Fisker Karma

[Palpatine]

Somebody is fudging some numbers somewhere.

We still have our Fisker deposit on the Karma. It's only $1K.

Then their 1,300 deposits is even less impressive. If a bunch of them at at $1,000 that is about the equivalent of the Aptera deposit of $500. There might be a lot of non-serious buyers on the Fisker list.

Here is where I think Fisker made a good move. They have 30 premium auto dealers signed up. They will have a network to work through right away. I am not sure about the Tesla model of building all of their own stores.

 

[vfx]

... If a bunch of them at at $1,000 that is about the equivalent of the Aptera deposit of $500. ...

Well it could be they they have 1,300 at $5K and some X amount of the older deposits at $1K.
I'm just saying fudging, not sure how they are playing with ratios.

 

[Kevin Harney]

Do I see a new benchmark for TM ?!?! More deposits on the Model S than Fisker has on the Karma.

 

[Palpatine]

Do I see a new benchmark for TM ?!?! More deposits on the Model S than Fisker has on the Karma.

I think so. It will be a fair method to judge customer acceptance of the EV vs PHEV concepts. Are people willing to pay an extra $30,000 for the crutch of having an ICE for long range?

I think Fisker made a mistake by skipping the X Prize competition. Tesla and Aptera are going to get a ton of free media from this process. Every time they get a favorable mention, it will send people to the website and goose the deposit base.

 

[dpeilow]

Total finger in the air, but I wouldn't be surprised if we see the $87k Fisker vs. the $87k Model S-300. Then it will be an interesting race.

 

[graham]

It will be a fair method to judge customer acceptance of the EV vs PHEV concepts.

I have a feeling that most periodicals will boil it down to that. And while there is a grain of truth to the matter, it really just shows whether more people are convinced to buy the Model S than are convinced to buy the Karma. A portion of that decision will have to do with people's acceptance of either drive train. But cost, size, design, availability, random biases and fears and weirdnesses will all play into it.

if the Model S is less accepted than the Karma it could be because people don't like the size as much. Or people might like the design of the S over the Karma regardless the drive train.

 

[doug]

Fisker Explains Why You Want A Karma Over A Roadster Or Model S (VIDEO)

 

[vfx]

Classy, factual and professional.

I hope Tesla (Elon) can keep it going with the "there's room for everyone" take on the choices.

 

[AnOutsider]

So well spoken. He's definitely got the upperhand in PR and likability. No potshots like Elon takes... I may take a closer look at the karma, but I'm definitely more for the Model S

 

[stopcrazypp]

Classy, factual and professional.

I hope Tesla (Elon) can keep it going with the "there's room for everyone" take on the choices.

So well spoken. He's definitely got the upperhand in PR and likability. No potshots like Elon takes... I may take a closer look at the karma, but I'm definitely more for the Model S

Definitely agreed, Fisker still hasn't made any enemies in the media yet and so far haven't pulled anything shady. We all know Elon/Tesla has already made a couple of enemies in the media and there were more than a few decisions by him that were questionable. Keeping the "room in the market" argument will help it so Tesla doesn't make more enemies in the market (seems like no grudge is held over the lawsuit, which is a good thing).

 

[graham]

Absolutely. Henrik is a much better and more politic speaker than Elon (or Bob Lutz for that matter).

The "there is enough room for everybody" is a much better message. And one that Elon skated on in the Churchill Club video explaining that the Model S was not a "5 series killer". I hope he continues to grow in that direction.

Of course, videos like this are not nearly as entertaining as "my adversary is a douchebag!..."

 

[AnOutsider]

Of course, videos like this are not nearly as entertaining as "my adversary is a douchebag!..."

Definitely not.. but if Fisker was making a nearly identical car to the Model S... I'd definitely want my money in their pockets over Tesla's (based on spokespersons alone).

 

[vfx]

Elon has been good about not bashing other car makers even welcoming them when he wants to point out that the goal of Tesla (SpaceX, Solar City) was to change the world.

I believe Tesla has.


OTOH Fisker was a bit snippy about Tesla back during the whole "suing" episode. Understandably.

 

[doug]

Technology Review: First Plug-in Hybrid to Be Sold in the United States

 

[vfx]

Technology Review: First Plug-in Hybrid to Be Sold in the United States

The first plug-in hybrid to be sold in the United States will likely be the Fisker Karma, which is due out in November.

That's 7 months from now. Don't you think that they would be giving rides to press, buyers, test rides on different surfaces, drives for Politicians, appearances at some of their many dealer locations? 'Bout time there are some first person outside perspectives on the car's ride.

