Free supercharger or pay per use?

[Model 3]

Wow! Just wow! This level of entitlement for something Tesla gives its customers for free is mind boggling. Make no mistake; you did not pay a single dime for the electricity used at Superchargers. It is free. You just paid for the onboard charger, just like customers paid for dual onboard chargers. You are not entitled to any free energy just because you are a Model S or Model X owner. Model 3 owners won't be entitled to it either. People should remember this. Tesla is giving us free electricity as a COURTESY. They can stop giving a specific customer (or everyone) this courtesy power any time they want.

Just to clear up a few misunderstandings.

1. There is NO "supercharger charger" in the car! The chargers is in - surprise! - the supercharger... It is about 12 charger in a supercharger, the same - or about the same - as you have one or two of in your car. So no, you do not pay a penny to have a "supercharger charger" installed in your car. The "supercharger hardware" in the car is a contactor that routes the power direct to the battery without going through the installed charger(s). This hardware is included on all cars produced by Tesla - except perhaps the Roadster. (Is there any DC charging on the Roadster?)
2. The $2000 fee to get supercharging in the 60 (included on all other models) is what you pay for 2a) the build-out and maintenance of the SuperCharger network and 2b) the electricity you may use.

So yes, you have paid for this electricity. Some uses more then they have paid for, some less and some does not use it at all.

 

[Tesloid]

Just to clear up a few misunderstandings.

1. There is NO "supercharger charger" in the car! The chargers is in - surprise! - the supercharger... It is about 12 charger in a supercharger, the same - or about the same - as you have one or two of in your car. So no, you do not pay a penny to have a "supercharger charger" installed in your car. The "supercharger hardware" in the car is a contactor that routes the power direct to the battery without going through the installed charger(s). This hardware is included on all cars produced by Tesla - except perhaps the Roadster. (Is there any DC charging on the Roadster?)
2. The $2000 fee to get supercharging in the 60 (included on all other models) is what you pay for 2a) the build-out and maintenance of the SuperCharger network and 2b) the electricity you may use.

So yes, you have paid for this electricity. Some uses more then they have paid for, some less and some does not use it at all.

Tesla makes money on optional features. Where each $ they make is invested is up to them. We don't get to segregate each $ made on each optional feature and then claim that specific $ is invested in specific infrastructure. You are assuming that the $2000 paid for the Supercharger feature is specifically used to pay for the customers' electricity. I could easily claim the air suspension feature is funding the SC network's electricity costs.

Whether the chargers are in the car, or outside, you paid for the equipment. Does not mean the energy is free as well. No guarantee of that. Tesla can revoke your "privilege" to use their electricity any day they want. Your $2000 for SC activation won't be reimbursed at that point since it is counted as equipment fees and not service fees. Though, I'd assume Tesla will avoid the PR hassle of denying a customer "free SC for life" and just dial down their SC charging to a trickle charge, effectively making it impractical.

 

[tga]

Wow! Just wow! This level of entitlement for something Tesla gives its customers for free is mind boggling. Make no mistake; you did not pay a single dime for the electricity used at Superchargers. It is free. You just paid for the onboard charger, just like customers paid for dual onboard chargers. You are not entitled to any free energy just because you are a Model S or Model X owner. Model 3 owners won't be entitled to it either. People should remember this. Tesla is giving us free electricity as a COURTESY. They can stop giving a specific customer (or everyone) this courtesy power any time they want.

How is this a "level of entitlement"?!? Except for the very early customers (and S60 owners who didn't pay for Supercharging), people bought the car expecting to be able to use Superchargers on trips. They were promised "free for life." You can't change that after the fact. It's dishonest/immoral at best, and a breach of contract at worst.

A couple of times a week, I need to make a 250 mile round trip, even during NE winters. I have no destination charging available. Without the SC midway, an S wouldn't work. If the SC goes down, is full, or otherwise unavailable, the car doesn't work for me. I'm not interested in a car that works for ~50% of my use. If I couldn't use the SC, I'd go back to an ICE, too. And I'd be pretty pissed about it.

 

[Model 3]

Tesla makes money on optional features. Where each $ they make is invested is up to them. We don't get to segregate each $ made on each optional feature and then claim that specific $ is invested in specific infrastructure. You are assuming that the $2000 paid for the Supercharger feature is specifically used to pay for the customers' electricity. I could easily claim the air suspension feature is funding the SC network's electricity costs.

