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2017 Investor Roundtable: TSLA Market Action

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I apologize in advance for the length :)

I would expect that in a short squeeze, we will see the interest rate Fidelity is charging to short sellers to increase. This is one lever Fidelity (and all other brokerages) have to decrease the number of shares lent out, and thereby manage their own exposure and risk. That interest rate may go up a lot, fast, depending on the severity of the short squeeze.

Of course I could be wrong about that - a fast rise in the share price could lead to shorts buying to close at a fast pace to get out, with the net result being lots of shares available for short sale, and little appetite for doing so. My thinking for making that prediction (rising interest rates to borrow), is that in a short squeeze, shorts are struggling to find shares they can buy to close their position. More broadly, the total number of shares beneficially owned are being shrunk as the shorts close their positions, making it harder to find shares, and thus the loop. Fidelity can manage that, to some degree, and mitigate risk as well, by increasing the rate they charge - weaker shorts will be driven out by the higher rates, and stronger shorts will pay more on a daily basis to maintain their position (thereby lowering the brokerage's risk).

I would expect to see supply of shares to be borrowed to increase, with our indicator being first that Fidelity is borrowing shares through their FPLP (Fully Paid Lending Program). With the recent program change, the rate paid by Fidelity is 60% of the rate Fidelity charges short sellers, so there are no longer any tea leaves to read between the 2 rates. Now the only thing to know is that shares are being borrowed from FPLP participants or not (my shares haven't been borrowed in close to 2 months - I miss the days of earning a little or a lot for shares I can reasonably expect to still own 10 years from now).

I recognize increasing supply is counter-intuitive. A more accurate statement would be to see an increase in RELATIVE supply, where the rate charged to borrow shares is an indicator of the current balance between supply of shares to short sell, and demand for shares to short sell. Even if the absolute supply is shrinking.

I view a short squeeze as an extreme imbalance between a bunch of market factors, not all of them directly or exclusively having to do with short sellers. One of them being the number of shares in the float that are reasonably easy to trade - a large number of strong longs entering the market will tend to shrink the float, and that reduces the ability of any particular short sale to be closed.

Incidentally, if we see decreases in the total number of shares short in the twice monthly report, while rates stay low, that indicates to me that the aggregate short position is being unwound in a stable and rational fashion. That's an indicator that we won't be seeing a short squeeze or market panic.


Some context:
As recently as 6 months ago, I was being paid more like 5% (so shorts were paying ~10%) to borrow TSLA. There was a glorious day or 2, I think back in August (maybe September), where I got paid 14% (short sellers paid ~25% that day I think). That's been my own, pretty recent and brief experience.

I'm far from an expert, but my understanding has evolved to this point of view.

1) Actual information relevant to short activity is intentionally delayed and kept opaque by the market. Thus we are left to pick through secondary measures to try and understand what is going on.
2) A close to real time (daily) view of demand is a composite view of:
- the shares available to borrow
- the interest rate paid to establish and maintain a short position
- the borrowing of shares brokerages in their Fully Paid Lending Program (brokerages make the least money on these shares, so they are the last shares lent to short sellers)
3) The best longer term view of demand is the actual number of shares short, reported 2x/month with a 2 week delay (hence my first comment about intentional obfuscation by the market).
4) I haven't seen anybody talk about this, but my own gut reaction and feel about the short market, is that it's awfully manual. I get the impression that Fidelity literally makes adjustments at the end of each day regarding the number of shares that are available, which shares to return to lenders, which shares to borrow from lenders, what rate to charge borrowers, etc.. The market adjustments are all just a bit clunky to be a fully automated market with bid/ask quotes and constant market changes.

SIDEBAR: In the bad old days, prior to about 3 months ago, Fidelity set the rate paid to borrow TSLA from me (and other FPLP participants) separately from the rate they charged shorts to borrow the shares from Fidelity. Today, Fidelity would pay me 60% of what they charge to lend out my shares, so that is one fewer seemingly daily adjustments they need to make.


