If you fast charge, Tesla will permanently throttle charging

[Doug_G]

Sure there probably is an accelerated rolloff towards end of life. But that point looks to be pretty far out on Tesla packs. I believe there were a couple of Roadsters that got high mileage enough for the pack to need replacement; they may have been in that regime. But Roadster packs were also smaller.

 

[Ugliest1]

Glad you're prepared .

The Roadster is far louder - not even close.

A) Not only prepared, but plenty of experience!!
B) I stand corrected! Wow that must be loud loud loud.

 

[smac]

@Doug_G, it's those sort of cars that we really need to make meaning of the statistics, and why it's a shame the survey data isn't ongoing. (And of course to an extent the upgraded pack has spoilt such an exercise anyway. It was self selecting for cars that may be approaching that point to have upgraded anyway.)

I do know of one owner, (a countryman of mine who's name is not to be mentioned on TMC). That had what could only be explained as a cascading roll off (and not at a particularly high mileage or age, but I do suspect it was driven hard with lots of deep cycling, another potential difference in pack treatment vs longevity.).

Personally I'm comfortable with my S's pack, at least during my ownership period. What will be more interesting is how the pack holds up into the 2nd and 3rd ownership experiences, and what eventually sends it off to the junkyard as beyond economic repair. Let's not kid ourselves, for the S's that is what will happen. They are good cars, but not immortal* and will have a design life. (*Unlike the Roadsters, which I'm sure owners will keep on the road, official Tesla support or not! )

So getting somewhat back on topic: Is throttling simply because with greater inside knowledge and a larger sampling base than the PiA survey, Tesla trying to ensure the Model S meets the original internal design lifespan for the cars.

I'm not referring to the 8 year warranty here, rather something further away to be confident they don't have significant recourse if it's a typical bath tub curve.. i.e. warrant for 8 years/ 120k miles (the original Model S terms) but aim for 12 years & 250k miles to give a safety buffer.

I guess all we can do is sit back, and watch this play out.

 

[JeffK]

@Doug_G, it's those sort of cars that we really need to make meaning of the statistics, and why it's a shame the survey data isn't ongoing. (And of course to an extent the upgraded pack has spoilt such an exercise anyway. It was self selecting for cars that may be approaching that point to have upgraded anyway.)

I do know of one owner, (a countryman of mine who's name is not to be mentioned on TMC). That had what could only be explained as a cascading roll off (and not at a particularly high mileage or age, but I do suspect it was driven hard with lots of deep cycling, another potential difference in pack treatment vs longevity.).

Personally I'm comfortable with my S's pack, at least during my ownership period. What will be more interesting is how the pack holds up into the 2nd and 3rd ownership experiences, and what eventually sends it off to the junkyard as beyond economic repair. Let's not kid ourselves, for the S's that is what will happen. They are good cars, but not immortal* and will have a design life. (*Unlike the Roadsters, which I'm sure owners will keep on the road, official Tesla support or not! )

So getting somewhat back on topic: Is throttling simply because with greater inside knowledge and a larger sampling base than the PiA survey, Tesla trying to ensure the Model S meets the original internal design lifespan for the cars.

I'm not referring to the 8 year warranty here, rather something further away to be confident they don't have significant recourse if it's a typical bath tub curve.. i.e. warrant for 8 years/ 120k miles (the original Model S terms) but aim for 12 years & 250k miles to give a safety buffer.

I guess all we can do is sit back, and watch this play out.

If Jeff Dahn's research into extending the life of NMCs translates to NCAs or EV packs in general then we may see significantly longer battery lives in next five years or so. We'll be almost to the point where the useable life of the battery will be longer than the typical life of a car.

 

[sorka]

@sorka, how can you "disagree" with factual information as reported. My Roadster had 95% of its initial capacity remaining after 7 years. That is not debatable, I have logs spanning the time period.

I think you've got the wrong guy. I've made no such assertions or disagreements.

 

[Doug_G]

I think you've got the wrong guy. I've made no such assertions or disagreements.

You put a Disagree on my post. Click the List button and you'll see your name there.

 

[Cruisin]

How about everybody refrain from posting fake news like the above about charging, we have enough of it on TV.

 

[Max*]

How about everybody refrain from posting fake news like the above about charging, we have enough of it on TV.

Ugh, what? This thread is 73 pages, which post are you referring to?

 

[ABC2D]

Ugh, what? This thread is 73 pages, which post are you referring to?

ALL OF THEM!!! All 73 pages are fake damit news!!!

 

[JRP3]

Ugh, what? This thread is 73 pages, which post are you referring to?

Don't expect a rational response: Tesla was not the 1st to power a car with Panasonic 18650 Li-ion cells

 

[Christopher1]

Sure there probably is an accelerated rolloff towards end of life. But that point looks to be pretty far out on Tesla packs. I believe there were a couple of Roadsters that got high mileage enough for the pack to need replacement; they may have been in that regime. But Roadster packs were also smaller.

