Sure, CATL is smart enough to realize that it is much more efficacious for them to collect licensing and support fees than it is to own the plant itself. They're also smart enough to help meet all sourcing requirements. They already do similar things in some other countries, often with minimal explicit branding. Moura in Brasil is one example of that.
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Reuters through US News - 11:53 am EST
Tesla to Expand Operations to Mexico, Official Says
Tesla to Expand Operations to Mexico, Official Says
Gigapress
Trying to be less wrong
Another couple possibilities for why we have this FSD recall:
1) Maybe the software breaking the letter of the law was uncomfortable to many decision-makers involved. Maybe this was legally related, where someone who lets the old state of the software continue might later get in trouble if an accident occurs. A lot of regulatory action is done in response to or in anticipation of public outcry when some bad, highly publicized incident occurs. It might look bad if, for example, someone allowed FSD Beta to keep making left turns on yellow in the way it had been and then that leads to a serious collision. It would be easy for the media to spin that as regulatory negligence. At some point, FSD will have its first death, and the public might want someone to blame and want to see justice served.
2) NHTSA needs to not only monitor and assist the development of this safety technology, but also to build confidence and acceptance in the technology to give the American public the perception that NHTSA is not just allowing rampant dangerous development processes on public roads. Being tough now might ultimately help in the long run. Overreactive voter pressure in response to some hypothetical bad incident on level 5 FSD could potentially force regulators to take excessive action, and after a safety regulation is on the books it's extremely difficult to subsequently eliminate or weaken it, even if that actually makes sense to do.
I don't know if these reasons apply but I still think we don't have enough clear evidence to conclusively determine what exactly triggered this FSD recall. Especially because we don't have access to the engineering analysis preceding this decision. NHTSA.gov says this recall stemmed from an investigation of Autopilot safety since last summer.
1) Maybe the software breaking the letter of the law was uncomfortable to many decision-makers involved. Maybe this was legally related, where someone who lets the old state of the software continue might later get in trouble if an accident occurs. A lot of regulatory action is done in response to or in anticipation of public outcry when some bad, highly publicized incident occurs. It might look bad if, for example, someone allowed FSD Beta to keep making left turns on yellow in the way it had been and then that leads to a serious collision. It would be easy for the media to spin that as regulatory negligence. At some point, FSD will have its first death, and the public might want someone to blame and want to see justice served.
2) NHTSA needs to not only monitor and assist the development of this safety technology, but also to build confidence and acceptance in the technology to give the American public the perception that NHTSA is not just allowing rampant dangerous development processes on public roads. Being tough now might ultimately help in the long run. Overreactive voter pressure in response to some hypothetical bad incident on level 5 FSD could potentially force regulators to take excessive action, and after a safety regulation is on the books it's extremely difficult to subsequently eliminate or weaken it, even if that actually makes sense to do.
I don't know if these reasons apply but I still think we don't have enough clear evidence to conclusively determine what exactly triggered this FSD recall. Especially because we don't have access to the engineering analysis preceding this decision. NHTSA.gov says this recall stemmed from an investigation of Autopilot safety since last summer.
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I think this behavior will accelerate the demise of dealerships. Keep it up. 
This must infuriate Ford but outside their control. Maybe that's were some of the pressure is coming from, dealerships blame Ford for going EV, so it's a payback.
driveteslacanada.ca
This must infuriate Ford but outside their control. Maybe that's were some of the pressure is coming from, dealerships blame Ford for going EV, so it's a payback.
Ford dealer sells customer's pre-ordered Mustang Mach-E, offers him higher priced replacement instead
He is requesting a credit for the cost difference of the Mustang Mach-E between the order and the delivery, about $10,000.
driveteslacanada.ca
If I may,
NHTSA has the duty to enforce regulations as they are currently written. The also have the duty to increase vehicle safety.
Tesla is pushing to achieve a goal of greater vehicle safety through both better design and software. To achieve this, Tesla tends to the "allowed unless specifically prohibited" school of thought whereas legacy automotive leans toward "prohibited unless specifically required" (risk adverse).
NHTSA is then in the position of being one of the few moderating influences on Tesla. Instead of this playing out in closed door meetings where they debate acceptable features and behavior for months/ years (with NHTSA never taking on any risk), we see this push-pushback playing out on the public stage for all to see.
Tesla's boldness gives NHTSA something to work with, not necessarily against. See also: The queen’s duck
MountainRatMat
Member
I think the big concern is whether regulations are being applied consistently or not. This ruling lays out guidelines for Tesla. Are these general policies or do they only apply to Tesla alone?
Is there now a requirement that ADAS systems (in general) enforce speed limits abruptly? Or is this a Tesla specific requirement?
The entire idea that Tesla (or anyone) should be responsible for speed limits at all when signage is poor and there is no reference GIS system which holds reliable speed limit data is frustrating. There are a couple long sections I drive which are 55+ but Autopilot gets consistently capped at 50 MPH because the signage is vague.
My bigger concern is legislation that applies only to smart ADAS systems like Teslas encourages auto-makers to continue making “dumb” ADAS systems which are unaware. ADAS that follows lines and avoids traffic via LIDAR shouldn’t have more generous restrictions than Tesla does.
In a way, having NHTSA review Autopilot and now FSD is almost like getting a 2nd opinion from a doctor or an outside financial audit. IMO, it's good to get an alternate viewpoint from an agency not directly involved in creating the product.
