Car Network connectivity solutions 2G-3G-4G-5G - Australia

[e-enthusiast30]

UWB could actually detect where you are in relation to the car, like a traditional car fobv (The Tesla one is just bluetooth). Eg, only allow you to open the door you are near. EG, if you stand next to the drivers door, you cannot open the passenger side door/s. Its just a matter of programming implementation.

Its still a little bit of a cop out that Tesla hasn't had this built into its cars for the last few years considering its been in phones for quite a while.

Agreed, UWB has been out for a few years now. The same could be said of the modem inside the Highland (not sure what MY is shipping with). 2G/3G/4G/LTE. Now I know they ship the Shanghai-built car all over the place for RHD markets and need to remain compatible with a breadth of cellular markets, but 2G!? And no 5G?!

Given the numerous use cases for 5G connectivity in the automotive industry, it seems like a no-brainer for Tesla to upgrade their modems to 5G capability. Retrofit down the line perhaps?

 

[Zoltrix77]

Agreed, UWB has been out for a few years now. The same could be said of the modem inside the Highland (not sure what MY is shipping with). 2G/3G/4G/LTE. Now I know they ship the Shanghai-built car all over the place for RHD markets and need to remain compatible with a breadth of cellular markets, but 2G!? And no 5G?!

Given the numerous use cases for 5G connectivity in the automotive industry, it seems like a no-brainer for Tesla to upgrade their modems to 5G capability. Retrofit down the line perhaps?

I read some news article about Tesla working on 5G vehicle;e modems about a month ago. Its was worded like they invented the wheel. I got down voted for pointing out that it was about time and its not rocket science. Saying that, it seems like embedded industrial cellular back haul is deliberately held back until 6 months before the lastest network shut down so everyone can spend a fortune rushing to swap out devices. How long has 5g been a thing in phones? Industrial modems are still nearly all 4G unless you want to spend a fortune. It's not about speed, its about future proofing a product.

 

[Max Spaghetti]

It's not about speed, its about future proofing a product.

Yep.

The only thing stopping me keeping my LFP Tesla for 20 years will be the removal of the 4G LTE networks in 10 years' time as 6G is phased in.

I believe the early Model S's were 3G - is there a 4G upgrade path for those vehicles?

 

[moa999]

is there a 4G upgrade path for those vehicles?

In the US there was a cheap US$200 upgrade.
It appears in Australia, people are also required to do the MCU2 upgrade (which does improve screen performance) but it's not a cheap upgrade A$2000+ afaik.

Agree that Tesla should be moving to a 3G/4G/5G modem these days (noting that it's likely a third party part), but Aus carriers are still not providing 5G unless on premium plans, and frankly 4G is going to be the primary carriage service for many years.

 

[ZeeDoktor]

You can always wifi it with a hotspot... it's how I keep connected when driving through the never never. Car mounted starlink kit providing faster internet than my VDSL in the Sydney CBD!

 

[meloccom]

Yep.

The only thing stopping me keeping my LFP Tesla for 20 years will be the removal of the 4G LTE networks in 10 years' time as 6G is phased in.

I believe the early Model S's were 3G - is there a 4G upgrade path for those vehicles?

Yes, just had the MCU2 update on my 2014 Model S, $2780 all up. Later models may be cheaper as they don’t need so many components updated I’m told.
The screen is a lot faster and has a few more features but I’m completely unimpressed with the connectivity. It lost 4G enough to lose maps 3 times on the drive down from the Southern Highlands to Sydney and takes a couple of minutes to acquire a signal in the morning. Then it loses connectivity in random places all around the metro area like Rose Bay and Randwick.
Up in the Southern Highlands it’s worse and loses connectivity between towns so streaming media is almost unusable. But then the next day it finds 3G for a bit and doesn’t.
I’m seriously considering logging a service call to get them to check the modem / aerial components but am monitoring it for now.

 

[ICUDoc]

takes a couple of minutes to acquire a signal in the morning

Is this when you drive away from home and the car changes from WiFi to 4G?
I had the same prob in my old S and found that having wifi off for a minute when leaving made the transition / acquisition of broadband much faster

 

[Priit]

Yeah, just checked my software tab and 8.9 has started downloading for me.

Any feedback on 2024.8.9 yet? I am on 2024.8.7 and my car is telling me 2024.8.9 is available, so wondering if its fine doing update when I get home after work, or hold for a few days to ensure its mostly stable?

 

[meloccom]

Is this when you drive away from home and the car changes from WiFi to 4G?
I had the same prob in my old S and found that having wifi off for a minute when leaving made the transition / acquisition of broadband much faster

Yes, this is exactly what is happening, do yo turn off the WiFi in the car or the router?

