not a failure make.
And definitely not a panic reaction does it require.

A range extender is just a patch for range anxiety.

Right now, there is a uniformed public opinion that there isn't enough charging locations. That's changing at a rapid pace.
Paradigm shifts don't happen overnight.

And when I bought my Model 3 only six years ago, the concept of an EV being the #1 selling car in the world was a completely foreign concept. I doubt that even the most forward-thinking people dared to make the statement.

The best path, stop making up idle FUD, Social Media searches the forums for statements like this, magnifies it and then makes it to the broader press.

When EV adoption is up, titles such as EV Failing get the news."

A range extender is a patch for charging networks not being up to scratch at least more so in some places. It's not range anxiety it's just not wanting to put up with broken chargers, slow chargers or busy charging stations. You can argue it until your blue in the face, many in the public don't agree with you at least yet.

 

[UkNorthampton]

You are talking about buyers which get an incentive to buy an EV due to salary sacrifice reducing their 40%+ tax bill on their wages and a very small BIK of 2% currently. Same story over and over, they are financially motivated to buy EV's, it doesn't mean they all want an EV. Take those incentives away and it can make more financial sense to have an ICE, those people would switch to ICE cars.

You talk like everyone wants an EV because it's an EV. Many only get an EV because of the financial incentives to do so.


Right and maybe they designed the chassis for this as a just incase. Don't see why you think this is so dangerous, the BMW i3 REX had a tiny small engine in the back that did exactly this. They didn't all explode or kill their owners.


You are like a broken record. I said PRIVATE sales NOT fleet sales were going in the wrong direction. I don't dispute that overall they grew if you include FLEET sales but those buyers have TAX BREAKS to steer them to EV's. Take those away, I think you'd find fleet sales might follow the private buyers trend.


A range extender is a patch for charging networks not being up to scratch at least more so in some places. It's not range anxiety it's just not wanting to put up with broken chargers, slow chargers or busy charging stations. You can argue it until your blue in the face, many in the public don't agree with you at least yet.

"You are talking about buyers which get an incentive to buy an EV due to salary sacrifice reducing their 40%+ tax bill on their wages and a very small BIK of 2% currently" - no I'm not. I clearly said that private car users using leasing companies would be classed as fleet. If private car users lease and not PCP, the individuals aren't buyers, the leasing companies are. PCP may be counted as fleet too (at least initially, before final balloon payment as customer can hand back the car to the lease company).

Such companies include

• Gridserve
• Octopus
• DriveElectric
• LV ElectriX
• LeaseLoco
• e-Car Lease
• Select Car Leasing
• Pink Car Leasing
• EDF Energy

I've also said there are good reasons for individuals leasing rather than buying EVs, hence it would be expected that fleet vs "private" would be skewed. Such reasons include dealer apathy, ignorance and hostility, FUD around tech, reliability and depreciation (used EV prices going up - evidence earlier in this thread) and the increased cost to buy EVs changing the finance dynamic.

Few people go back to ICE if they had a decent EV like a Tesla. Bums in seats. EV users will only grow. I may have to rent an ICE vehicle for an upcoming trip. I'm dreading it.

"A range extender is a patch for charging networks not being up to scratch" - as others have stated several times, that's in a few people's heads. Look at those who source EVs for the Scottish Islands, buying near the English South Coast and driving them back eg Zoe in December 2023 at -7 temperatures.

"many in the public don't agree with you at least yet." many people have been conned by smooth talking heads in the last few years. Deluge of FUD in mainstream media, follow the money.

“You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”

 

[ewoodrick]

That then got twisted into me having severe range anxiety because I dared to even mention range extender and Tesla in this forum. I don't have severe range anxiety, I can merely see a place at least currently for PHEV vehicles.

So, you're headed to the highlands this weekend?

 

[FastLaneJB]

"You are talking about buyers which get an incentive to buy an EV due to salary sacrifice reducing their 40%+ tax bill on their wages and a very small BIK of 2% currently" - no I'm not. I clearly said that private car users using leasing companies would be classed as fleet. If private car users lease and not PCP, the individuals aren't buyers, the leasing companies are. PCP may be counted as fleet too (at least initially, before final balloon payment as customer can hand back the car to the lease company).

Such companies include

• Gridserve
• Octopus
• DriveElectric
• LV ElectriX
• LeaseLoco
• e-Car Lease
• Select Car Leasing
• Pink Car Leasing
• EDF Energy

I've also said there are good reasons for individuals leasing rather than buying EVs, hence it would be expected that fleet vs "private" would be skewed. Such reasons include dealer apathy, ignorance and hostility, FUD around tech, reliability and depreciation (used EV prices going up - evidence earlier in this thread) and the increased cost to buy EVs changing the finance dynamic.

