Tesla on Autopilot slams into stationary car (VIDEO)

[hgmichna]

Nobody seems to have noticed that in the beginning of the short video the car comes from the very left side of the lane. Autopilot does not do that. So no autopilot, most likely.

The exception would be if the car just changed lanes from left to right. But what is the likelihood of that, coming from the very left lane on a road with not much traffic?

It is also conspicuous that the posted video was cut so short. Why did they not show a couple more seconds before? Probably because of that maneuver. If the car cut to the inside of the left bend, everybody would have seen that the car was not on autopilot.

Very fishy. Probably not even a Tesla. Somebody trying to play games.

 

[Zilla91]

The amount of straw clutching on this thread is quite a sight… hopefully this will bring an end to that

https://twitter.com/x/status/1609407115101372418

 

[2101Guy]

Nobody seems to have noticed that in the beginning of the short video the car comes from the very left side of the lane. Autopilot does not do that. So no autopilot, most likely.

The exception would be if the car just changed lanes from left to right. But what is the likelihood of that, coming from the very left lane on a road with not much traffic?

It is also conspicuous that the posted video was cut so short. Why did they not show a couple more seconds before? Probably because of that maneuver. If the car cut to the inside of the left bend, everybody would have seen that the car was not on autopilot.

Very fishy. Probably not even a Tesla. Somebody trying to play games.

You must not be familiar with green. His track record on analysis is historically spot on

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

wonder if that could’ve impacted stopping distance any.

BBKs don’t appreciably impact stopping distance. Most definitely not to the degree required to stop an impact here! Physically it was not possible to stop in two seconds without retrorockets or arrestor hook.

 

[2101Guy]

BBKs don’t appreciably impact stopping distance. Most definitely not to the degree required to stop an impact here! Physically it was not possible to stop in two seconds without retrorockets or arrestor hook.

Totally agreed. But potentially could reduce speed/force of impact. Theoretically speaking

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Totally agreed. But potentially could reduce speed/force of impact. Theoretically speaking

High performance tires would have helped if it was not alreadyequipped with them. Though still would have hit at high speed.

And slowing more and therefore lengthening time to impact by a fraction of a second could have meant an arm or head removal of the person getting into the other car.

 

[STS-134]

"The chilling truth is that your Tesla no longer knows the distance to anything...not without RADAR...it's a cost-saving deletion both in parts and in reputation."

"Imagine I hire two artists to paint a picture of the road ahead and, uh oh, they're different. I guess I'd better throw one away so there's nothing left to contradict the other and that means I can drive assuming it's correct. Hmm...the only place that logic makes sense is in a profit loss column."

"We all know selling an 'autopilot' that requires drivers to be constantly piloting it is like selling a flamethrower that is 'not a flamethrower'. It's willfully incendiary."

"Just know that Autopilot is programmed to shut down 1 second before impact so...who's the manslaughter charge gonna stick to?"

 

[STS-134]

Very fishy. Probably not even a Tesla. Somebody trying to play games.

Only a Tesla would have a camera on the right fender aimed toward the rear that was capturing stuff at this angle: Tesla on Autopilot slams into stationary car (VIDEO)

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

"The chilling truth is that your Tesla no longer knows the distance to anything...not without RADAR...it's a cost-saving deletion both in parts and in reputation."

"Imagine I hire two artists to paint a picture of the road ahead and, uh oh, they're different. I guess I'd better throw one away so there's nothing left to contradict the other and that means I can drive assuming it's correct. Hmm...the only place that logic makes sense is in a profit loss column."

"We all know selling an 'autopilot' that requires drivers to be constantly piloting it is like selling a flamethrower that is 'not a flamethrower'. It's willfully incendiary."

"Just know that Autopilot is programmed to shut down 1 second before impact so...who's the manslaughter charge gonna stick to?"

This car had radar and was using it.

LiDAR would help of course. However no one is using LiDAR in these situations successfully in a consumer application, so it may not be that easy.

Lots of speculation in that video. It would be nice to know what happened in those motorcycle crashes rather than assuming things.

 

[Dewg]

"The chilling truth is that your Tesla no longer knows the distance to anything...not without RADAR...it's a cost-saving deletion both in parts and in reputation."

I kept rereading that sentence trying to see if I was missing something. If my car no longer knows the distance to anything, how is it stopping perfectly behind cars at red lights, or pedestrians when they are crossing? How is it moving around parked cars and trash cans without slamming into them? What am I missing or doing wrong on my car?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

How is it moving around parked cars and trash cans without slamming into them? What am I missing or doing wrong on my car?

The issue is that it won’t be able to do this all the time. (You may never notice though - no idea the rate.)

It’s far from clear that adding LiDAR (and radar) will fix this though. It will make it less frequent presumably if programmed correctly.

Anyway you aren’t using the same system as the car in this post so I guess this is off-topic.

 

[STS-134]

I kept rereading that sentence trying to see if I was missing something. If my car no longer knows the distance to anything, how is it stopping perfectly behind cars at red lights, or pedestrians when they are crossing? How is it moving around parked cars and trash cans without slamming into them? What am I missing or doing wrong on my car?

