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Current Nissan Leaf lessees will lose their remote car capabilities in just over a year.
Smart ED remote capabilities have downtimes that last for 1-2 months at a time, fleet-wide.
I have a quick charge feature on my own EV that's practically worthless at this time, until infrastructure rolls out. The two closest lvl3 stations have frequent downtimes that last 1-2 months at a time.
I'd say Tesla is doing quite well compared to the competition, and autopilot (note: some autopilot features are already in and current lessees and owners are already taking advantage of them) is far more complex than anything on the road today on any public car.
I'd put this under "risks of being a consumer". If you're not happy with it, you should vote with your dollar and go to the competition. Nobody forced you to buy a Tesla or go with autopilot, and I feel that they've been sufficiently clear throughout the entire process. At some point, you can't expect a business to hand-hold you through absolutely every aspect of every product or service, and I'm still baffled by how many people apparently jumped into a 100k+ purchase without cursory research. Tesla has a well-known history of late deliveries on products, if you can even call the current autopilot delayed by the announcements made to date.
Sure, I'd be just as unhappy if I were in such a situation. However, if I could choose between a Tesla with a delayed autopilot, a Tesla with a rushed and potentially dangerous autopilot, and a competitor, I'd go with the first option any time.
This thread is informative.
I have a Model X reservation and now plan to only complete the order if everything on my "must-have" list is available. I won't buy and then hope for promised features to make their way on my vehicle. I do believe that Tesla will make good eventually but I agree that timing is important when it comes to technology.
I have a Model X reservation and now plan to only complete the order if everything on my "must-have" list is available. I won't buy and then hope for promised features to make their way on my vehicle. I do believe that Tesla will make good eventually but I agree that timing is important when it comes to technology.
Cyclone
Cyclonic Member ((.oO))
I truly do hope that the materials you review for the Model X are clear about what is available AT DELIVERY versus later, in case a must-have item for you actually will be available when you get the car.
Vger
Active Member
I'm awaiting my MS delivery (September). I'm a price conscious buyer and had to pull together a lot of things to be able to afford this car. Since I'm leasing this car for 36 months - I'm paying for the Autopilot package and feature even though it's not available. What if it takes another 6 months for this to be released - which it probably will - I've now paid 6/36 months for a feature that was not readily available. I guess the onus is on me, to make that choice, but seems a bit unfair to pay for a feature (especially with a lease) that I'm not going to be able to use.
Regardless of that - I'm super excited and can't wait for my MS!
Your expectations are set low, and I believe they will be exceeded. I am quite confident that you will take delivery of your car with 7.0 installed, or get it OTA within 30 days of delivery. I really do not think it will impact your lease much if at all.
I am just taking all Elon's statements about their current urgency of the program at face value, and then giving them a little grace to get it done. Some here may try to find that naive, but I am baking in 6 years of personal history with the company to make this prediction. Take it as you wish.
perkiset
... this one goes to 11
I'm leased as well, because Tesla is the iPhone of cars and I'll want the newest one in 3 years.
But AutoPilot is such a tiny fragment of my lease payment, and such an incredibly small portion of the reason that I got the car it's beyond trivial. Not to say that I don't understand what others are saying - I thought the "burlap seats" analogy was particularly salient. But I still maintain that purchasing a vehicle, or frankly ANYTHING in high technology on the hopes that it (the whatever new thing) will be here soon is just bad form. I know it's greasy for Elon et al to be spinning the issue, but it's worse to play it as if you were REALLY FOOLED about the reality of the situation.
My money is on the notion that people complaining the loudest on this thread will not be satisfied with what comes out, irrespective of how it works or what it does.
But AutoPilot is such a tiny fragment of my lease payment, and such an incredibly small portion of the reason that I got the car it's beyond trivial. Not to say that I don't understand what others are saying - I thought the "burlap seats" analogy was particularly salient. But I still maintain that purchasing a vehicle, or frankly ANYTHING in high technology on the hopes that it (the whatever new thing) will be here soon is just bad form. I know it's greasy for Elon et al to be spinning the issue, but it's worse to play it as if you were REALLY FOOLED about the reality of the situation.
My money is on the notion that people complaining the loudest on this thread will not be satisfied with what comes out, irrespective of how it works or what it does.
I plan to lease as well something i have never done, I think new model year envy will be high with these cars.