The first bit of context, is that Tesla has a ridiculously large short position. Order of magnitude (I haven't looked up recent numbers) - something like 30M shares short out of 170M shares. So around 1/6th. Other companies are considered to have high short interest at 3 or 5% of shares outstanding.

(A second sidebar - even if I were somebody that sold shares short on occasion, the size of the outstanding short position would keep me out. The trade is crowded and in the event of a short squeeze ... well, let's just say that the theater is way too crowded to empty quickly when/if somebody yells fire. People are going to get hurt if that happens).

The interest rate paid to establish and maintain a short position tells us something about demand to borrow shares and establish (or maintain) short positions. At 1%, relative to Tesla's history, this is relatively low demand.

Meanwhile, whether brokerages are borrowing shares through their FPLP tells us something more about supply. The first thing to know is that very few companies are so heavily shorted that a brokerage will pay anything to borrow those shares. Of the dozen or so companies I own shares in, they are all eligible to be lent out via Fidelity's FPLP - only TSLA has actually been lent out (and TSLA was the reason I signed up in the first place).

Fidelity isn't currently borrowing my shares, so even if they are the last shares Fidelity wants to lend out, Fidelity also has no problem taking 2/5ths of 5% if shorts want to pay 5% to sell shares short. They probably prefer taking 2/5ths of 5%, because they're also getting all 5% on the rest of the shares they've lent out (they appreciate all you folks owning shares on margin!). This isn't currently happening, so while the short sale trade looks crowded to me, I also see lots of room for the market to accommodate more participants with little change in the cost to participate in the trade.

Thank you for the detailed response. I appreciate you taking the time to write all that out.

I generally agree with your post. I think the type of development I would like to see, as a long-term investor, is an orderly and convincing increase in SP as indicated by declining number of number of shares short and stable borrowing rate.

If stock jumps above $1,000 and the borrowing rate also jumps, I would interpret that as shorts are looking to get back in and the inexplicable volatility in TSLA will continue.

If Model 3 ramp up goes smoothly and Tesla Energy grows leaps and bounds as Elon predicted, then we may finally see a more stable stock that actually acts like a large-cap stock.

I guess the one thing I would slightly disagree with you is the size of the short vs. float. I recognize by traditional measures 31 million shares short out of 120 million float leads to a short ratio of ~26%. I believe, however, that this is misleading, because a large portion of the float is in the hands of very long-term investors that don't normally trade day to day, so their shares would not be available for shorts to use to cover in a potential short squeeze. I believe T.Rowe's, Fidelity's, Ballie Gifford's, now Tencent's (and my!) shares should be excluded from the float in this calculation, so I estimate that the real short to float ratio is around ~50%.

Having said this, if the stock zooms above $1,000 in the coming months, then sure, these shares would be in play as well. But given that these investors were adding millions of shares in 4Q16, they clearly believe $300-400 and maybe even $500 per share doesn't cut it.

Interesting times ahead...
 
Ok, this probably belongs in the other thread. But I now think there is virtually no chance that the model 3 will be late. There are a lot of facts and hints I could list, but it comes down to this essential fact: The company hangs on the model 3 coming out, roughly in July. Everyone loves to point out the model X, but that is an invalid comparison, since it was a nice-to-have model and the S was doing well in the marketplace. With the X they used the time they had, rather than feeling any real pressure.

The prior release was the model S, which WAS an existential crisis, and they got it out on time.

Elon is itching to nail the M3 and move on to the next thing. Other factories, the semi, the truck, roofs etc. They need credibility. That is the one asset that they are in short supply. Too many people roll their eyes (hell even us fans do often) about his pie-in-the-sky plans. They need to do this to keep being able to raise capital and get favorable deals for land, big energy contracts, and supplier deals. They CANNOT mess this up. They CANNOT confirm the "Tesla can't execute" narrative.

They have been very vocal about how they designed the M3 to be easy to manufacture. I think they have made it REALLY easy to manufacture. There is a theory that they figured out how to the final assembly entirely with robots. That is consistent with Elon's plan to do exactly that and the fact that the open roof is part of the design. I think they figured out how to do the wiring with robots. I think they are planning on running a small line very fast.