Of course this is correct as you say it, but however you see it the electricity used on the SuperCharger is paid for by the price of the car (if you included the option if you should have the 60), or by the activation fee if it was not included in the price of the car. If you actually have paid for this electricity or not if you got an TMS60 without supercharger access is technically unknown, whenever it should be in the base-price or in the air suspension or whatever.

But the easiest and most correct way to see it is that the electricity is paid for by the supercharger option fee or the activation fee where it is necessary, or in the base price of the car. Not that I'm claiming that $2k from each sale is reserved in the books of Tesla to be used on superchargers and the electricity they use.

However you choose see it, your statement "you did not pay a single dime for the electricity used at Superchargers" is false.



... and yes, it is correct that you (if you paid the option/activation for TMS60) paid for the chargers. I do not dispute that, and never have. I was replaying to this statement from you: "You just paid for the onboard charger" as there is no onboard "supercharger" charger in the car, and the onboard AC-charger was not the topic of this thread or your post and has nothing to do with supercharging. So your statement here is false.



... and that, this two false statements from you, was all I wanted to point out.

 

[gregincal]

Wow! Just wow! This level of entitlement for something Tesla gives its customers for free is mind boggling. Make no mistake; you did not pay a single dime for the electricity used at Superchargers. It is free.

No, you don't get it. I don't want to be entitled, I want to have a workable model that makes the car practical.

If Tesla can make it workable and remain free, great. Many people here feel they can. Some of us are skeptical based on current usage (I think those who are optimistic mostly don't live in areas that have superchargers that are full a lot of the time already). I'm not going to take a Tesla on a road trip unless I can predict the trip length with reasonable accuracy, and I've been burned already.

 

[MP3Mike]

Just to clear up a few misunderstandings.

1. There is NO "supercharger charger" in the car! The chargers is in - surprise! - the supercharger... It is about 12 charger in a supercharger, the same - or about the same - as you have one or two of in your car. So no, you do not pay a penny to have a "supercharger charger" installed in your car. The "supercharger hardware" in the car is a contactor that routes the power direct to the battery without going through the installed charger(s). This hardware is included on all cars produced by Tesla - except perhaps the Roadster. (Is there any DC charging on the Roadster?)
2. The $2000 fee to get supercharging in the 60 (included on all other models) is what you pay for 2a) the build-out and maintenance of the SuperCharger network and 2b) the electricity you may use.

So yes, you have paid for this electricity. Some uses more then they have paid for, some less and some does not use it at all.

While there is no Supercharger in the car there is DC fast charging hardware that has to be enabled. Just look at the Model S 60:

• Base came with DC fast charging hardware installed but not enabled. (no Supercharging or CHAdeMO charging.)
• For $2,000, when you order your car, you could enable the DC fast charging hardware and get Supercharger access.
• For $1,900, after you got your car, you could enable the DC fast charging for CHAdeMO but not get Supercharger access.
• For $2,500, after you got your car, you could enable the DC fast charging hardware and get Supercharger access.

So it seems there is a $500 change charge, $1,400 to enable DC fast charging, and $600 to enable Supercharger access. So you are paying for the hardware in the car the enables DC fast charging hardware, it is not just a set of contactors.

The $600 is most likely allocated to electricity costs. (With the cost of actually building/maintaining the Supercharger network built in to the base price of every car.

Who knows if they have adjusted those figures and how much they are building in the price of every new Model S/X/3 for the DC fast charging hardware and Supercharger access/electricity.

 

[Model 3]

While there is no Supercharger in the car there is DC fast charging hardware that has to be enabled.

Yes, and that "DC fast charging hardware" is to quote myself from your quote: «The "supercharger hardware" in the car is a contactor that routes the power direct to the battery without going through the installed charger(s)». Cost to Tesla? $20? Maybe $30? Do you really think Tesla have 470% profit on this hardware and gives you the supercharger network including "free for life" electricity for $600?

For $1,900, after you got your car, you could enable the DC fast charging for CHAdeMO but not get Supercharger access.

Yes, that is correct. And this tells me - and should tell you to - that Tesla think everybody, at least everybody that think they need DC-fast-charging, really should be paying their part of the supercharger initiative. Yes you pay for part of the supercharger build out and maintains and electricity to it by getting this. What you get is a $600 rebate since you are not going to be using the network. But you still have the option to phone in and enable supercharging if you need it (for a fee), so you still have the security that the network provides. And THAT is the most important part of it to me. No, this $1900 price do NOT reflect the value of the "DC fast charging hardware" in the car.