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The QA from which I posted part from Dec 2014 is still on TM web page but they've added "long distance travel" in one answer:
Supercharging | Tesla Motors
It used to be on the "supercharging" page and now it is on support page.
Supercharging | Tesla Motors
It used to be on the "supercharging" page and now it is on support page.
chriSharek
Member
Olle
Active Member
I've seen people on this forum speculating in buying a Model S and "saving $500 install plus electric bills" by not installing a garage outlet and only supercharge because they lived close to one. A neighbor of mine asked the same thing and said he would buy an S if he could figure out a logistically feasible way to ONLY supercharge.. I tried to explain to him how that behavior defeats the convenience of having an electric car in the first place but he wouldn't listen instead kept repeating what a "smart and innovative" idea he had come up with, namely to charge for free. So some people think like that, I guess. This must be the behavior that Musk had in mind yesterday.
Luckily though, the absolute majority of people are born with a moral compass and instinctively know that local long term supercharging is wrong.
Luckily though, the absolute majority of people are born with a moral compass and instinctively know that local long term supercharging is wrong.
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Super_Popular
Well-Known Member
I am not reading through 5 pages. What does "receive a note" mean?...do they email a person when they are over using or does Elon magically appear and leave a note on your windshield?
And what does Tesla think is going to happen when the Model 3 is released?.....I am sure there will be major over use of the SC.
And what does Tesla think is going to happen when the Model 3 is released?.....I am sure there will be major over use of the SC.
Say I have a long daily commute, a bit over 300 miles, and a SC on my route.
I am not legible to use SC because I'd do it daily?
If I do those 300miles only once per week than it is OK?
Say I happen to have short commute, about 20 miles and again a SC nearby.
I am not legible to use SC once per week because I only do short trips that happen to pass SC?
This issue is politicaly loaded one.
There are only two ethically clean ways:
- shut up and allow people to do what they choose
- charge per use
Allowing (and ADVERTISING) free use and then go hunt people that are not behaving to your liking is asking for trouble.
I am not legible to use SC because I'd do it daily?
If I do those 300miles only once per week than it is OK?
Say I happen to have short commute, about 20 miles and again a SC nearby.
I am not legible to use SC once per week because I only do short trips that happen to pass SC?
This issue is politicaly loaded one.
There are only two ethically clean ways:
- shut up and allow people to do what they choose
- charge per use
Allowing (and ADVERTISING) free use and then go hunt people that are not behaving to your liking is asking for trouble.
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it all starts with a friendly note, but before you know there will be commandos surrounding your house and Seals landing on your roof top from helicopters, and soon you can hear chatter on the radio, "Operation Freeloader complete, suspect in custody", you open your eyes and you are in Guntanamo
;-)
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
I disagree. Just because you state there must only be 2 ways does not make it so. Companies have polices regarding their offering all the time
"Free parking for Target Customers Only". <-- Does not require pay for use, but does not allow "people to do what they choose", either.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
I think it really is just a 'common sense' issue and shouldn't be overanalyzed. If you're commuting and need to charge, then do so. If you're living in a multi-unit building and have no other way to charge, then do so. If you are abusing the system (and most people know if they are, if they have half a brain cell & I assume they do...), then knock it off.
I hate seeing things become more proscriptive just because people can't just behave like adults. Unfortunately, that's why rules & regulations are put in place. Would be nice if this community could just be adults and suffer the few that are not.
Why is this different from other 'free' things that we are all used to but expected to behave responsibly such as condiments and napkins and soda in a fast food joint ? Napkins and ketchup are there to aid your dining experience in the restaurant for the food you just purchased and not to replenish home supplies.
If you ask an associate he/she will say, take as much as you want. It doesn't mean I stop going to Costco and instead go to my friendly McD
chriSharek
Member
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
Will repeat my post in the other thread ... intent has always been long-distance, as evidenced by the presentation at the Supercharger reveal event.
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Olle
Active Member
jacobp
Member
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
And yet another video clarifying Tesla's position that the intention is long-distance travel (from 2 years ago):
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LLWS
Member
I have "abused" the SuC waiting for electrical upgrades, emergency/unplanned "local" trips, and after drowning my L2 Charger by accidentally letting it get rained on.