Back when I was the CEO (and chief cook and bottle washer) of small software company, getting a audit of our books from a reputable accounting firm that was painful in some ways, as they took issue with some of the ways we were recognizing revenue, but when I sat down and thought about it, they were right (even if it did cost us our first million dollar year). In Tesla's case, the NHTSA is acting like that outside auditor, pointing out things that we, and Tesla, thought trivial, but may make a difference in some situations. Just like a financial auditor, it's much better to work with them than fight them.
navguy12
Active Member
But the dealership lobby always trots out things like “supporting local minor league baseball“ and so on…I think this behavior will accelerate the demise of dealerships. Keep it up.
This must infuriate Ford but outside their control. Maybe that's were some of the pressure is coming from, dealerships blame Ford for going EV, so it's a payback.
Ford dealer sells customer's pre-ordered Mustang Mach-E, offers him higher priced replacement instead
He is requesting a credit for the cost difference of the Mustang Mach-E between the order and the delivery, about $10,000.
Me being optimistic: Not everyone hates Tesla?
The V11.3 branch has the improvements that are needed to, hopefully, correct the issues. It wasn't ready yet. NHTSA delayed pushing the issue until Tesla could resolve it. (Plus, free advertising)
@MP3Mike, minor quibble, it was part of an ongoing discussion, Jan 25th just happened to be the date of the official request.
Nevermind, just went live. (Putting link in HW4 thread)H/W 4.0 discussion (investors)
navguy12
Active Member
All that's missing now is Homer and his “Spider Pig” footprints on that ceiling.My ceiling is a floor:
As someone who has had FSD since mid 2019, and is now on the beta, agreed.
Plus, there are so many posts about how f-ed it is to not replace all HW3 with HW4, before it even is possible -- I mean, I think all of those posts aren't really thinking through how FSD is developing.
The main thing that the two additional front bumper cameras give you applies to a relatively narrow set of driving conditions -- basically nudging out of a driveway on to a street with an otherwise blocked view. Someone may point this out, but I can't think of another circumstance.
And that circumstance is not just sensor based, its also based on the driving decision where (how to describe this) you cannot "see" that there is not a car coming due to an obstruction, but you "know" there is not a car there because you can see farther down the road and you have waited an appropriate time.
Its the decision where you know a pedestrian is not behind an object because if they were walking they would have already passed it.
Those look to me to be the last set of decisions because the software is right now so obviously working on reactions to things it actually sees.
Other instances come to mind: (1) Yellow diamond sign with embedded (reduced) speed limit sign in it; (2) school zone sign requiring reduction of speed to 20mph "when light is flashing" or during certain times of certain times in the "school day"; (3) prompt reaction to change in speed from higher speed to lower speed (the reaction is currently so slow that you can get ticketed for speeding because the car, while slowing down slowly, if still 10+ mph faster than the currently applicable speed limit.
The issue is that slowing down should start before the speed limit change, not when the car passes the speed limit sign (current behaviour)
Tesla Fix Is In After Admitting Full-Self Driving May Cause Crashes, Recalling More Than 360,000 Cars
Will FSD v11 solve Tesla's driver assistance woes?
I know this was posted yesterday but had to post this article based on this manipulative 'headline'
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TrendTrader007
Active Member
current working hypothesis: TSLA likely to overall keep on running right into P&D report until April3, 2023 and even thereafter, especially thereafter since P&D report likely to be blockbuster, one for the ages
so another 12 to 14 weeks or so before any major correction which brings me right into May, 2023
all pure speculation, of course and subject to multiple revisions as price action unfolds over next few months
NFA
not for adults
(NOT FINANCIAL ADVICE)
so another 12 to 14 weeks or so before any major correction which brings me right into May, 2023
all pure speculation, of course and subject to multiple revisions as price action unfolds over next few months
NFA
not for adults
(NOT FINANCIAL ADVICE)
TrendTrader007
Active Member
shocking! i had no idea! sold all my TSLA and went naked shortTesla Fix Is In After Admitting Full-Self Driving May Cause Crashes, Recalling More Than 360,000 Cars
Will FSD v11 solve Tesla's driver assistance woes?www.motortrend.com
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Some years ago in the Texas legislature, Elon said he would sign a check to Little League. Actually, dealership sponsorship of local sports teams is a form of advertising rather than charity. The dealership's name is on the uniforms. It's hoped that the players and parents will eventually become customers.
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TSLAQ is pouring it on trying to keep us below 200, but the fight is on right now. All the macros down today and we’re holding strong… probably be pushing forward in spite of the macros save Max Pain (Side note… I had a statistics teacher named Max Paine). Today’s little counter-FUD “Leak”: Tesla factory opening in Mexico.
Is this a genuine leak from Mexico side or is Tesla really announcing this on the lead up to their Investor Day. All this news popping out prior to the call making me jazzed for what will be on the call.
PS: Figured out why it’s called Q.
PPS No complaints about Today’s crayon art. I scratched my original bad art idea
Is this a genuine leak from Mexico side or is Tesla really announcing this on the lead up to their Investor Day. All this news popping out prior to the call making me jazzed for what will be on the call.
PS: Figured out why it’s called Q.
PPS No complaints about Today’s crayon art. I scratched my original bad art idea
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