The first cars are going to employees. If there are some due-bill items because the sun visors are late I think they will just ship them and fix it later.

Normally one has to consider the fact that a CEO doesn't really, cannot really, care about the stock price. But we are in those areas where the stock price really does materially affect the success of the company. If they botch the M3, my argument all reverses. The company survives but their plans are pushed out dramatically because the whole world will shift into wait-and-see mode on the model 3, which won't ship in really high volumes until Q1 or Q2 of next year.

With the model X, Elon gave them a nightmare: Make an impossible car with this list of ridiculous requirements. With the Model 3, Elon gave them a fat softball: Make a decent car (that's better than a BOLT, super low bars all around) that is cheap, fast and easy to manufacture. Instead of thinking of dual-hinge doors, Elon thought and said "the wiring install sucks. how do we fix that". The model X was a gift to buyers but kind of pain in the ass for shareholders. The model 3 will be a lesser product, but a gift to shareholders. A decent, profitable car that is designed to fly out like bullets.

The car will be out on time.

I agree with this 100%. The question then becomes this:

Given the number of analysts (i.e. basically all of them) who are banking on a super slow ramp up of Model 3, how quickly (and how much) will analysts change their targets once Tesla proves that it can indeed ship at a run-rate of 500k cars per year by 2017 Year End? Right now Adam Jonas has the stock at like $350 if I remember correctly based on them barely shipping Model 3s in 2018 (something like 20k or less). If the Model 3 projection of shipped cars by 2018 suddenly jumps by a factor of 20, the target stock price for all these analysts will jump up by at least a factor of 2. And again - these targets do not include things like battery storage, solar roofs, semi, Model Y, Pick Up truck, etc etc etc.

Tesla should be able to guide to a number by the Q2 ER for Model 3, since they will need to give guidance for the rest of the year (unless they are able to give guidance for the rest of the year comes May's ER, which I think is a wasted bullet if they are on track to exit 2017 at 500k cars per year).

To be honest - this "short squeeze" has a potential to be a multi-year long run up into the stratosphere if Tesla becomes a manufacturing tour-de-force, which has been a huge directive from Elon for the past year. There will be bumps along the way, but a $200bn market cap is within reach in 1-2 year's time.
 
Great read that should bring us back to earth at a moment like this and look things realistically for a second. Maybe just for a second...LOL https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/11/...ecommendation&src=rechp&WT.nav=RecEngine&_r=0
This is more likely a FUD piece. That article also quotes that guy from Pennsylvania who took his Tesla MS off-road for mushroom picking, had his car break down and then raised a stink demanding free repairs post warranty. That was a clear giveaway
 
Ok, this probably belongs in the other thread. But I now think there is virtually no chance that the model 3 will be late. There are a lot of facts and hints I could list, but it comes down to this essential fact: The company hangs on the model 3 coming out, roughly in July. Everyone loves to point out the model X, but that is an invalid comparison, since it was a nice-to-have model and the S was doing well in the marketplace. With the X they used the time they had, rather than feeling any real pressure.

The prior release was the model S, which WAS an existential crisis, and they got it out on time.

Elon is itching to nail the M3 and move on to the next thing. Other factories, the semi, the truck, roofs etc. They need credibility. That is the one asset that they are in short supply. Too many people roll their eyes (hell even us fans do often) about his pie-in-the-sky plans. They need to do this to keep being able to raise capital and get favorable deals for land, big energy contracts, and supplier deals. They CANNOT mess this up. They CANNOT confirm the "Tesla can't execute" narrative.

They have been very vocal about how they designed the M3 to be easy to manufacture. I think they have made it REALLY easy to manufacture. There is a theory that they figured out how to the final assembly entirely with robots. That is consistent with Elon's plan to do exactly that and the fact that the open roof is part of the design. I think they figured out how to do the wiring with robots. I think they are planning on running a small line very fast.

The first cars are going to employees. If there are some due-bill items because the sun visors are late I think they will just ship them and fix it later.

