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It pre conditions still , the even though you are near to SC, I had my preconditioning even I was die to 4% when it it re-routed my another SC during the Christmas holiday 2023.i believe the car doesn’t precondition if the arrival SOC is below 20%.
But it will use up the buffer, that I spent extra charging time putting in.My experience is that it will only precondition if there is enough juice to do so before the reaching the SC. If not, it won’t precondition.
Interesting, I just did a 7000km road trip over Christmas holidays and the car never displayed the precondition message below 20%. However it was hot and many many hours at highway speed.It pre conditions still , the even though you are near to SC, I had my preconditioning even I was die to 4% when it it re-routed my another SC during the Christmas holiday 2023.
On road trips the battery is usually warm enough just from driving. Long driving and charging keep the battery pretty toasty, especially when it's also warm outside. I've done countless road trips while running ScanMyTesla looking at the battery temperature.Interesting, I just did a 7000km road trip over Christmas holidays and the car never displayed the precondition message below 20%. However it was hot and many many hours at highway speed.
Another observation - the SC were very busy and mostly limited to 64kW - could be the reason why?
What’s your charge rate without preconditioning? Well do two hour highway stints and when we roll into a 250, we’ll see around 150max. When we precondition the car takes the full rateOn road trips the battery is usually warm enough just from driving. Long driving and charging keep the battery pretty toasty, especially when it's also warm outside. I've done countless road trips while running ScanMyTesla looking at the battery temperature.
Below 20% and no precondition after highway speeds, I saw 172 which I believe is the max for the LFP.What’s your charge rate without preconditioning? Well do two hour highway stints and when we roll into a 250, we’ll see around 150max. When we precondition the car takes the full rate
What’s your charge rate without preconditioning? Well do two hour highway stints and when we roll into a 250, we’ll see around 150max. When we precondition the car takes the full rate
My experience is that it will only precondition if there is enough juice to do so before the reaching the SC. If not, it won’t precondition.
Given that a dual-motor Tesla uses roughly 7 kW for preconditioning, it would take about 3.5 hours to burn 25 kWh. Do you have the numbers for the heat capacity and weight of the battery? I'm not saying you're wrong, but 25 kWh seems so out of range that I would like to run the numbers myself.It heated up the battery to about 45 C. That's pretty warm. You need a lot of energy to heat a battery from 0 C to 45 C. I did the math, it is around 25 kWh of energy.
Since the charge rate scales down with temperature of the battery it's hard to say. At 0 degree Celsius, the battery doesn't charge at all. At 45 C it charges at max. Of course state of charge also matters. So we have two variables: battery temperature and state of charge. The car doesn't tell you what the battery temperature is unless you go into service mode or use another tool. And then there is the variable of the supercharger station. How busy is it and how much can it supply.
Given that a dual-motor Tesla uses roughly 7 kW for preconditioning, it would take about 3.5 hours to burn 25 kWh. Do you have the numbers for the heat capacity and weight of the battery? I'm not saying you're wrong, but 25 kWh seems so out of range that I would like to run the numbers myself.
Also, one other data point that hasn't been mentioned so far: SC sessions used to be billed by the minute. No preconditioning resulted in longer charging time and therefore higher costs. Now that we're billed by the kWh, the charging time doesn't matter anymore (except that we need to charge longer to make up for the energy used for preheating).
Personally I think that preconditioning still makes sense. It limits the time we're blocking a SC stall, and if it's a factor, it also gets us back on the road sooner. As others have mentioned, driving warms the battery, too. That's the main reason why I don't usually precondition more than 30 minutes. Obviously, that also depends on other factors such as distance driven, outside temperature etc.
The proposition isn’t to -avoid- pre-conditioning. It is delaying pre-conditioning.The danger with charging a Lithium-chemistry pack in cold weather is Lithium plating. That is probably the worst thing one can do to one’s battery, is largely irreversible, and if the rate of charge – the C-rate – is high enough that phenomenon will begin even at fairly modest temperatures.
DC Fast Charging, by its very nature, produces higher C-rates. Tesla’s BMS will largely – but probably not entirely – prevent C-rates that are detrimental.
Heat is normally a very bad thing for Lithium batteries because it accelerates degradation. The only scenario where one would want to suck it up and endure that heat (and its associated pack degradation) is when DC Fast Charging. Lithium plating is a dire condition and you want to avoid it at all costs.
Ergo preconditioning.
Driving alone will not get pack temps high enough that one does not need to precondition. Even a road trip, where one is driving for hours on end, will not get the pack remotely as hot as a fully-preconditioned-on-the-way-to-a-Supercharger pack.
Thermal management of a large Lithium pack such as Tesla uses is rather inefficient. It uses waste heat from the stators to warm the pack. It neither heats nor cools very rapidly. That’s why preconditioning typically takes a while.
Slower charging (lower C-rates) do reduce the likelihood of Lithium plating. That’s why the BMS reduces the charge rate if the pack is not fully preconditioned. Unfortunately, the science of when Lithium plating begins to occur is not exact. Which is one of the reasons Tesla’s BMS is not totally protective.
Charging a Lithium battery in cold temperatures is inherently risky business. Trying to fool or avoid preconditioning when heading to a Supercharger is certainly a questionable practice.
That’s a pretty big assertion! “Plugging into a SC without preconditioning may damage your battery back.”
I have not seen anything official that would suggest this.
I agree - claiming that charging without preconditioning causes damage is a huge reach.
What IS clear is a trade off in charging time. Basically you're giving up some stored KWh's to be in a condition where filling up will go faster. This means shorter stops - especially charging in the 0-50% range which is typically good on long travel.