70D and Winter Performance/Range

RockinWithKids · Dec 1, 2015

Now that the meteorological winter is here I would like to start a very self serving (looking to order a MS in the next 3 months and live in Minnesota) thread on the 70D and winter performance (specifically around real world range). Questions:

1. What was the longest trip you've taken during winter in your 70D in temperatures that were below 40F?
2. What was the temperature (approximately) during your driving?
3. Did you get the range you expected?
4. Did you do anything heroic to make some big "jumps" (ie distances over 200 miles)?

TIA!

rjcbox · Dec 1, 2015

I researched similar expectations before my purchase 6mo ago. The most extreme example I read on TMC was driving in New Jersey dead of winter, good cabin heating, on NJ I95 Interstate at high speeds and burning miles almost 2 for 1.

I don't baby my driving at all and drive it like prior cars. In my experience over past month, I burn through ~1.5-1.6 miles range per 1 projected mile range on a 50-mile round-trip. This accounts for the car sitting in a cold parking lot overnight X 10 hours not plugged in, then preheating for 5-10min from ~45degrees to 85 degrees, and "paying" for it w/ 10 miles (~3kWh) which I gladly will pay for a toasty cabin in the wee hours of the morning. Not exact answers to your questions since I've only started my 1st winter experience, but hope it helps as a point of reference

gmetrail · Dec 2, 2015

If you didn't see it, check out the blog entry Doug wrote on the subject: Cold Weather Driving - Blogs - Tesla Motors Club - Enthusiasts & Owners Forum

David_Cary · Dec 2, 2015

I have a very early 70D and I got it in May of 2015. Since Australia is always behind the US, no one has driven a 70D in the winter. Obviously range estimates in cold from the other models can be used.

Maybe Da Nort Woods is a famous place I've never heard of. Maybe a joke. Either way, you are asking a location dependent question so you probably should be exact on your location.

I went from Cary to Charlotte on T-day morning. I passed some hills and got down to 42. I started at 232. Landed at 77. It was 145 mile trip. But probably not the kind of winter you were thinking of.

RockinWithKids · Dec 2, 2015

David_Cary said:
Maybe Da Nort Woods is a famous place I've never heard of. Maybe a joke. Either way, you are asking a location dependent question so you probably should be exact on your location.

Da Nort Woods = Minnesota

I will update my original post to be a bit more clear.

- - - Updated - - -

gmetrail said:
If you didn't see it, check out the blog entry Doug wrote on the subject: Cold Weather Driving - Blogs - Tesla Motors Club - Enthusiasts & Owners Forum

Hadn't seen the blog. Will give it a read. Thanks!

Max* · Dec 2, 2015

I took a trip recently, temps were... moderately cold. not severe though. I want to say high 30s.

My wh/mi increased from the 260-280 range to the 300-320 range (same trip, I've taken it many times), going the same speed (about 75mph). I might have snapped a photo somewhere, I want to say I did about 180 miles and still had charge left.

I would guesstimate I could have pushed it to 200 miles on a 100% charge, going 75mph in the high 30s.

My guesstimate comes a little higher than Tesla's estimate on their webpage at Model S | Tesla Motors

Armadillos · Dec 2, 2015

Drove from my house in Denver, CO up to Copper Mountain, going over a 11,000 foot mountain pass, with the temperatures at around 20F. Left the house with the 70D at 240 miles, got to the mountain with 102. I would usually have about 140 or so in the summer. It's 68 miles from my house to the mountain.

RockinWithKids · Dec 2, 2015

Armadillos said:
Drove from my house in Denver, CO up to Copper Mountain, going over a 11,000 foot mountain pass, with the temperatures at around 20F. Left the house with the 70D at 240 miles, got to the mountain with 102. I would usually have about 140 or so in the summer. It's 68 miles from my house to the mountain.

Very helpful... thanks. Is the speed limit over the pass is around 60MPH?

MrClown · Dec 2, 2015

mn4az said:
Very helpful... thanks. Is the speed limit over the pass is around 60MPH?

It's 65 pretty much the whole way except for some construction and a couple miles at 50 at the very top.

NC70D · Dec 5, 2015

Not quite that low of a temperature for me. But, thought I would add my data from yesterday. Drove 142 miles and went from 238 Rated Miles (Full charge at delivery) arrived home with 71 Rated Miles. Kept cruise set to 75 for most of the trip (A little under/over here and there). Average Temps were around 55F. Range mode was toggled many times while I "tried" to see if it helped. (I determined due to too many factors, I could make no determination yet about range mode) So, 55F at approx. 75 mph, I saw 142 miles take 167 miles of range.

CHGolferJim · Dec 5, 2015

Good data point: 118% of RM @ 55*F @ 75 mph. I'm traveling to Beaufort and Charleston next week on various types of roads, and will report.

[BTW, EVTripPlanner estimates 132% for an 85D from Raleigh Tesla to Wrightsville Beach, 1.1, 55*, 70*, 173/131.]

