Sorry to resurrect this thread, but as a fellow stealth performance 3 owner (2019) I experienced the same false advertising of range and degradation (my lifetime efficiency is closer to 250). I’ve reviewed quite a few range tests and the 2018 and 19 M3s got no where near their estimated range when released. I have about a 12% degradation at 65k miles on top of the 20-30% deficit from over exaggerated EPA numbers. Newer models with the battery size increases and heat pump are far closer to their range estimations. Service dismissed my concerns as well and told me they were not allowed to give me further information than what a vague battery diagnostic report spit out.
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Model 3 (Stealth) Performance - 5y ownership, service history + high battery degradation?
- Thread starter stonelance
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That didn't sound right to me so I went and checked what's linked in my Tesla account, and you're correct - the warranty document Tesla currently serves out does not list a percentage. I did save a copy of my warranty document just after purchasing the car (also a 2018) though and it DOES list the threshold. Attached if anyone ever needs it. The capacity threshold is still on the website here also: https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-warranty
I'm assuming it's just Tesla trying to keep a single living documented applicable to multiple models on the website rather than anything nefarious to dodge warranty, but still glad to have the original.
Could you please explain what you mean by "not listing a percentage?"
From my understanding, the 2018 M3LR battery has a 8yr/120000 miles 70% degradation warranty.
If you go to your Tesla account and access the warranty documentation there is no longer a 70% degradation threshold specified (there's no capacity loss threshold that would trigger warranty coverage - at least in the document I'm getting: https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/New_Vehicle_Limited_Warranty_North_America_en_US.pdf). They even state in the current warranty policy "This version of the warranty is applicable to your vehicle and supercedes any other versions published online or in print"
It's significantly different and less inclusive than the document at the time of my purchase which I uploaded.
Edit - and that latest version I just looked at is even different from the I looked at on Sep 18. The one I looked at a couple weeks ago was significantly shorter and didn't include all the highlighted stuff below at all:
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Interesting data point... I've tried several times to do the BMS recalibration of running down the battery, letting the car sleep and then charging it back up and sleeping again, and every time it has made no difference. I kind of gave up and changed the car settings to 70% max charge, and it has been that way for a month or two. Some time in the last week or two the range estimate suddenly increased. I charged up to 90% to compare with the numbers I had in my original post, and i'm now seeing 261 miles of range at 90 vs the 235 I was seeing back in August, which is more in the 8% degradation range. Seems odd to me that this suddenly happened after numerous attempts to recalibrate failed. Either the conditions for recalibration are not particularly accurate, or possibly some recent software update made a difference? I don't recall when my current version was installed unfortunately (2023.27.7)
Candleflame
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johnny_cakes
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MagnusMako
Member
Even though it isn't explicitly stated in the "New_Vehicle_Limited_Warranty_North_America_en_US.pdf" you're quoting from, it is still on the vehicle warranty page article here. I would imagine Tesla could be in a legal situation at some point if they don't honor the 70% retention clearly stated on their website, but I don't know enough about people who've encountered hitting this threshold to know how Tesla has been handling those cases.
MagnusMako
Member
To give a data point to the OPs concern, I have a Dec 2018 Model 3 LR DM with 91,066 miles. I've done lots of hard pulls and drag racing and use it almost every day, while charging to 85-90% almost every day. It typically gets down to 40-60% before I'm charging again.
Using the Tessie app, my current degradation shows it's sitting around 15.7% with a usable capacity of 63.6 kWh and max range of 260 miles.
If 90% is 235, then your max range should be around 260/261. That's ~16% degradation, the same as mine with the same year and battery.
I would try to do a full discharge and recharge cycle and then find out what your range shows when charged back to 100%.
Using the Tessie app, my current degradation shows it's sitting around 15.7% with a usable capacity of 63.6 kWh and max range of 260 miles.
If 90% is 235, then your max range should be around 260/261. That's ~16% degradation, the same as mine with the same year and battery.
I would try to do a full discharge and recharge cycle and then find out what your range shows when charged back to 100%.
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In my experience it took several weeks of letting the car sleep at different charge levels before the BMS recalibrated. It's a gradual process, not something that happens instantly as soon as the car sleeps then wakes once.
I was getting 445-450km range in my 2019 Performance Stealth which has done 44,000km. After a few weeks of charging to 70% then driving to sub 20% it increased to 475km (295 miles). This is roughly 5% degredation.
Also FWIW I can roughly match the EPA range figures when driving around my city. I get that for certain driving styles it can be impossible, but it can be achieved for some people. Living in a warm climate where you don't need the heater and traffic is pretty quiet makes a big difference.
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Some do, with very good results for degradation.
I sold my 2021 M3P after 66K km / 41K mi and 2.5 years and had ~5% from the full pack when new(most batteries starts and newer exceeds 80.5kWh for that so in that only a few percent degradation.
Range wise, 492 km out of 507km new when I sold it.
Calendar aging causes the most part of the degradation and it reduces rapidly so another 2.5 years would maybe have put it at 4.5% at fice years age.
Calendar aging is what took the absolutely biggest part of your battery. You have not even many miles on it.
Keeping 90% in an average climate would ”cost about 6%* the first year in degradation from calendar aging.
After four tears from new 6% is doubled to 12%, and after five years about 13.5%.
This is from time at high SOC only.
I do not know the climate in Seattle but not too warm I guess?
The prognosis for the degradation at 8 years age of the car is about 21.5% degradation, assuming the BMS is correct and the 17% of today is correct. This is if continuing to using 90% as you do today.
Calendar aging from cells taken from a ’18 or ’19 model 3. (Panasonic 2170 cells)
Use the energy screen.
Average x calculated range x 100 / SOC (%) = Watt hours (divide by 1000 for kWh)
It is preferred to have high SOC at the check to reduce the rounding error.
Anyway, its not very high at 50-60% either so…(maximum about 50-60% is slightly below 2% error)
Original capacity was 77.8 kWh (specified capacity, from the BMS).
It doesnt matter.
The energy screen shows the actual range based on the actual consumption.
Average x calculated range = the energy in the battery at that moment.
Divided by the displayed SOC it shows the whole capacity (including buffer or brutto if you like that term better).
No impact on the calc.
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