FWIW, they've updated the headline (and kept the pun)What utter twaddle! Do they mean Virgin Hyperloop One, with Chairman Richard Branson. You'd expect that from Boomburg, but FredTrik? I'm shocked! /s
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
For those whose investment behavior is similar to mine, this end of 2023 is a trifle bittersweet.
I sold some TSLA and another issuers shares, all of which I had purchased around eight or more years ago. Those bought the house I wanted but...I've just sent the capital gains report off to my tax attorney. The really good news is that I did not need to sell very much of my holdings. The bad news is that when the percentage gains are well above 1000% the tax consequence is horrendous. Since my US citizenship is still very much active although I haven't lived there for decades the burden is unaltered. The US unitary taxation rules, almost unique, are quite onerous and irritating.
So I complain and will be forced to sell more to pay for the US profligate ways. Luckily, I suppose, I will end out unaffected in Brazil mostly because the US taxes are higher than the Brazilian ones and they do honor the credit despite lack of a tax treaty.
The virtues of HODL continue to please me despite that irritant.
In the meantime I still HODL as much as I can!
(sorry for the end of year rant. This is the only forum I use where this is topical)
I sold some TSLA and another issuers shares, all of which I had purchased around eight or more years ago. Those bought the house I wanted but...I've just sent the capital gains report off to my tax attorney. The really good news is that I did not need to sell very much of my holdings. The bad news is that when the percentage gains are well above 1000% the tax consequence is horrendous. Since my US citizenship is still very much active although I haven't lived there for decades the burden is unaltered. The US unitary taxation rules, almost unique, are quite onerous and irritating.
So I complain and will be forced to sell more to pay for the US profligate ways. Luckily, I suppose, I will end out unaffected in Brazil mostly because the US taxes are higher than the Brazilian ones and they do honor the credit despite lack of a tax treaty.
The virtues of HODL continue to please me despite that irritant.
In the meantime I still HODL as much as I can!
(sorry for the end of year rant. This is the only forum I use where this is topical)
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
Lol, it's completely OT that "Elon" is the Hebrew name meaning oak tree.
Um, you know that Tesla PR is hiring for video production roles in El Lay, right...
Krugerrand
Meow
I was with your general sentiment of (be kind) until this. It feels like you’re picking winners and losers (and maybe you’ve picked correctly - however, not the point).
We’ve no idea who’s the more intelligent. For all you know GJ and MS are just as intelligent as the others, with their own backgrounds, skills and experience, they just choose to use it all differently than those in your personally preferred group - the group that throws a Tesla support bone to you now and again.
Basically, it’s hypocritical. Telling us how we should view individuals, how we should group them per your opinion is bs even if I agree with your grouping - which for clarification I don’t.
Carry on grouping people from your personal perspective, I support your right to do that, but don’t tell the rest of us we need to follow suit and why we’re wrong to do otherwise. If people had stopped doing that, Elon wouldn’t have felt the need to buy you know what.
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
Haha, BEFORE or AFTER the headline was syndicated in a thousand little nose-wipe webnoos sites? Bet they don't update the headline. Google search tomorrow FTW.
Personally, selling 2x needed and having 50% of proceeds immediately directed to tax prepayments has been quite calming (mathematically not ideal on years like this, but there is more to life than just the numbers). Prevents the need to ever be “forced” to sell at a later time, but also more importantly ensures that I am thinking of the actual “cost” in shares of getting the cash for whatever purchase is being considered. I sidestep negative thoughts about the tax % being too high despite the seemingly large # by reflecting on A) paying taxes on gains is far better than not having gains, and B) among the various benefits received from the government receiving those tax dollars are the environment which allowed those gains and the protection of the resulting cash or
Items bought with the post-tax gains.
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
Megapacktory 2 Shanghai (will Wu wa?)
Cheers!
Tsla Chan on X: "BREAKING: Tesla China has officially launched its Shanghai Megapack project.- Tesla China held a land acquisition and signing ceremony in Shanghai on Friday morning. - Megapack plant will produce a megapack with 40 GWh capacity. Energy Boom!" /X
Cheers!
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Krugerrand
Meow
Or simply - view all the gains as ‘free’ money. Money you found buried in your backyard, dropped in a street gutter, blown off somebody elses money tree because of a stiff wind, money gifted to you by a long lost relative or a Nigerian prince. Whatever. Free. Now it doesn’t feel quite so bad giving away half (or whatever percentage) to a corrupt, ungrateful, wasteful government entity constantly taking away your rights and making life more difficult one ridiculous legislative law at a time -Personally, selling 2x needed and having 50% of proceeds immediately directed to tax prepayments has been quite calming (mathematically not ideal on years like this, but there is more to life than just the numbers). Prevents the need to ever be “forced” to sell at a later time, but also more importantly ensures that I am thinking of the actual “cost” in shares of getting the cash for whatever purchase is being considered. I sidestep negative thoughts about the tax % being too high despite the seemingly large # by reflecting on A) paying taxes on gains is far better than not having gains, and B) among the various benefits received from the government receiving those tax dollars are the environment which allowed those gains and the protection of the resulting cash or
Items bought with the post-tax gains.
