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Tesla's Supercharger Team was recently laid off. We discuss what this means for the company on today's TMC Podcast streaming live at 1PM PDT. You can watch on X or on YouTube where you can participate in the live chat.
Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Elon's recent actions lead me to conclude that he has seen something in Tesla's business that scared the bejeezus out of him and he is acting accordingly.
Personally, I think he was focused on SpaceX in recent years with Starship and building a rocket factory. Now, he's back focused more on Tesla and found hints of entropy in the company.
Temporary ban? It happens to the best of us (like me, at least two times)
The only time I had no instant regret after clicking the "Show ignored content" buttonIt happens to the best of us (like me, at least two times
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
As I have mentioned before, to me this seems like he placed trust in a lot of his people to act in a similar way that he would, and they didn't.
He put off doing anything about this for just long enough to know with certainty that there was a problem with this strategy.
After having talked it over with some of them they came to an agreement and parted ways, hopefully with respect and maybe even as friends, so that he may continue to make the decisions that have historically served Tesla best.
Keeping fingers crossed that this is but another sign of things looking up. Just as so many difficult times for Tesla in the past have turned out to be a precursor to greater achievements. There is a lot of runway in front of Tesla with more disruptive new technology to be mass-produced and deployed.
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1. The mood of this forum is based on how the stock is doing. When Elon went to China and surprised everyone with the good news, the stock went up 10 points in a day and the mood here was reminiscent of the pre-Covid days. Then SC team layoffs came with no context and the stock went down again. Along with the down stock goes the mood of this forum.
2. Its ok to question the direction of the company, Elon needs our money to grow.
With that stated, there are some trolls here who are trying to get a rise out of the long holders. So what? Just ignore them, even if their response to another poster shows up. Trolls thrive on attention. When the stock goes up they will disappear, because they will then appear stupid.
Its not easy moderating a "discussion forum," and the moderators do a great job here. It is not supposed to be a rah rah group think, nor a depository of every negative Tesla news article on the internet.
I agree. My vote goes to 'Trim out what is not needed and too heavy to carry on'
The good with Elon is that it is not the first nor last time he does trim the dead meat.
Thank you for participating with a black voting mark. This confirms that such email does not exist.
Nice try though.
cliff harris
Member
This has been discussed a lot.
Tesla is not a place to interview for if you want work/life balance. Its not a place to work at because of the high salary. Its not a place to work at if you want to chill out, or socialize, or embark on a time-intensive hobby.
If you want to spend time with the kids, and also learn the piano at the weekends, you go work at google or apple, where nobody every achieves anything and there are free massages at your desk and regular yoga retreats.
Tesla is special-forces. Its the commandos, its a michelin star restaurant.
There are no shortage of people prepared to be yelled at by drill sergeants or famous chefs for minimum wage. Tesla is the manufacturing/engineering equivalent of the michelin star/navy seal world.
Yes, we get it, a lot of you wouldn't want to work there. Nobody will make you!
Ironically Musk also occasionally expresses concern about low birth rates.
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
This is certainly a factor.
It has been made clear that the creator of this thread is not a supporter of the feature built into the site to help with that. So, anyone suggesting that option tend to be treated with a level of contempt that some feel could as easily be focused on those with a long history of posting consistently disruptive content.
Unfortunately, there is no easy way to discern, from what appear to be consistently disruptive posts, between sincerity and deliberate malice veiled in the trappings of sincerity.
I am thankful that anyone is willing to take up that role here. Those people deserve our respect and support for having kept things as sane here as they have been able to, for as long as they have been able to.
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We talk as if what is going on at Tesla is all, entirely, the work of Mr Musk. However, last time I looked he has a large, but minority position is far as stock. Intimidating as he may be, he does not have absolute power. Therefore there must be support for his actions from other people/agencies. Just one large institutional investor becoming alarmed by what’s going on could cause a bloodbath in the market.
Mod: I don't have bandwidth to do detailed moderation at the moment. So, by way of directive:
Tone down the argumentation!
The alternative is for me to lock the thread until everyone calms down.
--ggr
Tone down the argumentation!
The alternative is for me to lock the thread until everyone calms down.
--ggr
This ^^^
I did apply at Tesla a few times. My timing was specifically during the hell month for the Model 3 troubled ramp. At their most challenging hour, I wanted to sleep in the factory and not eat for 10 hrs at a time (a form of dieting for some). Elon was describing my own behaviors at times.