 

[ICUDoc]

Yes, this is exactly what is happening, do yo turn off the WiFi in the car or the router?

Doesn't happen so much in my current car, used to turn it off in the car when I first sat in it in the morning

 

[Priit]

I read some news article about Tesla working on 5G vehicle;e modems about a month ago. Its was worded like they invented the wheel. I got down voted for pointing out that it was about time and its not rocket science. Saying that, it seems like embedded industrial cellular back haul is deliberately held back until 6 months before the lastest network shut down so everyone can spend a fortune rushing to swap out devices. How long has 5g been a thing in phones? Industrial modems are still nearly all 4G unless you want to spend a fortune. It's not about speed, its about future proofing a product.

Considering that Starlink is working on direct satellite to cell option and are currently testing the tech, It is rather slow at current tech version. Tesla might be holding off on 5G upgrade until they get that sorted (in case changes are needed for hardware), so they would have the option of skipping over the standard 5G chip and maybe going for something where they don't need to pay the local phone providers at least for standard connectivity option and might only connect to local providers if premium connection is paid for and faster connection is needed. Not sure if that is something they would consider, but would make sense if they did?

 

[moa999]

Don't think StarLink will have much bandwidth to the current antenna which isn't much different to a cell phone.

Unless you can mount auch bigger array in say the roof pillar.

 

[Priit]

Don't think StarLink will have much bandwidth to the current antenna which isn't much different to a cell phone.

Unless you can mount auch bigger array in say the roof pillar.

True that the speeds cannot really compete with 4G and 5G ground based networks or even 3.5G HSPA+, but from what little information we get:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1742396904619581642

they should be able to get up to 7Mbps, that is comparable to 3G HSPA speeds and well and truly faster than 3G UMTS or any 2G network that might still operate. Also it is designed for 4G/LTE phones with their current antennas and as such should be able to connect current Tesla cars just fine. With that it would cover the cars standard connectivity needs just fine, with premium connectivity needing more bandwidth and as such would need to connect to ground based 4G networks for the extra bandwidth?

 

[moa999]

Per beam, not per device.
And I assume a single beam, a bit like NBN Skymuster covers many hundreds of km²

 

[Quickst]

future proofing

There is no such thing as future proofing. Technologies develop over time. But it is not possible to know what they are until they are developed. The most that can happen is early adoption of technology which then costs a lot of money but mass production relies on extremely cheap parts.

 

[Zoltrix77]

There is no such thing as future proofing. Technologies develop over time. But it is not possible to know what they are until they are developed. The most that can happen is early adoption of technology which then costs a lot of money but mass production relies on extremely cheap parts.

I should have worded that future proofing for the forseeable future. No 5G modems in current vehicles is anything but.

 

[Quickst]

No 5G modems in current vehicles is anything but.

What can 5G do that 4g can't in the context of a car where the data usage is limited ($9.99 per month)

I suspect it all comes down to the cost benefit analysis. Not a lot of areas with 5G
as per Telstra heat map. A 4G/5G modem vs a cheaper 3G/4G modem which covers the same mobile footprint and Telstra charges extra for 5G access = cheap and cheerful is better.

Possibly implemented when the 4G/5G modem and usage charges hits the correct pricepoint .

Would computer hardware redesign also be required?. I can't imagine the 5G modem would be a drop in upgrade.

 

[paulp]

What can 5G do that 4g can't in the context of a car where the data usage is limited ($9.99 per month)

I suspect it all comes down to the cost benefit analysis. Not a lot of areas with 5G
as per Telstra heat map. A 4G/5G modem vs a cheaper 3G/4G modem which covers the same mobile footprint and Telstra charges extra for 5G access = cheap and cheerful is better.

Possibly implemented when the 4G/5G modem and usage charges hits the correct pricepoint .

Would computer hardware redesign also be required?. I can't imagine the 5G modem would be a drop in upgrade.

View attachment 1038212

Telstra subsidary belong mobile offer 5G where available for no extra cost on the 4G plans

 

[Quickst]

Telstra subsidary belong

While cheaper only uses part of the Telstra Mobile network

 

[Zinzilla]

I suspect it all comes down to the cost benefit analysis. Not a lot of areas with 5G
as per Telstra heat map. A 4G/5G modem vs a cheaper 3G/4G modem which covers the same mobile footprint and Telstra charges extra for 5G access = cheap and cheerful is better.

From what I can see, 5G modems are still considerably more expensive than 4G ones (retail), so that must be a big factor. On the other hand, 5G was supposed to be better for carriers : more low-bandwidth devices in the same area, better separation and QoS of IoT devices from other types of usage, etc. You'd think they'd be pushing it.