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Winter wheels/tires packages for Model S
- Thread starter mlascano
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
I'm agonizing over winter tires. I really want Hakkapeliitta R. I have them on my current EV, and they're great. They have the lowest rolling resistance of any winter tire I've tried, and are really very good overall.
Winter in Oslo in the best case means roads covered by a thin layer of brown, slippery mixture of mud and road salt. More commonly half-frozen slush will pack the wheel wells full and freeze solid overnight. We get new snow from time to time, occasionally lots of it. Most of the winter, cornering grip is but a fond summer memory, and you're happy as long as you can keep the ice out of your wheel wells so the springs can move more than 3.5 cm. No, I don't have a heated garage. And I do love snow and winter, except in combination with cars and road salt.
I want the best winter tires, and I change them early. The only makes I'll even consider buying right now are Michelin and Nokian, their top studless tires are very good and have very low rolling resistance. Possibly Continental, too, although their rolling resistance isn't quite as good. However, in 245/45-R19 all of these tires are very expensive.
Is it possible to downsize to 235/55-R17 for winter use? That would save me about USD 160 to 175 per tire, and narrower, taller tires have less tendency to plane on snow and slush too. The difference in circumference is 1.8 percent. Wouldn't handling be better overall, considering the generally awful driving conditions? I don't care much about looks for wheels/tires for winter use, unless they look totally wrong. They will get banged up anyway.
Winter in Oslo in the best case means roads covered by a thin layer of brown, slippery mixture of mud and road salt. More commonly half-frozen slush will pack the wheel wells full and freeze solid overnight. We get new snow from time to time, occasionally lots of it. Most of the winter, cornering grip is but a fond summer memory, and you're happy as long as you can keep the ice out of your wheel wells so the springs can move more than 3.5 cm. No, I don't have a heated garage. And I do love snow and winter, except in combination with cars and road salt.
I want the best winter tires, and I change them early. The only makes I'll even consider buying right now are Michelin and Nokian, their top studless tires are very good and have very low rolling resistance. Possibly Continental, too, although their rolling resistance isn't quite as good. However, in 245/45-R19 all of these tires are very expensive.
Is it possible to downsize to 235/55-R17 for winter use? That would save me about USD 160 to 175 per tire, and narrower, taller tires have less tendency to plane on snow and slush too. The difference in circumference is 1.8 percent. Wouldn't handling be better overall, considering the generally awful driving conditions? I don't care much about looks for wheels/tires for winter use, unless they look totally wrong. They will get banged up anyway.
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mknox
Well-Known Member
You're describing conditions that sound very much like parts of Ontario, Canada where I live. I remember a couple of years ago having to find a heated garage (my attached garage at home was still below freezing) to let my car sit and melt the ice out of the wheels and wheel wells. The ice inside the rims caused terrible vibrations and the build-up in the wheel wells restricted my steering to a few degrees left or right! The stuff was solid, too. No way to chip it out by hand.
Narrower tires do provide better winter traction. I use slightly narrower winter tires myself, but try to keep the same overall diameter. There are on-line tools that'll help you pick equivalents.
William13
Active Member
Yesterday I paid US$268 per tire for the Nokian Hakka Rs in 245/45 R19. I hope they are great for the snow. Sadly I am switching out from my 21 inch wheels after I drive my car around the block one time. I won't really be able to compare the two until spring. How can they cost 160 more per tire?
They are in the top three if not the very top.
You are paying for the small production run. The only time you get a good deal on a small production run tire is for racing tires (including DOT racing tires) and then only when the tire manufacturer is trying to establish itself in the market.
William13
Active Member
Jerry, I meant to respond to eledille who said he could save 160 per tire. That would make the 17 inch tires only $108 each. I doubt they are that cheap.
By the way, thanks for the reassurance that they are in the top three.
By the way, thanks for the reassurance that they are in the top three.
Okay, I thought you meant that the 21" were $160 more per tire. Here's a price list from a place I've purchased from several times. Ryan has in the past given small discounts to Yahoo Prius group members.