Few people go back to ICE if they had a decent EV like a Tesla. Bums in seats. EV users will only grow. I may have to rent an ICE vehicle for an upcoming trip. I'm dreading it.

"A range extender is a patch for charging networks not being up to scratch" - as others have stated several times, that's in a few people's heads. Look at those who source EVs for the Scottish Islands, buying near the English South Coast and driving them back eg Zoe in December 2023 at -7 temperatures.

"many in the public don't agree with you at least yet." many people have been conned by smooth talking heads in the last few years. Deluge of FUD in mainstream media, follow the money.

“You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”

Talk about clutching at straws. 90% of personal buyers that use finance use PCP, the remaining 10% is s mixture of hire purchase and leasing. It's insignificant and in no way helps your case.

Why can you not just admit that in the latest stats personal buyers are shifting away from EV's? Probably has something to do with your clear Tesla bias and fan boy status. That's obvious from your profile.

 

[FastLaneJB]

So, you're headed to the highlands this weekend?

Yawn, the deja vu is boring.

 

[UkNorthampton]

Well no. The point I've had to constantly repeat over and over is when there's no incentives, EV sales as a percentage of new car sales is dropping in the UK. Private drivers using salary sacrifice or company car drivers inside fleet sales do get tax breaks that steer them to EV's.

I have a point, you just don't seem to like it

Your statement is untrue. Smmt have shown that year to date EV new car percentage is above last year's. That's even as incentives have not improved.

Private EV users include those leasing (Octopus, Gridserve, EDF Energy) and therefore likely to be counted as fleet. Greater propensity to lease EVs rather than cheaper, known tech ICE especially when unsupported FUD is so prevalent. Clinging to a definition of private sales is obviously an error when private car users are leasing from non dealers and leasing companies are buying in bulk.

Turning to used cars.. people are slowly catching on to EV advantages. It is my opinion that used car buyers are more conservative than new car buyers/private leasees (classed as fleet). This is very encouraging.

Used car buyers are usually "private". The private buyers are clearly switching to EVs. Some may be used commercially eg private hire/taxi/Uber. In many cases these cars are also used as the main car for the drivers' family. I base this speculation on talking with private hire drivers. Therefore arguably in the private camp or at least mixed. Most used EV sales will still be to private individuals with no intent to carry paying passengers. The FUD has failed on these people. After all, UK is small, range is rarely a problem except in convoluted, manufactured scenarios.

Used car sales hit five-year high, as EVs grow in popularity – SMMT Used car sales hit five-year high, as EVs grow in popularity – SMMT figures – Car Dealer Magazine

"Electric cars are fastest growing powertrain in the used market"
"Mike Hawes, SMMT chief executive, said: ‘A reinvigorated new car market is delivering more choice and affordability for used car buyers and, increasingly, they are choosing to go electric."

 

[UkNorthampton]

People researching buying/leasing EVs probably come across one of the many articles like this Leasing an Electric Car vs Buying: Which Is Better? | Pod Point

"Leasing typically works out cheaper than buying
Electric cars tend to have a higher list price than similar petrol or diesel cars. When you lease an EV, you're essentially renting it for a fixed period, often 2–3 years. You pay an initial deposit and set monthly payments as part of your leasing agreement. This typically works out cheaper than buying a new EV using other financing options"

If they start researching options for lease, they'll find deals from non dealers leasing a variety of different EVs. They may trust these companies, avail of trial periods rather than suffer dealerships' nonsense

 

[FastLaneJB]

Your statement is untrue. Smmt have shown that year to date EV new car percentage is above last year's. That's even as incentives have not improved.

Private EV users include those leasing (Octopus, Gridserve, EDF Energy) and therefore likely to be counted as fleet. Greater propensity to lease EVs rather than cheaper, known tech ICE especially when unsupported FUD is so prevalent. Clinging to a definition of private sales is obviously an error when private car users are leasing from non dealers and leasing companies are buying in bulk.

Turning to used cars.. people are slowly catching on to EV advantages. It is my opinion that used car buyers are more conservative than new car buyers/private leasees (classed as fleet). This is very encouraging.

Used car buyers are usually "private". The private buyers are clearly switching to EVs. Some may be used commercially eg private hire/taxi/Uber. In many cases these cars are also used as the main car for the drivers' family. I base this speculation on talking with private hire drivers. Therefore arguably in the private camp or at least mixed. Most used EV sales will still be to private individuals with no intent to carry paying passengers. The FUD has failed on these people. After all, UK is small, range is rarely a problem except in convoluted, manufactured scenarios.