Normally one has to consider the fact that a CEO doesn't really, cannot really, care about the stock price. But we are in those areas where the stock price really does materially affect the success of the company. If they botch the M3, my argument all reverses. The company survives but their plans are pushed out dramatically because the whole world will shift into wait-and-see mode on the model 3, which won't ship in really high volumes until Q1 or Q2 of next year.

With the model X, Elon gave them a nightmare: Make an impossible car with this list of ridiculous requirements. With the Model 3, Elon gave them a fat softball: Make a decent car (that's better than a BOLT, super low bars all around) that is cheap, fast and easy to manufacture. Instead of thinking of dual-hinge doors, Elon thought and said "the wiring install sucks. how do we fix that". The model X was a gift to buyers but kind of pain in the ass for shareholders. The model 3 will be a lesser product, but a gift to shareholders. A decent, profitable car that is designed to fly out like bullets.

The car will be out on time.
Even if it's a few months late I don't think that would be a big deal, more than a few months and I'd start to worry.
 
Did I miss this? I don't see how anyone survives a plummet off a 500 foot cliff, but the occupants of a Model S did. Does anyone think this amazing story will move TSLA higher tomorrow? Tesla driver says Model S ‘saved his life’ after walking away unscathed from a crash ~500-ft down a hill

I don't know, the after market is a bit down.

But I think those kind of stories serve more as maintaining the SP if it's on an upward trajectory, or limiting it if it's one a downfall trajectory. I don't think it really makes any difference except a little.
 
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I guess the one thing I would slightly disagree with you is the size of the short vs. float. I recognize by traditional measures 31 million shares short out of 120 million float leads to a short ratio of ~26%. I believe, however, that this is misleading, because a large portion of the float is in the hands of very long-term investors that don't normally trade day to day, so their shares would not be available for shorts to use to cover in a potential short squeeze. I believe T.Rowe's, Fidelity's, Ballie Gifford's, now Tencent's (and my!) shares should be excluded from the float in this calculation, so I estimate that the real short to float ratio is around ~50%.

.....

Your calculation of the float is better / more functional. It's easy to see that Elon's shares aren't available for purchase until he's ready to get out of the car gig for instance. My shares are dear, but more easy to be had (money will do!). It's also squishier in that you shift from definitely not available shares to probably not available shares as you work your way along that continuum.

Either way, the conclusion for me is the same - even if I believe so strongly that Tesla was a week away from bankruptcy, I'd just be sad that I was too late to the party. Cuz if the folks at that party are wrong, there are way too many of them AT the party for it to end well.

Well - for them that is. For me, I anticipate another hefty downpayment on retirement the next few years, partly due to the conviction with which short sellers hold their opinion of Tesla.
 
Did I miss this? I don't see how anyone survives a plummet off a 500 foot cliff, but the occupants of a Model S did. Does anyone think this amazing story will move TSLA higher tomorrow? Tesla driver says Model S ‘saved his life’ after walking away unscathed from a crash ~500-ft down a hill

That's new. Better than the usual "Autop!lot drives car off 500ft cl!ff" headline. Amazing story, awesome that they took ownership of the accident and really glad they're okay.
 
Your calculation of the float is better / more functional. It's easy to see that Elon's shares aren't available for purchase until he's ready to get out of the car gig for instance. My shares are dear, but more easy to be had (money will do!). It's also squishier in that you shift from definitely not available shares to probably not available shares as you work your way along that continuum.

Either way, the conclusion for me is the same - even if I believe so strongly that Tesla was a week away from bankruptcy, I'd just be sad that I was too late to the party. Cuz if the folks at that party are wrong, there are way too many of them AT the party for it to end well.

Well - for them that is. For me, I anticipate another hefty downpayment on retirement the next few years, partly due to the conviction with which short sellers hold their opinion of Tesla.

I agree. And I like the way you put it: functional float on a continuum. You may have opened the doors for a finance phd.

I think the 10x size of the last big short squeeze kept TSLA in their playbook, but if the stock doubles or triples from here, i can't see shorts coming back in a big way: It's much harder to short half of "functional float" of a $100 billion company. This may be it for the shorts.