Exactly, last winter I had to pay for hot water high pressure washing at least five times, using the hot water to cut out big blocks of ice. There was almost no suspension travel left. Getting it out by hand would require a pickaxe.
Thanks, I that's the calculator I used to find out that 235/55-R17 is quite close. The match could have been better, but I think up to 3% difference is legal. One problem is that even at 17 inches the range of width/height combinations is quite limited. For instance, Hakka R is not made in 235/60-R17 or 225/60. The original dimensions are a bit too large and wide in my opinion.
Yes, that's what I'm afraid of. I have to try to find it out. If someone who has received their MS would take a look and see if there's one inch of clearance between the calipers and the inside of the 19'' rims I'd be very grateful. Downsizing two inches requires one inch of clearance.
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They're the best in the most-used tire test in Norway this year. Michelin, Dunlop, Goodyear and Continental also have very good tires, but only Michelin X-Ice can match Nokian for rolling resistance, which is important for EVs.
The test is here, score table here. Translation: Piggdekk = studded tires, piggfrie dekk = studless tires, is = ice, snø = snow, våt = wet, tørr = dry, økonomi = economy, bremsing = braking, kjøreegenskaper = handling, retningsstabilitet = directional stability, støy = noise, rullemotstand = rolling resistance. The test is conducted by pro tire testers at Test World in Finland. Motor (Norway), Aftonbladet (Sweden), Auto Motor & Sport Sweden, Tekniikan Mailma (Finland) and Autorevuei (Russia) pay for the test, choose the tires and decide which characteristics will be tested. I mostly ignore the dry asphalt category and place extra weight on braking and handling on snow and ice, plus rolling resistance. That makes Nokian the winner, closely followed by Michelin, then Conti.
Congratulations on that price... If I could get them at that price I wouldn't worry that much, even though I would still want them narrower. Just look at some winter rally pictures. They're not using those cartwheels to save money! But paying 60% more for a poorer tire is horrible. The high cost difference is due to high Norwegian prices. The best I can find for Hakka R in 245/45-R19 is NOK 2700, the best for 235/55-R17 is NOK 1700. 1 USD = 5.75 NOK, so the difference is about 175. I thought that importing tires would not make sense, then I have to pay 25% VAT + shipping. I'll have to check it out, though. I can buy in Sweden and pick them up, but it seems they're almost as expensive there.
They're not bad, slightly behind the best on snow and ice. But they have more rolling resistance. Check out the test above, then you can decide for yourself which characteristics will be most important to your parents and modify the weighting.
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KBF
Model X owner (formerly Cdn Signature Model S)
Thanks, eledille, that's a helpful chart. I'm thinking the Michelins might be valuable for my purposes. They are quiet and have good r.r., and look decent on ice. As I've mentioned in another thread, I'm not sure whether to go the easy route and just take Tesla's package, or look elsewhere. Is in important to get Tesla's rims, or do we have other options that are as good?
Tesla wheels are centered around the centre bore, not the bolt circle, so it's important for best tire life to get a wheel that doesn't use a centering ring to make the wheel fit. Also check out the weight. Lighter weight is better. The aftermarket wheels that are lighter are around $4000/set.
For winter wheels you typically try to get a set of used wheels because they're likely to get banged up and damaged from the road salt anyway. You're not going to be setting any range records driving through snow and ice
MyDreamCar
I can't drive 55
In preperation for winter, today I changed my 21" gray rims/tires for the 19" silver rims/tires. The car looks totally generic. I miss the look/style of the 21" gray turbine rims. I really wish Tesla would make a set of the 19" gray turbine rims.
Here are photos of the 19" rims and brake caliper housings on my S, front and rear. The front calipers are larger: there is much less than an inch of clearance on the front wheels, and I think still not quite an of an inch of clearance on the rears. It's hard to measure exactly.
JakeP
S P4996 ==> P02547
KBF
Model X owner (formerly Cdn Signature Model S)
I don't think I would want different sized rims front and back, then I wouldn't be able to rotate the wheels. If 18'' wheels would fit front and back, that might be worth it.
Different rims have different clearance - it might be possible to find a 17'' rim with more clearance than the stock rims. I don't really know anything about that subject, though.
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