Used car sales hit five-year high, as EVs grow in popularity – SMMT Used car sales hit five-year high, as EVs grow in popularity – SMMT figures – Car Dealer Magazine

"Electric cars are fastest growing powertrain in the used market"
"Mike Hawes, SMMT chief executive, said: ‘A reinvigorated new car market is delivering more choice and affordability for used car buyers and, increasingly, they are choosing to go electric."

Your inability to read what I write and reply to it is legendary. Not only that but you make the assumption that private buyers mostly use lease on EV's so are all fleet cars with no evidence to back it up.

I'm done repeating myself and you spouting all sorts of random other things. That's not how a conversation works so I'm out.

 

[ewoodrick]

Your inability to read what I write and reply to it is legendary. Not only that but you make the assumption that private buyers mostly use lease on EV's so are all fleet cars with no evidence to back it up.

I'm done repeating myself and you spouting all sorts of random other things. That's not how a conversation works so I'm out.

Have a great weekend in your artificially small world.

 

[Doudeau]

I hadn’t read this thread as title wasn’t a big draw for me but just read and caught up .

I have a lot of sympathy with what @FastLaneJB said back near the start. I have driven 40k over 3 years in my car and 3.5k of that was from one touring holiday in France in August 22. I regularly drive to France in the car and a number of times I’ve driven to the Alps and in Switzerland. Nearly all of that was anxiety free driving in respect to being able to charge but was it more hassle to plan than with an ICE - of course it was. Great to plan for staying in a hotel with EV charging but I’ve often found I’ve not been the chosen one to get the space as they’re often not reservable in my experience.

Not sure Labour government will ultimately incentivise the drive to EVs - current London mayor has decided that from next year EVs will need to pay congestion charge (despite not emitting any toxins) and it appears he’s going to introduce pay-per-mile for driving which I’m guessing won’t exclude EVs either.

Despite being a 2 EV household (private ownership) for the last 3.5years I’m considering switching one to an ICE or hybrid just to be able to jump in and go if the need arises (like it did the other week for us).

I won’t comment on sales stats .

 

[FastLaneJB]

I hadn’t read this thread as title wasn’t a big draw for me but just read and caught up .

I have a lot of sympathy with what @FastLaneJB said back near the start. I have driven 40k over 3 years in my car and 3.5k of that was from one touring holiday in France in August 22. I regularly drive to France in the car and a number of times I’ve driven to the Alps and in Switzerland. Nearly all of that was anxiety free driving in respect to being able to charge but was it more hassle to plan than with an ICE - of course it was. Great to plan for staying in a hotel with EV charging but I’ve often found I’ve not been the chosen one to get the space as they’re often not reservable in my experience.

Not sure Labour government will ultimately incentivise the drive to EVs - current London mayor has decided that from next year EVs will need to pay congestion charge (despite not emitting any toxins) and it appears he’s going to introduce pay-per-mile for driving which I’m guessing won’t exclude EVs either.

Despite being a 2 EV household (private ownership) for the last 3.5years I’m considering switching one to an ICE or hybrid just to be able to jump in and go if the need arises (like it did the other week for us).

I won’t comment on sales stats .

Thanks for the post, really appreciated. You seem to share the same opinion as me on this.

Destination chargers are great of course but as you say in these earlier days most places only have a couple and a lot of hotels don't have any at all. EV drivers then will steer towards those destination charger hotels and you cannot be sure you'll get on it. You certainly cannot assume you will so need enough spare charge just incase.

I guess when it comes to congestion charge that was again a benefit to drive increased EV's in the capital, the ULEZ is really what's there to get emissions down though of course not completely as new enough petrol and diesels also don't have to pay. I imagine seeing as it cost so much to put in and also to run, they'll shift what's allowed with no charge in the ULEZ in the future to keep the revenue flowing in.

Still not sure what I'll do on the 2 EV's or get one as a PHEV or just plain ICE. I don't mind too much the planning but even with that, you cannot be sure you'll get on a charger so there's still an element of unknown. The just jump in and go knowing you don't have to research where the fuel stations are is just simple. EV's will get there but aren't there yet.

 

[GRiLLA]

it appears he’s going to introduce pay-per-mile for driving which I’m guessing won’t exclude EVs either.

It only 'appears' in misinformation and smears from the losing candidates. See https://www.london.gov.uk/who-we-ar...or/find-an-answer/pay-mile-road-user-charging

 

[Doudeau]

It only 'appears' in misinformation and smears from the losing candidates. See https://www.london.gov.uk/who-we-ar...or/find-an-answer/pay-mile-road-user-charging

The same London mayor who said he wouldn’t expand the ULEZ zone.

I think we need to be prepared, like I’ve seen with removal of local council parking discounts, that EVs won’t/can’t be given special status when income needs to be found.