For those living in rental homes, or apartments the situation is more complex. I am currently renting a single-family home, but the landlord thought our two EVs were so novel he "let" me rewire the garage (at my expense) to accommodate the first EV car. Due to site limitations I can only charge one car at a time, so occasionally I'll stop by the SuC to get :15 minutes of power. I never leave the car, and truth be told I've only seen two other cars and am happy to yield the SuC to those travelling. Today, I need to drive approximately 75 miles, and my rated range is 63 currently. I'll be passing the Woodbridge SuC on my route, so I suspect I'll stop in for :15 minutes to keep me on schedule.
BTW - There are two HPWC's within five blocks of my work in Arlington, VA. It costs $24 to park in the garage just to get access to the HPWCs. There are 10 L2s in my building, but an 18-month waiting list to be able to park at the "Juice Bar". The parking lot I have a monthly parking contract with charges $120/mo to park and the EV spots are BLINK at $.55/KwH. I'd actually be quite happy to charge in my work parking garage which would completely eliminate stopping by the local SuC and the challenge of trying supply enough power to two EV's in our rental home. But, the cost of commercial charging is ridiculous. So as it works out, I might hit the local SuC once or twice a month very purposely on off-hours. Flipping through my photo library on my iPhone, I have only two pictures of another car EVER being there at the same time. Other than the cost of power, I do not believe I'm abusing the SuC network in principle.
I suspect the reason people purchase a Model S varies, as does the circumstances that send them to the SuC for "local" driving. I'm not sure you can successfully "ban" someone or change their activity based on Internet shame. No one at the Tesla SC said anything less than the SuC are free for life, and I admit the convenience, proximity, and easy of charging via the SuC were all contributing factors in purchasing a Model S. Further, I think throttling a local user may have unintended consequences to the travelling users. If someone is intent on perpetually charging locally, Tesla is only accomplishing lower throughput through the SuC and could actually be punishing the car that is actually travelling via wait times.
IF I owned the home I am renting, I would simply upgrade the panel, drop in an HPWC (I have the dual chargers) and I probably could delete the local SuC from my nav database, but that isn't my current situation.
For those living in rental homes, or apartments the situation is more complex. I am currently renting a single-family home, but the landlord thought our two EVs were so novel he "let" me rewire the garage (at my expense) to accommodate the first EV car. Due to site limitations I can only charge one car at a time, so occasionally I'll stop by the SuC to get :15 minutes of power. I never leave the car, and truth be told I've only seen two other cars and am happy to yield the SuC to those travelling. Today, I need to drive approximately 75 miles, and my rated range is 63 currently. I'll be passing the Woodbridge SuC on my route, so I suspect I'll stop in for :15 minutes to keep me on schedule.
BTW - There are two HPWC's within five blocks of my work in Arlington, VA. It costs $24 to park in the garage just to get access to the HPWCs. There are 10 L2s in my building, but an 18-month waiting list to be able to park at the "Juice Bar". The parking lot I have a monthly parking contract with charges $120/mo to park and the EV spots are BLINK at $.55/KwH. I'd actually be quite happy to charge in my work parking garage which would completely eliminate stopping by the local SuC and the challenge of trying supply enough power to two EV's in our rental home. But, the cost of commercial charging is ridiculous. So as it works out, I might hit the local SuC once or twice a month very purposely on off-hours. Flipping through my photo library on my iPhone, I have only two pictures of another car EVER being there at the same time. Other than the cost of power, I do not believe I'm abusing the SuC network in principle.
I suspect the reason people purchase a Model S varies, as does the circumstances that send them to the SuC for "local" driving. I'm not sure you can successfully "ban" someone or change their activity based on Internet shame. No one at the Tesla SC said anything less than the SuC are free for life, and I admit the convenience, proximity, and easy of charging via the SuC were all contributing factors in purchasing a Model S. Further, I think throttling a local user may have unintended consequences to the travelling users. If someone is intent on perpetually charging locally, Tesla is only accomplishing lower throughput through the SuC and could actually be punishing the car that is actually travelling via wait times.
IF I owned the home I am renting, I would simply upgrade the panel, drop in an HPWC (I have the dual chargers) and I probably could delete the local SuC from my nav database, but that isn't my current situation.