 

[Chris H.]

I like the bit when he says "for those people who drive less than 50 miles, you can drive emissions-free all day long, umm, as long as you stay under 50 miles" (at ~1:50). Let's see, that would be an average speed of slightly over 2 mph...

 

[AnOutsider]

I like the bit when he says "for those people who drive less than 50 miles, you can drive emissions-free all day long, umm, as long as you stay under 50 miles" (at ~1:50). Let's see, that would be an average speed of slightly over 2 mph...

I think he meant 50 miles distance, not speed right?

 

[vfx]

I think he meant 50 miles distance, not speed right?

I read it like Chris did. The question I asked myself when he said that was, What was he thinking?, Or what did he mean, or think he meant?.

Was he confusing the drive 50 miles on Electric plug in power, then "drive all day" on gasoline and confuse the two power sources?

Maybe he wishes you can drive all day in his car fully on Electric.

Maybe the new low cost car will be all EV and he was thinking about that one.

 

[AnOutsider]

I really read it as "Drive all day as long as you keep it under 50 miles". For example, run to work, run to the dry cleaners, run to the store etc... which is all possible if they're in a relatively close proximity to your house.

 

[doug]

Fisker dealer network:

Fisker, Tesla differ on store strategy - Automotive News

Fisker, Tesla differ on store strategy | The Car Tech blog - CNET Reviews

...
By signing franchised dealers, Fisker will have an immediate nationwide retail presence for its $87,900 hybrid-electric Karma sedan. So far Fisker has assigned dealerships for 37 territories. The company wants to expand to about 40 territories signed by year end.

Tom Price's Price Family Dealerships will handle northern California for Fisker, but he doesn't fault Tesla's process.

"It's fine for Tesla to sell a few roadsters a month with a factory store model," Price said. "But selling cars in any kind of volume, you need a retailer who understands the market; who can deal with used cars, service and customer follow-up."

Fisker's requirements for Price were relatively low: a distinct sales display area with a carport, as well as the purchase of parts inventory and availability of trained mechanics.
...

Fisker's first dealers
These dealers have signed up for Fisker Automotive franchises.

COMPANY | DEALER | FRANCHISE TERRITORY

Barrett Holdings | Charles Barrett | San Antonio
Bergen Jaguar | Dennis Squitieri | Bergen County, N.J.
Bergstrom Corp. | John Bergstrom | Green Bay, Wis.
Borton Automotive | Kjell Bergh | Minnesota
Capitol Cadillac | Daniel Jobe | Maryland
Century Automotive | Tracy Jones | Alabama
Classic Cadillac/Subaru of Atlanta | Mike Domenicone | Atlanta
Dorschel Automotive | Richard Dorschel | Rochester, N.Y.
Elder Automotive | Rob Elder | Tampa Bay, Fla.
Fields Auto Group | Dan Fields | Orlando, Fla.; Illinois; British Columbia
Flow Co. | Don Flow | North Carolina
Frank Kent Motor Co. | Corrie Churchill | Fort Worth, Texas
H.A. Ott Motor Cars | Chip Ott | Philadelphia
Jaguar of Great Neck | Jack Weidinger | Long Island, N.Y.
Jake Kaplan's Limited | Sheree Kaplan | Boston, Rhode Island
M2 Motors | Bernardo Moreno | Ohio
Manhattan Motor Cars | Brian Miller | Manhattan, N.Y.
Marvin K. Brown Auto | Dave Grundstrom | San Diego
Miller Motorcars | Richard Koppelman | Greenwich, Conn.
O'Brien Auto Group | Mike O'Brien | Washington state
Palm Beach Motor Cars | Robert Simpson | Palm Beach, Fla.
Patrick Dealer Group | Martin Stilwell | Illinois
Plaza Motors | John Capps | Missouri
Price Family Dealerships | Tom Price | San Jose, San Francisco, Sacramento
Rickenbaugh Cadillac | Mary Pacifico-Valley | Denver
Roger Beasley Highline | David Stein | Austin, Texas
Ron Tonkin Family | Ron Tonkin | Portland, Ore.
Serra Automotive | Joe Serra | Michigan; Pasadena, Calif.
Shelly Automotive | Damon Shelly | Orange County, Calif.
Sullivan Luxury Cars | Mike Sullivan | Beverly Hills, Santa Monica, Calif.
Ted Britt Auto Group | Raymond Britt | northern Virginia
Warren Henry Autos | Warren Zinn | Miami​