I see several possible scenarios that may cause shorts to throw in the towel:

1) SolarCity synergies boost the bottom line in a meaningful way in-line with guidance from Elon musk at the time of the acquisition (6 months for meaningful cost synergies)

2) Model 3 ramp up on track or ahead of schedule (ie. July production start with guidance for 100k+ deliveries in 2H17)

3) indications/guidance for superexponential growth guidance (where the growth rate itself is increasing) for Tesla Energy

Until any one of these happen, I don't see shorts throwing in the towel.
 
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$TSLA while not strictly a morning star or an abandoned baby pattern this essentially follows the spirit of an island reversal Very bullish
Hollow red is highly significant
 
I thought parts of that NYT article sounded familiar. It was dated 4/11 and mentioned here last week.

NYT running a negative article on Tesla? I'm shocked!

For new members or investors who may not have known about Tesla's infant days of fighting "fake news" and smear campaigns against clean energy. The New York Times wrote a scathing review of a MS in 2013 "running out of juice/batteries" and published pictures of the car getting towed off. It caused the stock to tank as a result, but with a little digging, it was later revealed that the author, John Broder, was a paid oil industry writer. This was only exposed after Elon published the famous "Tesla Logs" to show that Broder purposely ran the car down to empty and did not charge the car to 100% on a long trip. It placed the New York Times in a very embarrassing and uncomfortable PR position. Due to these types of FUD, many veteran investors here are now immune to "fake news". I for one refuse to ever get click bait to anything involving the NYT anymore.

Problems With Precision and Judgment, but Not Integrity, in Tesla Test
 
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OK here are my hypothetical longer-term projections for tesla it is likely to run up between now and earnings at a steady pace and then we are likely to have a bullish gap up after earnings and then there is the real risk for shorts that at some point we may have A Porsche Volkswagen like squeeze that happened in 2008 October I believe in Porsche Volkswagen squeeze only 13% of the float was sold short here it is 27% of the float sold short as the bullish momentum gather steam longs are going to be more reluctant to part with their shares and at some point there may be a parabolic short squeeze with an unsustainable stock movement and that would be the time to sell tesla that squeeze may occur within a very short period of time So it will be extremely important to watch day today stock movement of Tesla for the next several months to take full advantage of that short squeeze because if Tesla is not sold into that parabolic unsustainable more than lot of profit may be left on the table now this is entirely a hypothetical scenario and I could be totally wrong but I'm watching Tesla minute by minute every day
After that parabolic move and unsustainable stock price movement is exhausted stock may sharply correct over a period of several weeks to couple of months and that would be the time to buy it again and make another 50 to hundred percent profit so this is an eminently trade able stock long-term holders just buy-and-hold will do just fine but this great opportunity and tremendous traffic profit potential for swing traders like me and especially for those traders like me who are holding tons of call options it would be a great opportunity to make tremendous profits
Now my usual caveat that this is entirely my hypothetical personal opinion and NOT an advice or trading recommendation and I'm more likely to be wrong than right and lose my shirt
 
For new members or investors who may not have known about Tesla's infant days of fighting "fake news" and smear campaigns against clean energy. The New York Times wrote a scathing review of a MS in 2013 "running out of juice/batteries" and published pictures of the car getting towed off. It caused the stock to tank as a result, but with a little digging, it was later revealed that the author, John Broder, was a paid oil industry writer. It was only exposed after Elon published the famous "Tesla Logs" to show that Broder purposely ran the car down to empty and did not charge the car to 100% on a long trip. This put the New York Times in a very embarrassing and uncomfortable position. Due to these types of FUD, many veteran investors here are now immune to "fake news". I for one refuse to ever get click bait to anything involving the NYT anymore.

Problems With Precision and Judgment, but Not Integrity, in Tesla Test

For the newer members, this incident spawned the verb "to broder": Urban Dictionary: Broder

It's too bad we don't have more opportunity to use the word, but people who aren't intentionally trying to do so rarely run out of charge on their Teslas.
 
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