Never mind. ******* ********!
40 Gwh/year?! What is it, a megafactory for ants?
20 TWh/135 ~= 148 Gwh
This is a factory that consumes the cells, not produces them.
They are reportedly using CATL LFPs.
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
Artful Dodger
"Neko no me"
I AGREE, BUT!Personally, selling 2x needed and having 50% of proceeds immediately directed to tax prepayments has been quite calming (mathematically not ideal on years like this, but there is more to life than just the numbers). Prevents the need to ever be “forced” to sell at a later time, but also more importantly ensures that I am thinking of the actual “cost” in shares of getting the cash for whatever purchase is being considered. I sidestep negative thoughts about the tax % being too high despite the seemingly large # by reflecting on A) paying taxes on gains is far better than not having gains, and B) among the various benefits received from the government receiving those tax dollars are the environment which allowed those gains and the protection of the resulting cash or
Items bought with the post-tax gains.
When one is non-resident only the US among major countries (North Korea is another) tax citizens on their worldwide income whether recent or not. When the country of residence has higher taxation, that becomes irrelevant. In my case the relevant capital gains are 15% so it hurts, especially when even consular services are hard to come by since they've eliminated nearly all of them and make Brazilians wait a year or more only to renew a visa. Those circumstances do spawn resentment and dismay. FWIW, even to remove US citizenship citizenship exacts a high tax bill and wait of more than a year. I have no desire to do that, but many people faced with these inequities do exit permanently.
I really am waiting impatiently for Tesla to come to Brazil so my colleagues and I can finally take delivery on our very long reserved Model 3's, since 2016 for several of us. We keep those reservations!
I believe any reasonably thoughtful person can find areas they are pleased with the US government for, and areas where they are equally displeased. Two reasonably thoughtful people could likely debate the same list of items but put the items on opposite sides.
However, my point was more about avoiding the truly corrupt governments (not just ungrateful or wasteful)...the countries where companies such as Tesla would have already been fully nationalized by now (resulting in no one having any gains), the countries where those who have profited greatly from their investments suddenly find 100% of their wealth useless when they are imprisoned or worse (resulting in gains having become a net negative, infinitely so in many cases). Happy to pay taxes to avoid these scenarios.
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Well, it appears the Grinch is in control of the share price on this last trading day before Christmas.
and so this bit of poetry shouldn't hurt the cause...
I appreciate this group & I wish you warm and wonderful Holidays......
and so this bit of poetry shouldn't hurt the cause...
I appreciate this group & I wish you warm and wonderful Holidays......
Krugerrand
Meow
I know. I was just trying to give another perspective, another way to look at gains that might help a person or two be less resentful giving money away - but as you can see, epic failure.I believe any reasonably thoughtful person can find areas they are pleased with the US government for, and areas where they are equally displeased. Two reasonably thoughtful people could likely debate the same list of items but put the items on opposite sides.
However, my point was more about avoiding the truly corrupt governments (not just ungrateful or wasteful)...the countries where companies such as Tesla would have already been fully nationalized by now (resulting in no one having any gains), the countries where those who have profited greatly from their investments suddenly find 100% of their wealth useless when they are imprisoned or worse (resulting in gains having become a net negative, infinitely so in many cases). Happy to pay taxes to avoid these scenarios.
2daMoon
Mostly Harmless
Personally, selling 2x needed and having 50% of proceeds immediately directed to tax prepayments has been quite calming (mathematically not ideal on years like this, but there is more to life than just the numbers). Prevents the need to ever be “forced” to sell at a later time, but also more importantly ensures that I am thinking of the actual “cost” in shares of getting the cash for whatever purchase is being considered. I sidestep negative thoughts about the tax % being too high despite the seemingly large # by reflecting on A) paying taxes on gains is far better than not having gains, and B) among the various benefits received from the government receiving those tax dollars are the environment which allowed those gains and the protection of the resulting cash or
Items bought with the post-tax gains.
As for B), Once collected, it seems unlikely that taxes go into coffers to be spent in next year's budget or anything as straightforward as that. As far as I've found, there has never been a successful accounting by the GAO of what happens to the money collected by the IRS. It simply fades away.
Some speculate upon how it seems more likely the sole purpose of US income tax is to take money out of circulation as a means to lessen the impact of monetary inflation, among other social engineering aspects. See the link in the spoiler for more detail, in an article by Beardsley Ruml, Chairman of Federal Reserve Bank of New York. Published in 1946.
All that aside, I wholeheartedly agree with A) above. The more taxes I pay, the more gains I have enjoyed. In this way capital gains tax is a barometer of our success. May we all look forward to paying more tax than shorty.
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I am not a lawyer but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night, does that count?
Last day of trading before Christmas, i would like to take a moment to give thanks to my TMC family for providing laughter, support, advice (some good, some not so good), trolling and lastly, a support system when $TSLA loses 60% of its value by saying "At least you're still up right?" throughout 2023.
I
y'all, even the 
and elon haters out there!
Buckminster
Well-Known Member
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