NC70D · Dec 5, 2015

Just drove this morning from Wilmington to Emerald Isle. Mid-fifties, 89 miles and used only 87 Rated Miles. Autopilot set at 59 most of the way, on flat ground. Nice to get Rated miles on a route I drive alot.

RockinWithKids · Dec 19, 2015

Now that we've had some days that it's been 10-20F, at least here in MN, I am bumping this thread to get some more real world data. This thread will help me with a 70D v 85RWD vs 85D decision. TIA for your real world experiences.

mn4az said:
Now that the meteorological winter is here I would like to start a very self serving (looking to order a MS in the next 3 months and live in Minnesota) thread on the 70D and winter performance (specifically around real world range). Questions:

1. What was the longest trip you've taken during winter in your 70D in temperatures that were below 40F?
2. What was the temperature (approximately) during your driving?
3. Did you get the range you expected?
4. Did you do anything heroic to make some big "jumps" (ie distances over 200 miles)?

TIA!

JeffS · Dec 19, 2015

This is harder to do than you think. Even driving 25miles running errands on a Saturday, can vary depending how you drive it. Start up heat for cabin and battery really suck up the energy. Amortize that start up heat over 25mi in one non stop trip, and you will see one result. Do it in five 5mi bursts, with a cold soak in between, and it will be different.

I am in WI, and in summer, I get 4ish miles per kWh. In spring and fall, I get 3ish miles per kWh. In the ultra cold, I can see range as low as 2mi per kWh. In a 70, you have about 55kWhs to work with. Below zero temps on a cold soak, heat on, no preheat, you could get as low as 1mi/kWh for a short time.

Said another way, my daily commute is 36 miles. I have used as little as 8kWhs on a gorgeous July day. And I have used as much as 29kWhs in a very cold snowstorm with stop and go snow covered roads both ways the whole way.

Hopefully that helps?

Max* · Dec 19, 2015

Something about that math is a little off, rounding maybe?

4miles/kw * 55kw = 220 miles in good weather. I've done 220 miles, going 75mph and still had about 7% left (another 15-20 miles)

RockinWithKids · Dec 19, 2015

JeffS said:
This is harder to do than you think. Even driving 25miles running errands on a Saturday, can vary depending how you drive it. Start up heat for cabin and battery really suck up the energy. Amortize that start up heat over 25mi in one non stop trip, and you will see one result. Do it in five 5mi bursts, with a cold soak in between, and it will be different.

I am in WI, and in summer, I get 4ish miles per kWh. In spring and fall, I get 3ish miles per kWh. In the ultra cold, I can see range as low as 2mi per kWh. In a 70, you have about 55kWhs to work with. Below zero temps on a cold soak, heat on, no preheat, you could get as low as 1mi/kWh for a short time.

Said another way, my daily commute is 36 miles. I have used as little as 8kWhs on a gorgeous July day. And I have used as much as 29kWhs in a very cold snowstorm with stop and go snow covered roads both ways the whole way.

Hopefully that helps?

Sort of. I am mostly concerned about road trips during the coldest MN/WI days in which you'd average 65MPH. Thus, in your experience, on one of those cold days (ie around zero degrees) what be the longest distance you'd want to safely drive in your 70D with a 100% charge?

FWIW... Based on my research I am assuming about 125 miles at 65MPH, zero degrees F, heat on and 19 inch wheels. Just trying to figure out if that is reasonably close to what others have experienced to know if I am close.

jerry33 · Dec 19, 2015

mn4az said:
Sort of. I am mostly concerned about road trips during the coldest MN/WI days in which you'd average 65MPH. Thus, in your experience, on one of those cold days (ie around zero degrees) what be the longest distance you'd want to safely drive in your 70D with a 100% charge?

About 170 miles for an S85 in -20 to -30 weather. Less if the roads are snow covered. I imagine the D70 wouldn't be much different.

JeffS · Dec 19, 2015

Milwaukee to Minneapolis, in summer I go straight through to LaCrosse. In winter I top up in Madison. 170mi is easy. 210 is easy as well. When on road trips, you can always slow down. If you have to go 200mi, and its ridiculously cold, just slow down a bit.

I post this just as example. 125 miles after preconditioning in winter, you can probably do that at 80mph.

RockinWithKids · Dec 20, 2015

Thanks JeffS and jerry33. Really hope somebody here owns a 70D and can/will validate range at 65MPH when temps are near zero degrees F with heat on. My assumption is that 100 miles at an 80% charge or 125 miles at a 100% charge is totally doable/safe. But would love to know from a 70D owner if that is a good estimate or if the range is actually better/worse.

FWIW... When we pull the trigger on an MS we'll be an all EV family and thus am weighing a well optioned 70D vs less optioned 85/85D.

sbradbury · Dec 20, 2015

I have a 70D in MN, unfortunately we haven't had anything close to 0 degrees yet so my information won't be anything new. On the coldest days we've had so far, ~20f I see between 325-350wh/mile. I also always start with a pre-heated cabin and park in an insulated garage.

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