Ref 0-100, tests in Denmark claim that performance has actually _decreased_ after one or more OTA-updates in april(?).. So magazine-tests of initial firmware doesnt really apply here if those danish tests are indeed correct. They have tested 14-15cars I believe so the tests seem valid. They have even had Tesla attend the testing.
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Calling P85D owners world-wide for survey and complaint letter
- Thread starter kseitzberg
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
Quote Elon October 14,2014: With P85D’s 0 to 60 mph performance of 3.2 seconds, we have succeeded. Not only is the P85D a match for the McLaren F1, but it also doesn’t need a professional driver to achieve optimum performance. Just plant your foot and go. - http://www.teslamotors.com/no_NO/blog/dual-motor-model-s-and-autopilot
Now read the letter again - 3.6s or 3.7s in not 3.2s however you twist it, it just isn't. And Why do I care, well let me quote you: "What if you bought a computer based upon an advertised speed of 4 GHz, but then discovered the CPU only delivered 2.5 GHz. Wouldn't you be upset? Doesn't the 4 GHz speed that was advertised represent a certain level of performance that cannot be attained at the actual, delivered CPU speed of 2.5 GHz? And what if the computer that you're replacing runs at 2.5 GHz, wouldn't that make your purchase completely unnecessary?"
Understand, except all of the professionals who have tested the car in the mainstream US media have confirmed the 3.1 second time advertised by Tesla. Just because you can't achieve that time does not make Tesla's claim misleading in any way. It just means you're not doing it right. Sorry to be so blunt. Now if Tesla reduced the performance with a software update, as indicated above, that would be a different situation. But there is no confirmation that Tesla has done anything of the sort and this is the first I've heard of such an accusation.
I had a 300 lb woman in my back seat yesterday when I punched it. I can assure you that my acceleration did not meet Tesla specs for my car. Does that mean Tesla lied? What if the driver weighs 300 lbs, wouldn't that negatively impact acceleration? Maybe Tesla should publish acceleration numbers using a morbidly obese driver, that way the numbers will better fulfill people's expectations.
HP is analogous to CPU cycles, 0-60 time is analogous to a timed benchmark. You are conflating the two.
You would think so - however I will contest that and say that all the US magazines are doing it wrong - please read post #1077 and onwards P85D 691HP should have an asterisk * next to it.. - Page 108
That is if we should take Elons words at value.
Even Driver and Car using this method is not getting better than 3.3s 0 - 60mph, all the other tests are done on early production cars.
We have testet 15 cars again and again, one driver (not ob) the same numbers again and again and not once even close to the numbers Tesla claims. But please contribute with your numbers, as they may help to identify our problems, if yours is working the way it should.
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Are you suggesting the cars being shipped to Denmark have different performance than the cars shipping elsewhere?
Again, if it actually had 691 hp or 1 hp for every 7 lbs, it would accelerate like a car that has 1 hp for every 7 lbs and not like one that has 1 hp for every 9 lbs. It's the performance you *would* get if it had the hp that was advertised. You were baiting and I took it....again.
I have an awesome offer for you. I sell you my Wife's Mazda 3 . It's an unbelievable car with 500 HP !
Well the true number is only 130 HP, but you do not care right ?
Not suggesting anything. We have testet 15 P85ds again and again and it does 0-60 mph 0.4s - 0-5s slower than claimed by Tesla. When we first saw the numbers we could not believe it, so we tested again and called in more P85Ds and still getting the same 'slow' numbers. We have been telling Tesla this since late April, but no reply. Tesla has had three of the cars in for testing and are just saying there is nothing wrong with the car, but they do not provide any testing data showing they can achieve the claimed times. But from the Tesla API, we can see that they have not even been close during testing.
But if your P85D is doing the claimed acceleration from 0 to 60 mph, please go to the site and share your data, as this may help to clear up why our cars are not. It would surprise me if US P85D owners are able to achieve the times, because I have not seen one yet. You may feel it does, but please use a pbox or vbox with 1-foot rollout disabled to verify.
gavine
Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast
Doesn't state-of-charge affect performance, especially on the P85D? Are your "slow" tests with a sub 50% charge? Try it with 100% just to compare.
I was already said 100 times, but guess it has to be said again:
It's not about what performance they promised, its about 691 HP they promised. There is a group of people who want what they paid for, it's that plain simple.
Since we have done this more times than we care to admit (we are talking way over 100 runs), we have tried it all stages of charge. Warmed up the battery with a 10 minute drive straight out of a supercharger, so everything is at optimal temperature, actually finding that charge did not have such a big influence as one would expect.