I believe there are some that WERE really fooled about the autopilot situation. Not everyone reads TMC, and if Tesla wants to appeal to the mass car market they cannot assume all their buyers read TMC and have come to expect a 10 month delay in features that were highly promoted. I think it's best to under promise and over deliver, rather than what we have seen recently. If they had just kept installing sensors and waited till they were a couple weeks away with autopilot to announce it the atmosphere and sentiment would be vastly different. It would be more of the "Wow Tesla does it again! This is why they're different!" rather than what we're used to these days, the jokes about "Tesla Time" and prize giveaways for guessing how long autopilot will be delayed for, and as you've stated the expectation of delays and that one shouldn't be fooled into thinking something will be delivered on time. Sadly it seems the modus operandi is now over promise under deliver and expect delays on delayed timelines.
I'm not sure how much of a backlash there is over autopilot away from TMC but I suspect if they just kept on quietly installing sensors and announced AP only when they were truly close to release/deployment they could have skipped the first auto pilot backlash in Oct 2014 with those who just missed having the sensors installed, those who got the sensors would be amazed, more (not all) of those who missed out would be understanding as their car was produced close to a year before AP, hey whadaya expect?! And the second backlash which is on going regarding the delay of AP, if they delayed announcing Tesla would be highly praised for their innovation, retroactive improvements and a car that gets better with age and is always evolving. This strategy probably sells less cars in the present as it doesn't hook people or "fool them", but it boosts the brand reputation and loyalty in the future.
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perkiset
... this one goes to 11
A lot of that is quite fair. I don't forgive Tesla for their marketing spin, but I do understand it. As a serial entrepreneur, I understand what they are up to and why it pisses people off. And I agree that they can only do it for (so) long before they move from fanbase to joke to has been.
As an aside, leasing is not for everyone. I am fortunate that I can use one of my companies to do it and it makes sense. I don't think it does for everyone, perhaps not even most people. Evaluate the finances very carefully.
As an aside, leasing is not for everyone. I am fortunate that I can use one of my companies to do it and it makes sense. I don't think it does for everyone, perhaps not even most people. Evaluate the finances very carefully.
Canuck
Well-Known Member
We're not privy to Tesla's marketing strategy or company internals, maybe they needed to sacrifice some goodwill for immediate sales at a critical moment, I hope thats the case and the strategy we've seen recently is just a temporary reflection of that.
I'm in the same boat more or less, self employed and can use it for a company expense. Still a big pill to swallow being that I've never spent more than 50K on a car before. I wholeheartedly agree with you most people should not lease unless it is financially beneficial. Sad to say I see people using credit for all the wrong reasons these day first hand.
perkiset
... this one goes to 11
:biggrin: Nope, serially underpromise and overdeliver. I subscribe to a different buzz methodology.
I don't know how anyone could back Tesla up on this subject unless they are financially tied to the stock.
When you announce and demonstrate something in October 2014, your customers will not be happy when the features demonstrated are still not available in AUGUST 2015 - especially when many customers sold their previous models and/or upgraded their reservations just because of your show.
When you announce and demonstrate something in October 2014, your customers will not be happy when the features demonstrated are still not available in AUGUST 2015 - especially when many customers sold their previous models and/or upgraded their reservations just because of your show.
davidc18
Active Member
If you go to the CPO website, for cars with autopilot, it show Lane Keeping and auto parking, as if it were already working. No "*" with a maybe activated via software updates in the future.
- 85 kWh Performance Model S P71259 | Tesla Motors
Tech Package with Autopilot
The Tech Package adds Autopilot convenience features and more to an already advanced car.
- Traffic-aware cruise control
- Lane keeping with automatic steering
- Self-parking
- LED fog and cornering lights with automatic high beams
dhanson865
Well-Known Member
gizmoboy
Member
It's the 80-20 rule. From "almost ready" to "ready" might be another 8 months, for all we know...
(Hopefully, it was at 80% back in October and they've just been paying for the last 20% this whole time.)
It would definitely be an interesting legal experiment to see what happens w/r/t warranty if a feature gets delivered after its warranty expires. Just sayin'.
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This is the counter-example. Nothing about "robotic snake" was promised. The tone of references to this potential feature was much like hyperloop -- theory land. No promises. No timeline. No customer money taken.
This makes a lot of sense. It's actually quite illogical not doing that. With open source APIs such as Waze and Google Map and Tesla's centralized server, it shouldn't be difficult to do.
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Just got another 6.2 update on P85D today, looks like v7.0 won't be here at least for another 2~3 weeks
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