I was this way as early as age 11 as I recall rebuilding my 10 speed, and working on a salt water filter with a stack of napkins (should have kept working on it)! There are plenty who really do appreciate when things start clicking and the addiction takes over - as best I can understand this phenomenon. It may have to do with larger family size and tension growing up. So here's to messed up Fathers who create mission oriented kids and expert survivors at the worst moment.
I would also challenge anyone here to even get an interview with Tesla. I think @Gigapress may have at one point, that's it from this batch AFAIK.
Long hours would wear on me for certain, but a couple years ago I was working 80+ hrs/week for zero pay, mainly because I was moving the ball. And if really talented people saw everyone moving the ball like no other team in their life, that's the Viking blood that I see in myself. There is no shortage of these folks.
BTW, even if I had to push batteries down a track for a week, it's such rich research... bleeding edge, I'd suck it up and start singing the 4680 battery jingle based on the rhythm sound I'm making, then sneak off for a 15 min power nap.
Well, most would cite another company he was spending time on. But OK, you're saying he was distracted and wasn't doing his job?
False:
Elon Musk says competition for AI engineers is 'the craziest talent war I've ever seen!'
Elon Musk called the AI talent war the "craziest" he's ever seen, saying OpenAI has been "aggressively" recruiting some Tesla engineers.
""They have been aggressively recruiting Tesla engineers with massive compensation offers and have unfortunately been successful in a few cases," Musk wrote about OpenAI."
Musk is going to pay up or they will leave and some have already left. So yeah, it's not just about the mission as you claim. Top people, the ones Elon wants are possibly getting close to 7 figures or they will simply leave Tesla as I've mentioned to work at some other AI startup or even xAI that Ethan Knight went to.
If you are the top talent, you are in control or, as I've stated, you might as well leave Tesla and work at xAI for a far more "mission" work and a much higher payout (or folks who left for OpenAI, etc).
Inside Big Tech's nasty battle for coveted AI talent
The fight to hire the best AI talent is heating up, and it looks like Big Tech — and big paychecks — are winning out right now amid a skill shortage.
www.businessinsider.com
Companies like Amazon, Netflix, and Meta are paying salaries as high as $900,000 to attract generative AI talent
With not enough AI experts to fill demand, companies are offering competitive salaries.
www.businessinsider.com
Again, I have no doubts that out of work, laid off people, college grads will flock/apply to Tesla, but top talent has power and unlike what some folks here state, need massive incentives to want to work for Tesla as even Musk has admitted to.
UPDATE 1-Tesla to shut down production at German plant for 4 days - Handelsblatt
Tesla will shut down production in its German plant in Gruenheide for four days due to protests against its expansion plans, German newspaper Handelsblatt reported on Tuesday. The electric car manufacturer is sending all employees to work from home on Friday, according to an email seen by...
Nothing burger but it should really only be for 2.5 days, since one of those days is a German Holiday and production is slated to resume sunday evening.
False:
Elon Musk says competition for AI engineers is 'the craziest talent war I've ever seen!'
Elon Musk called the AI talent war the "craziest" he's ever seen, saying OpenAI has been "aggressively" recruiting some Tesla engineers.www.yahoo.com
""They have been aggressively recruiting Tesla engineers with massive compensation offers and have unfortunately been successful in a few cases," Musk wrote about OpenAI."
Musk is going to pay up or they will leave and some have already left. So yeah, it's not just about the mission as you claim. Top people, the ones Elon wants are possibly getting close to 7 figures or they will simply leave Tesla as I've mentioned to work at some other AI startup or even xAI that Ethan Knight went to.
If you are the top talent, you are in control or, as I've stated, you might as well leave Tesla and work at xAI for a far more "mission" work and a much higher payout (or folks who left for OpenAI, etc).
Inside Big Tech's nasty battle for coveted AI talent
The fight to hire the best AI talent is heating up, and it looks like Big Tech — and big paychecks — are winning out right now amid a skill shortage.
Companies like Amazon, Netflix, and Meta are paying salaries as high as $900,000 to attract generative AI talent
With not enough AI experts to fill demand, companies are offering competitive salaries.
Again, I have no doubts that out of work, laid off people, college grads will flock/apply to Tesla, but top talent has power and unlike what some folks here state, need massive incentives to want to work for Tesla as even Musk has admitted this.
This is nothing new, the AI bubble will burst and the flow of power swing the other way. The "power" we are talking about is salary. In either case, as other articles have stated, QOL is out the window during this AI frenzy, be it at Tesla, a startup, or elsewhere.
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
False:
Elon Musk says competition for AI engineers is 'the craziest talent war I've ever seen!'
Elon Musk called the AI talent war the "craziest" he's ever seen, saying OpenAI has been "aggressively" recruiting some Tesla engineers.