Again, if you think you are feeling something else, please test, review data and then comment
For vbo data verification, please use:
vBox Verify
The benefits are nobody needs to install the vbox software so they can play around with vbo data files by using web based tools.
All typical accleration metrics are pulled at once so uploading a vbo will show you 0-60 and 0-100 with both 1ft and without 1ft rollouts on the same run.
For best results, please use an external antenna. The GPS signals bounce around way too much inside even if you've got lock on 8 satellites through the windshield, the accuracy of the signals is OK, but not great. If you want really really accurate results, use an external antenna. The one for the VBOX is somewhat pricey at about $70.
This one:
Amazon.com: ATT Cisco 3G MicroCell GPS Antenna for Wireless Network GPS Signal Extender DPH151: Electronics
is compatible for only $10 and works great. I get rock solid doppler readings using this antenna mounted outside.
vBox Verify
The benefits are nobody needs to install the vbox software so they can play around with vbo data files by using web based tools.
All typical accleration metrics are pulled at once so uploading a vbo will show you 0-60 and 0-100 with both 1ft and without 1ft rollouts on the same run.
For best results, please use an external antenna. The GPS signals bounce around way too much inside even if you've got lock on 8 satellites through the windshield, the accuracy of the signals is OK, but not great. If you want really really accurate results, use an external antenna. The one for the VBOX is somewhat pricey at about $70.
This one:
Amazon.com: ATT Cisco 3G MicroCell GPS Antenna for Wireless Network GPS Signal Extender DPH151: Electronics
is compatible for only $10 and works great. I get rock solid doppler readings using this antenna mounted outside.
jpwe10
Member
Lol you guys are funny. How come drag times got better than the 3.1 0-60 tesla advertises? This video shows 0-60 in 3.05 verified by VBOX. BTW, remember that Tesla claims 0-100 KPH as 3.3 seconds. 3.1 seconds is the 0-60 MPH time. Also, most american car companies and magazines that I know of measure 0-60 times with a 1 ft rollout... idk about European companies.
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That is with rollout and not valid because of that. In Europe and rest of the world 0-60 mph or 0-100 kph is not done with rollout-
Example Tesla Model S P85D Insane vs Sport Mode 0-60 MPH Testing | DragTimes.com Drag Racing, Fast Cars, Muscle Cars Blog
If you look at the time its 3.17 but look on the graph that does not show with rollout the time is 3.4-3.5 sec.
We have been over this more than a million times - please read this thread: P85D 691HP should have an asterisk * next to it.. - Page 108 from post #1077
Well you should care about european companies since it is a european car that Elon used to benchmark against when launching the car.
There are certainly letters expressing concerns about the performance of the P85D that I would be willing to sign, but it is unclear exactly what I would be signing up for if I provide you my information. I agree with the conclusions that the car doesn't actually produce 691 horsepower. I disagree with your contention that they shouldn't advertise their 0-60mph performance with rollout because I believe that the use of rollout is a de facto US standard. I have some limited data, which I would be willing to share regardless, but I'm not agreeing to "sign" a letter whose contents are unknown to me.
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Can you find any US car manufacturer that lists their 0-60 time without rollout? In car enthusiast circles, this difference in method is quite well-known, FWIW.
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Can you find any US car manufacturer that lists their 0-60 time without rollout? In car enthusiast circles, this difference in method is quite well-known, FWIW.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I get for the European audience they don't use rollout, so the 0-100kph numbers may be out of norm. However, I'm not sure how this applies to US audience, where 3.1 (with rollout) has been verified independently and matches the norm for US advertising of 0-60.
As for the 691hp thing, I don't feel the need to rehash here. All the arguments that can be made have been made already at the 691hp thread.
As for the 691hp thing, I don't feel the need to rehash here. All the arguments that can be made have been made already at the 691hp thread.
I understand your concern. You should know that we do accept the 1-foot rollout as a standard. 1) Tesla never said anything about 1-foot rollout, 2) Elon Musk said at launch it accelerates from 0 to 60 mph in 3.2s just as the benchmark McLaren F1, and since the F1 is 3.2s without 1-foot rollout, the claim is without 1-foot rollout
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Can you find just one US car manufacturer that say that their 0-60 times are with rollout? And at the same time please tell me where I can see this is a agreed standard for car manufacturers, not car magazines
Well, then it may only be a european matter?
I don't want to get into a debate about the accuracy of the claims and distract this thread, but in the other thread I pointed out that the only instrumented test by American car magazine I've found of the F1 got 3.4s with rollout.