It uses parallax to determine distance, the same way your eyes and brain do, but it's less accurate than time-of-flight based distance readings,especially at greater distances. This idea that humans can drive with only eyes and a brain and therefore cars should be able to do so as well is stupid. I thought the idea was to make a car drive better than a human can? Humans don't have time-of-flight based distance readings because we don't have sensory organs that can do this, but that's not a good reason for the machines we make to not do this either.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

It uses parallax to determine distance, the same way your eyes and brain do,

That’s not really what our brains do. We do that up close of course; very helpful for depth perception.
But we’re much more sophisticated than that.

 

[ThomasD]

It almost looks like the car sped up at the last couple of seconds

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

It almost looks like the car sped up at the last couple of seconds

No it does not.

Also you can see the brake lights come on.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1609601209601589250

 

[2101Guy]

It almost looks like the car sped up at the last couple of seconds

Almost?

 

[Knightshade]

standard brakes with the plastic covers to simulate performance brakes (and with no notification to customers that this was done) that Tesla quietly started doing, wonder if that could’ve impacted stopping distance any.

No, it could not have. The brakes don't stop the car, the tires do.

Totally agreed. But potentially could reduce speed/force of impact. Theoretically speaking

Again, no, not even theoretically.

The brakes don't stop the car- the tires do. Anyone who tells you differently is trying to sell you a brake upgrade kit you likely don't need.


Two otherwise identical cars, with identical tires, on identical surfaces- but one has a massive $20,000 carbon ceramic braking system and the other has stock OEM brakes- both will stop from highway speed in a single panic stop in exactly the same distance- just as physics requires them to.

Brake upgrades can do a number of things- but stop you shorter in a highway panic stop isn't one of them.


If you're unclear on this point I highly suggest you read this essay by a guy who has literally written books on braking system design (and worked for multiple OEMs and major brake vendors, teaches SAE master classes on the topic, etc).... he breaks down what each part of the braking system does, what upgrading it can do for you, and why NONE of them change your stopping distance in this sort of situation- only better tires can do that.

GRM Pulp Friction

 

[STS-134]

No, it could not have. The brakes don't stop the car, the tires do.



Again, no, not even theoretically.

The brakes don't stop the car- the tires do. Anyone who tells you differently is trying to sell you a brake upgrade kit you likely don't need.


Two otherwise identical cars, with identical tires, on identical surfaces- but one has a massive $20,000 carbon ceramic braking system and the other has stock OEM brakes- both will stop from highway speed in a single panic stop in exactly the same distance- just as physics requires them to.

Brake upgrades can do a number of things- but stop you shorter in a highway panic stop isn't one of them.


If you're unclear on this point I highly suggest you read this essay by a guy who has literally written books on braking system design (and worked for multiple OEMs and major brake vendors, teaches SAE master classes on the topic, etc).... he breaks down what each part of the braking system does, what upgrading it can do for you, and why NONE of them change your stopping distance in this sort of situation- only better tires can do that.

GRM Pulp Friction

Well, technically, better brakes can stop the car faster, if the brakes were extensively used just prior to the panic stop and were already extremely hot. Since we don't know what happened prior to the video shown, we can't entirely rule out the possibility that the brakes were hot. But I highly doubt it.

 

[Knightshade]

Well, technically, better brakes can stop the car faster, if the brakes were extensively used just prior to the panic stop and were already extremely hot.

I mean, technically, no, they still can't stop you any faster they can just stop you the same under heavier abuse.

For example (just made up #s for illustration) the stock and heavily upgraded brakes might stop you in 100 feet from 60 to 0 mph the first time. And second and third (all without letting the brakes cool).... but the upgraded brakes might still be stopping in 100 feet if you did 10 of those stops back to back to back, while the stock brakes might fade and begin increasing distance after say the 5th such stop in a row without cooling... At no point does either system stop you FASTER than the first (identical to both systems) distance though.


All that said outside of a race track, heavy backroad twisties like Tail of the Dragon, or the chase scene from a Jason Bourne film, you're not gonna fade even the stock brakes....and certainly not just not-paying-attention-driving on a regular 4 lane each way fairly straight highway/interstate like this dude.

 

[2101Guy]

I mean, technically, no, they still can't stop you any faster they can just stop you the same under heavier abuse.

For example (just made up #s for illustration) the stock and heavily upgraded brakes might stop you in 100 feet from 60 mph the first time. And second and third (all without letting the brakes cool).... but the upgraded brakes might still be stopping in 100 feet if you did 10 of those stops back to back to back, while the stock brakes might fade and begin increasing distance after say the 5th such stop in a row without cooling... At no point does either system stop you FASTER than the first (identical to both systems) distance though.


All that said outside of a race track, heavy backroad twisties like Tail of the Dragon, or the chase scene from a Jason Bourne film, you're not gonna fade even the stock brakes....and certainly not just not-paying-attention-driving on a regular 4 lane each way fairly straight highway/interstate like this dude.

Translation: “STS-134 is correct. Under certain conditions, yes, Brembo brakes/BBK’s CAN reduce stopping distance as well as potentially reduce speed at impact compared to smaller brakes”