Car Network connectivity solutions 2G-3G-4G-5G - Australia

[Vostok]

There are no 5G SA (standalone) deployments yet in Oz. One of the difficulties from a network perspective is the fact that 5G SA requires IPv6 and does not support IPv4.

Don’t want to turn this thread into a mobile technology thread but Telstra launched 5G SA last year, a number of Samsung devices support it. Not sure about Apple devices yet. All recent devices support IPv6 too.

Making Australia's best 5G even better

Telstra is constantly innovating and looking to push the limits of what our 5G network can do, but ultra-fast top speeds are only the tip of the iceberg of what 5G enables.

www.telstra.com.au

 

[ZeeDoktor]

Interesting, I was not aware Telstra was rolling out 5G SA. That however is not a UE function, it's a network transport core function. Any 5G capable device should be able to connect to that network.

 

[Vostok]

By the way, modems in cars usually support only a small subset of the mobile frequencies - typically the lowest band used for each technology, since that’s what gives the coverage. And they are also unlikely to support more than 2 techs (e.g. 2G/3G or 3G/4G). This is for cost reasons.

So in Telstra’s case, car modems would typically support 850 MHz for 3G and 700 MHz for 4G. The modems might support one other higher frequency band (e.g. 2100 for 3G and 1800 for 4G) but not always.

mm-wave support would be pretty useless in a car. The signals can barely penetrate tissue paper let alone a vehicle chassis

 

[Vostok]

I was not aware Telstra was rolling out 5G SA. That however is not a UE function, it's a network transport core function. Any 5G capable device should be able to connect to that network.

Not correct. There is a UE dependency as well.

https://www.lightreading.com/5g/why-is-5g-sa-taking-so-long-

 

[meloccom]

Moderators note:
44 posts moved from Software update thread.

 

[Max Spaghetti]

Telstra are doing 5G SA.

In fact, they will be repurposing the 850 MHz 3G band to form part of their 5G SA network from mid 2024.

I won't be holding my breath for the 700 MHz 4G LTE network to be around as long as my Tesla.

Reality check:

I didn't expect this to become a long and ongoing discussion, and it won't affect my quality of Tesla ownership.

I just thought it worthy of note that cars last longer than phones, and the manufacturer of a car that integrates a phone needs to have a bit of a think about the longevity aspects of that. As a suggestion, the problem could be solved in exactly the same way Tesla solves the dash cam storage problem: a USB dongle.

Tesla could incorporate cellular access via a USB cellular data dongle. That may create other issues to deal with, but would at least deal with the future proofing aspect.

 

[Quickst]

but I'd rather a low-mid band 5G capable modem in my vehicle that I can use, over a 2G/3G capable modem that I can no longer use.

I understand, but currently the 4g modem supplies enough bandwidth for all the computer hardware in the car - even in 5G areas, and obviously, in areas where 5G is not available.
5g is not going to add more functionality to the current model 3/Y.

If Tesla wants more functionality on future models, it can add in 5G of whatever flavour.

 

[paulp]

Telstra are doing 5G SA.

In fact, they will be repurposing the 850 MHz 3G band to form part of their 5G SA network from mid 2024.

I won't be holding my breath for the 700 MHz 4G LTE network to be around as long as my Tesla.

Reality check:

I didn't expect this to become a long and ongoing discussion, and it won't affect my quality of Tesla ownership.

I just thought it worthy of note that cars last longer than phones, and the manufacturer of a car that integrates a phone needs to have a bit of a think about the longevity aspects of that. As a suggestion, the problem could be solved in exactly the same way Tesla solves the dash cam storage problem: a USB dongle.

Tesla could incorporate cellular access via a USB cellular data dongle. That may create other issues to deal with, but would at least deal with the future proofing aspect.

I think tesla could also solve it my allowing a connection to my phone to control everything, which is the path other brands are going down. It also avoids the ongoing cost of a phone sim and a car sim, and you can get 5g/6g or whatever the future brings.

 

[Quickst]

ongoing cost of a phone sim and a car sim,

Though the car will still need a SIM card for the significant periods where the phone is not in vicinity of the car.

 

[Vostok]

I think tesla could also solve it my allowing a connection to my phone to control everything

Doesn’t hotspotting your phone to your car do exactly that? Or is Model S crimped in that regard…

 

[meloccom]

Doesn’t hotspotting your phone to your car do exactly that? Or is Model S crimped in that regard…

I tried that initially after the MCU2 upgrade. I had to manually connect to my phone Hot Spot each time i leave home. Then it stays connected when I get home unless you manually disconnect it. If you don’t my phone goes flat.

 

[Max Spaghetti]

I tried that initially after the MCU2 upgrade. I had to manually connect to my phone Hot Spot each time i leave home. Then it stays connected when I get home unless you manually disconnect it. If you don’t my phone goes flat.

I wonder if something like this would be effective:

Telstra Prepaid 4GX Wifi Plus Prepaid MBB from Telstra

Buy the Telstra Pre-Paid 4GX WiFi Plus today, and get set up with a Pre-Paid wireless internet device, SIM card and mobile broadband data. Find out more.

www.telstra.com.au

It says 8 hours battery life, so would keep running for a while when the USB power goes off. I'm not sure how often the USB ports in the vehicle are energised when the car is off - for example, are they energised when sentry mode is left on? And while charging?

But I'm also not sure whether the car being on wifi helps with remote access via the app, or whether it still needs a cellular connection. I know when Tesla was having Telstra issues a week or so ago, I still couldn't wake up the car via the app even when the car was charging and had access to my home wifi.

However, it might at least solve the hot-spotting inconvenience when driving, assuming the car successfully auto-connects to it each time you drive (for the purposes of in car use such as streaming, and maybe live traffic updates).

And it would obviously cost an additional monthly data plan.

 

[Quickst]

Telstra issues a week or so ago

I wonder if it is between connectivity provider and the mothership . I understand it occurs in other parts of the world as well.

 

[Vostok]

But I'm also not sure whether the car being on wifi helps with remote access via the app, or whether it still needs a cellular connection. I know when Tesla was having Telstra issues a week or so ago, I still couldn't wake up the car via the app even when the car was charging and had access to my home wifi.

Teslas being deaf to “wake up” messages is a randomly occurring issue that occurs everywhere on the planet. Happens to me periodically.

The App is agnostic to the final connection to the car (WiFi or Cellular).

When a car is charging, it is also awake. So if the App could not connect to the car, that implies no connectivity at all (car had lost its WiFi connection and there was no cellular connection).

 

[Max Spaghetti]

I wonder if it is between connectivity provider and the mothership . I understand it occurs in other parts of the world as well.

Could be. All I know is Tesla blamed Telstra when I logged a service request one time it happened last year. There were some on the interwebs blaming Telstra screwing up their LTE IOT WUS messages.

So if the App could not connect to the car, that implies no connectivity at all (car had lost its WiFi connection and there was no cellular connection).

You could be right. I should change my wording from "the car was charging" to "the car was plugged in".

It was definitely plugged in with WiFi available (always is) every time I failed to connect to it. But whether or not it was actually charging at the time I don't recall. My car charges on a schedule. It might have been waiting to charge (prior to midnight) or finished charging (early morning). It may have been asleep at these times and Telstra couldn't wake it up, and neither could my app over WiFi.

Anyway, that goes some way to answering the question of whether a USB hotspot in the car will help with app connectivity. Not always, it seems, when plugged in. Perhaps only when actually charging.