""They have been aggressively recruiting Tesla engineers with massive compensation offers and have unfortunately been successful in a few cases," Musk wrote about OpenAI."
Musk is going to pay up or they will leave and some have already left. So yeah, it's not just about the mission as you claim. Top people, the ones Elon wants are possibly getting close to 7 figures or they will simply leave Tesla as I've mentioned to work at some other AI startup or even xAI that Ethan Knight went to.
If you are the top talent, you are in control or, as I've stated, you might as well leave Tesla and work at xAI for a far more "mission" work and a much higher payout (or folks who left for OpenAI, etc).
Inside Big Tech's nasty battle for coveted AI talent
The fight to hire the best AI talent is heating up, and it looks like Big Tech — and big paychecks — are winning out right now amid a skill shortage.
Companies like Amazon, Netflix, and Meta are paying salaries as high as $900,000 to attract generative AI talent
With not enough AI experts to fill demand, companies are offering competitive salaries.
Again, I have no doubts that out of work, laid off people, college grads will flock/apply to Tesla, but top talent has power and unlike what some folks here state, need massive incentives to want to work for Tesla as even Musk has admitted to.
This doesn't support your thesis, as these employees are not a significant percentage of the total Tesla employee count as was being discussed in the post you replied to.
Cherry-picking, while ignoring context, is a tool used by people trying to sway opinions when the facts won't support their arguments.
There will always be competition for top level performers in any industry and Tesla must be competitive in order to hire and hold these key positions. They are critical for product development. They are unicorns.
They should not be placed in the same bucket for "Tesla employees" overall, as you have done here.
To add my $0.02 to the discussion regarding work hours, I not only have no issue with Elon's tough demands, but I applaud it.
Things may have changed, but back in the day, it was known by pretty much everyone that there were some companies that demanded brutal hours. Top law firms (e.g., Wachtel Lipton) management consulting firms (e.g, McKinsey), investment banks (e.g., Goldman Sachs), etc. I'm sure there are others, but those come to mind. Expectations were known and communicated; there were no surprises. Those who joined knew what to expect. Those who somehow filtered through but weren't on board with the hours didn't last long. I expect it was similar at the likes of Apple, Google and Facebook in their early years.
The one key point is that jobs at these top companies in their respective fields were all in high demand by potential employees. It's a virtuous circle. Success draws hard working, high achieving employees who like to work with like-minded high achievers, who then propagate continued success, which draws more highly motivated employees.
As others have said, it's not for everyone. Most people wouldn't be happy working at Tesla. I know I wouldn't (because I'm a spoiled and lazy boomer
). I applaud Elon for running a tight ship. It's this attention and focus that allowed Tesla to break through their Model 3 manufacturing hell and near bankruptcy.
It's clear to me that some amount of entropy had set in. My guess is Elon has not been fully engaged (due to X, SpaceX, etc.), but now he is back. He sees issues that need to be addressed. He is cleaning house, getting rid of those who are not on the same page as him, getting more hands-on (letting go of senior management is a sure sign of this) and setting expectations for current as well as new employees. Elon in manic mode bodes well for Tesla and TSLA.
Things may have changed, but back in the day, it was known by pretty much everyone that there were some companies that demanded brutal hours. Top law firms (e.g., Wachtel Lipton) management consulting firms (e.g, McKinsey), investment banks (e.g., Goldman Sachs), etc. I'm sure there are others, but those come to mind. Expectations were known and communicated; there were no surprises. Those who joined knew what to expect. Those who somehow filtered through but weren't on board with the hours didn't last long. I expect it was similar at the likes of Apple, Google and Facebook in their early years.
The one key point is that jobs at these top companies in their respective fields were all in high demand by potential employees. It's a virtuous circle. Success draws hard working, high achieving employees who like to work with like-minded high achievers, who then propagate continued success, which draws more highly motivated employees.
As others have said, it's not for everyone. Most people wouldn't be happy working at Tesla. I know I wouldn't (because I'm a spoiled and lazy boomer
). I applaud Elon for running a tight ship. It's this attention and focus that allowed Tesla to break through their Model 3 manufacturing hell and near bankruptcy.It's clear to me that some amount of entropy had set in. My guess is Elon has not been fully engaged (due to X, SpaceX, etc.), but now he is back. He sees issues that need to be addressed. He is cleaning house, getting rid of those who are not on the same page as him, getting more hands-on (letting go of senior management is a sure sign of this) and setting expectations for current as well as new employees. Elon in manic mode bodes well for Tesla and TSLA.
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