X Fan
Active Member
Hah
it’s the ones that have a left hand signal but immediately go 3 lanes to the right I worry about.
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FSD v12.x (end to end AI)
- Thread starter Buckminster
- Start date
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- #fixphantombraking autopilot chill is not chill elon is an ass fix fsd extreme late deceleration fsd does not commit to go fsd does not maintain proper speed fsd hard and late braking fsd has decision wobble fsd jerky driving fsd late deceleration fsd sometimes may not detect train crossings fsd stops too early too quickly fsd stops too far behind line fsd tailgating in city streets
Todd Burch
14-Year Member
The Litmus test:
If you can look at video from Chuck’s cameras and determine the right time to go purely from that video, the cameras are sufficient and so can AI. By looking at the output of the cameras you remove the advantage eyes have over the camera.
Since we can all do this, the limitation has never been visual acuity of the cameras. It’s been the quality of the control code/neural nets on the planning side.
If you can look at video from Chuck’s cameras and determine the right time to go purely from that video, the cameras are sufficient and so can AI. By looking at the output of the cameras you remove the advantage eyes have over the camera.
Since we can all do this, the limitation has never been visual acuity of the cameras. It’s been the quality of the control code/neural nets on the planning side.
Simple turns are not having to cross traffic, especially high speed traffic going in both directions. Chuck's turn is not simple but any measure.
Chuck Cook's turn problem is the median is too short. The road builders have the land enough for at least 2 cars to wait before changing to the right lane. I wonder why they didn't use it.
jabloomf1230
Minister of Silly Walks
If you're speaking in terms of pure ability to resolve specific objects (as opposed to a big landscape scene), this is not accurate. Foveal receptor density is not that dissimilar to the pixel density of the IMX480 sensor that is on the HW4 cars. So the ability to achieve some sort of similar arc-minute acuity is theoretically possible, although the ability to move the eye in a dynamic scene obviously confers a considerable advantage beyond pure acuity.
Iain
Member
I find most of my disengagements these days are navigation problems. This is just one of the problems in my neighborhood, navigation has you doing a u-turn as apposed ro a protected left turn.
Nav shows this kind of thing for a few intersections near me as well, but 12.3.x has generally ignored the nav and done it the correct way anyways. For most of my cases, the Nav's silly U-turn isn't very far ahead, usually <= 1/4 mile. Perhaps the distance to the U-turn makes a difference in whether FSD can figure out the shortcut.
Related to that point: While in the last stretch of driving home, the main road of my neighborhood runs fairly close behind my house (behind my back fence, across a thin treeline). I pass the rear of my house shortly before I make two quick right turns and drive back the other way to my actual driveway (past another 10 houses or so on the way). FSD has had some variable behavior during this final stretch: sometimes it acts normally and waits to put on the blinker for the first right turn about when a human would (well past the back of my house, close to the turn itself). But sometimes, it edges a little closer to the right-hand curb and puts on the blinker much earlier and slows a bit, just as I'm nearing the back of my house on the main road. It seems like it's basically hunting for an impossible shortcut because my house (the wrong side of it) looks so close in terms of absolute distance.
PianoAl
Active Member
Humans have a "visual range" of 16,000 light years. My Tesla sees the sun which is 93 million miles away.
Doesn't help with UPLs.
With turns like that, if there's significant traffic, I turn right and do a U-turn.
It is technically a left turn lane from the highway and NOT a merge into trafic lane. In GA it is illegal (and I bet FL too) to pull into a left turn lane unless you are turning left off the road it is on. In fact there is a YouTuber named Jeebs who's girlfriend or wife pulled into one and got a ticket in Nevada I think.
Todd Burch
14-Year Member
Absolutely, I see a lot of silly stuff like this too.
Tesla needs to open up a way to crowdsource corrections for these routing issues, and be responsive to fixing them. I'm sure it's on their roadmap, but maybe not their priority until we get a little closer to robotaxi-ready.
Tesla likely uses Mapbox's Navigation engine. It may be customized in some way but routes would be Mapbox's fault/credit.
Maybe switch to HERE WeGo! (formerly Nokia Maps)
Mapbox or HERE? A Comparison of Mapping API Powerhouses
Businesses have no shortage of mapping providers to use. But which one among powerhouses is best? Let’s compare HERE versus Mapbox.
www.adci.com
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Yes - 3 miles away a car is a dot or a speck of dust moving.
Anyway, the point is - our eyes didn't evolve to combat UPL. So, what our eyes can do is not what we need for UPL.
I've had similar disengagements in the past along this same line as well. I've had many rigs gear brake on the highway to slow down - especially in heavy/slow traffic - FSD has always had challenges when it doesn't see brake lights - which is not uncommon with rigs or manual transmission cars that sometime use gear braking. It eventually picks up the fact that the lead vehicle is slowing down - but it results in FSD braking late and unnecessarily heavy - which escalates the risk of getting rear ended IME.
the problem with UPL is to constantly extrapolate the vehicles location that are moving in from the left side, as well as from the right side and find a safe enough time gap to be able to move your vehicle across both sides of the road. Now if any vehicle speeds up while you are performing the extrapolation, you are in trouble.
Didn't someone say Tesla extracts GPS data and builds its own map tiles?Maybe switch to HERE WeGo! (formerly Nokia Maps)
Mapbox or HERE? A Comparison of Mapping API Powerhouses
Businesses have no shortage of mapping providers to use. But which one among powerhouses is best? Let’s compare HERE versus Mapbox.
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That is just about the routing engine they use. For the mapping data they apparently aggregate from various sources likely including HERE and for sure they have used Open Street Maps.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Yeah also totally unnecessary! Just go when it is clear. Who wants to be sitting in the middle off the road anyway? Need to get your momentum up for merging with traffic. May as well not stop.
I just started my FSD(S) trial.
Is there an accepted way to terminate a drive without it showing as a disengagement?
I drove to the store and it took me to the front door, correctly. However when I attempted to take over in order to park, it asked about my disengagement, which seemed wrong. How should I take over in that case?
Is there an accepted way to terminate a drive without it showing as a disengagement?
I drove to the store and it took me to the front door, correctly. However when I attempted to take over in order to park, it asked about my disengagement, which seemed wrong. How should I take over in that case?