I know it's something SW setting or something like that. Because I remember exactly which trip it happened on. I noticed it just when I was taking the car out of our building at work. It would not spinn.. At all. On a factory floor.. And then 5 minutes later, going on the freeway) (Just charged it almost full to show it off to a coworker). One year ago. Now it won't spinn on gravel ether..
( warm battery and launch mode.. Remember it's kmt. Not mph -

)
I really miss the power this used to have. The battery has never stayed on high or low soc. 50-70% all the time, except before going out on trips etc. I put my alarm on, so I can start charging middle of the night, just to protect the battery from staying on high soc.
But I have driven the car "hard". I use a lot of tires. Probably more 0-60 then a rental car.
I don't care if I have to buy a new battery in two three years. I understand that something has to "go to hell" with my driving. But don't take my power away... I would be glad to buy a new 100kWh battery. But I won't buy a new P100D..

 

[n2mb_racing]

I know it's something SW setting or something like that. Because I remember exactly which trip it happened on. I noticed it just when I was taking the car out of our building at work. It would not spinn.. At all. On a factory floor.. And then 5 minutes later, going on the freeway) (Just charged it almost full to show it off to a coworker). One year ago. Now it won't spinn on gravel ether..
( warm battery and launch mode.. Remember it's kmt. Not mph -

)
I really miss the power this used to have. The battery has never stayed on high or low soc. 50-70% all the time, except before going out on trips etc. I put my alarm on, so I can start charging middle of the night, just to protect the battery from staying on high soc.
But I have driven the car "hard". I use a lot of tires. Probably more 0-60 then a rental car.
I don't care if I have to buy a new battery in two three years. I understand that something has to "go to hell" with my driving. But don't take my power away... I would be glad to buy a new 100kWh battery. But I won't buy a new P100D..

Try logging your kW output using powertools and see if it matches up with what other people are getting with the P85D.

 

[BGuz]

So, I shouldn't use a Super Charger? or what is a safe limit to use/charge before I get throttled?

 

[Brando]

@Doug_G, What will be more interesting is how the pack holds up into the 2nd and 3rd ownership experiences, and what eventually sends it off to the junkyard as beyond economic repair. Let's not kid ourselves, for the S's that is what will happen. They are good cars, but not immortal* and will have a design life.

1989 Saab 900 turbo SPG owned by Peter Gilbert, the Wisconsin man went 1,000,000 miles, including turbo. So I suspect Model S will easily do. Especially if they keep making them for say 20 years and the volume allows part prices to come down.

Saab offering free car to members of the Million Mile Club

Perhaps Tesla could have similar contest?

 

[smac]

1989 Saab 900 turbo SPG owned by Peter Gilbert, the Wisconsin man went 1,000,000 miles, including turbo. So I suspect Model S will easily do. Especially if they keep making them for say 20 years and the volume allows part prices to come down.

Probably not the best idea to compare Tesla to Saab

 

[Naonak]

So, I shouldn't use a Super Charger? or what is a safe limit to use/charge before I get throttled?

It is less than 6 MW of power. We don't know where the actual threshold is, but we know it's less than that. Please keep in mind, this appears to only apply to the 90 KW pack. The 85s and 100s don't seem to be as affected, or if they are, not as early as the 90's.

 

[smac]

@Naonak Do you mean 6MWh of energy?

(Sorry to be a pedant)

If so, that is what? Spit balling here: around 100 x 60 kWh's worth of Supercharging sessions (assuming a partial SOC to 80%) , or ball park 20k miles on SpC's.

 

[MP3Mike]

Please keep in mind, this appears to only apply to the 90 KW pack.

@Naonak I'm not sure that is the case anymore. Someone is reporting getting CHAdeMO like speeds when Supercharging a 75 kWh pack, and has had Tesla tell him he is being throttled because of too much DCFC activity. (Though it should be throttled that much.)

Here is the post: Supercharger getting mostly Chademo speeds

He noted that he thinks he has less than 100 DCFC sessions.

 

[MS16]

@Naonak I'm not sure that is the case anymore. Someone is reporting getting CHAdeMO like speeds when Supercharging a 75 kWh pack, and has had Tesla tell him he is being throttled because of too much DCFC activity. (Though it should be throttled that much.)

Here is the post: Supercharger getting mostly Chademo speeds

He noted that he thinks he has less than 100 DCFC sessions.

I wish Tesla would be more transparent and tell us the parameters of when they start throttling.

 

[ReddyLeaf]

I can't remember if I posted my experience or not but: 2015 70D, 30,000 mi, max rate 107-108 KW. Essentially all of my miles are out-of-town and most are using SCs. I've probably supercharged more than 100 times, at least 50 unique locations during trips to MN, WI, LA, Tucson, 3x to BC, 10x to Seattle/Portland, etc. I'll keep an eye on it, but I bought the car for long distance travel and will do my best to put 200,000 mi on it.