Point of Personal Preference:
Can someone with good transcription skills please emplace in this thread (too bad there's not a way to have it on top of each new page) the words Mr Musk used yesterday? In this and a number of other threads it has been asserted Tesla's Tsk Tsk letters have been going out. I am 100% certain that is not what he said; rather, that they would/will be sending them. There is a nice difference: it's not just discussing future actions, it is itself a First Warning/ Shot Across The Bow. And once we get the exact words, maybe I'll request a change to this thread's title.
And it works, too. I say this first-hand. I like driving down to the W'burg SpC just to hang out there and snag a passing Model S driver to chat. And of course, I top off with those nice "free" electrons. I don't do it to demonstrate - or rather, contribute to - the Tragedy of the Commons, which is what the entire kerfuffle is about, but because it's fun.
Now, I've all of a sudden had suggested to me "Err....maybe what you're doing is not why we placed a SpC so close to your garage" quondam note from TM. So maybe I won't be doing it so often...
PS: Anyone very much up on his/her Robert's Rules? That's a pretty arcane one I threw out.....
Can someone with good transcription skills please emplace in this thread (too bad there's not a way to have it on top of each new page) the words Mr Musk used yesterday? In this and a number of other threads it has been asserted Tesla's Tsk Tsk letters have been going out. I am 100% certain that is not what he said; rather, that they would/will be sending them. There is a nice difference: it's not just discussing future actions, it is itself a First Warning/ Shot Across The Bow. And once we get the exact words, maybe I'll request a change to this thread's title.
And it works, too. I say this first-hand. I like driving down to the W'burg SpC just to hang out there and snag a passing Model S driver to chat. And of course, I top off with those nice "free" electrons. I don't do it to demonstrate - or rather, contribute to - the Tragedy of the Commons, which is what the entire kerfuffle is about, but because it's fun.
Now, I've all of a sudden had suggested to me "Err....maybe what you're doing is not why we placed a SpC so close to your garage" quondam note from TM. So maybe I won't be doing it so often...
PS: Anyone very much up on his/her Robert's Rules? That's a pretty arcane one I threw out.....
I think Tesla, in a way, contradicted themselves. The SC's were supposed to be for long distance travel, but then they built the network out, in large part, for local charging.
If you were focused on long distance travel, Gillette WY or Des Moines IA would be built yesterday, FL and parts of CA are almost comically dense with SCs. Does everybody put their Tesla on a flat bed, have it shipped to FL or CA, fly there, and then road trip in those states?
The current number of SCs in the US is sufficient to cover, I bet, every mile of every interstate in the country. But it is not the case that we have that level of coverage because the chargers are very dense (local travel) in some areas and not at all in some areas (would-be long distance travel).
If the SC's were evenly spread across interstates and on the edges of population centers, this would not be as much of an issue.
All that being said, I consider this issue to be a growing pain for Tesla and a minor side effect of a brilliant and ambitious plan that is the SC network and technology.....it is a good problem to have in a way.
In 10 years there will be SC plazas, privately owned, with 100 kiosks, lounges with coffee shops, chair messages, and Subway, the current Superchargers quantity and placement will seem quaint and there will be plenty of capacity and Tesla won't even notice this issue.
If you were focused on long distance travel, Gillette WY or Des Moines IA would be built yesterday, FL and parts of CA are almost comically dense with SCs. Does everybody put their Tesla on a flat bed, have it shipped to FL or CA, fly there, and then road trip in those states?
The current number of SCs in the US is sufficient to cover, I bet, every mile of every interstate in the country. But it is not the case that we have that level of coverage because the chargers are very dense (local travel) in some areas and not at all in some areas (would-be long distance travel).
If the SC's were evenly spread across interstates and on the edges of population centers, this would not be as much of an issue.
All that being said, I consider this issue to be a growing pain for Tesla and a minor side effect of a brilliant and ambitious plan that is the SC network and technology.....it is a good problem to have in a way.
In 10 years there will be SC plazas, privately owned, with 100 kiosks, lounges with coffee shops, chair messages, and Subway, the current Superchargers quantity and placement will seem quaint and there will be plenty of capacity and Tesla won't even notice this issue.
