California warranty on all EVs 10 year / 150k miles?

[hwano]

Are all Tesla owners from CA warrantied on their batteries for 10 years / 150k miles?

I read an article today that stated all EVs sold in California must come with a 10 year / 150k mile warranty on the battery.

I'm a bit confused because when I looked up the law it states it's only for PZEV:

California Vehicle and Emissions Warranty Periods | California Air Resources Board

1990 and Newer Model Passenger Cars, Light Duty Trucks, Medium-Duty Vehicles, and Medium Duty Engines Applies to passenger cars, light duty trucks, and medium- duty vehicles with a GVWR between 8,501 and 14,000 pounds

ww2.arb.ca.gov

I read on another forum: "BEVs are classified as PZEVs -- basically CARB classifies any vehicle that has a battery that is used for primary movement of the vehicle (e.g. not a "boost" motor like a hybrid) as a PZEV. BEVs are a subset of PZEVs". Does anyone know if this is true?

 

[ucmndd]

The 10/150 warranty requirement as I understand it is JUST for PZEVs - i.e. hybrids.

I don’t believe BEVs are a subset of PZEVs. Thus there is no 10/150 requirement for pure BEVs. If there were, Tesla’s HV battery warranty doc would have to reflect that, and it doesn’t.

There is an effort underway to change this, although the proposed changes wouldn’t take effect until 2026.

https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/sites/default/files/2021-12/draft%20zev%20warranty%201962.8.pdf

 

[hwano]

Just found this KBB article from a couple months ago:

"California goes even further, requiring a 10-year, 150,000-mile warranty on EV and hybrid batteries. Toyota has adopted that standard in all 50 states."

Source: https://www.kbb.com/car-advice/hybrid-ev-battery-warranty/

 

[hwano]

The 10/150 warranty requirement as I understand it is JUST for PZEVs - i.e. hybrids.

I don’t believe BEVs are a subset of PZEVs. Thus there is no 10/150 requirement for pure BEVs. If there were, Tesla’s HV battery warranty doc would have to reflect that, and it doesn’t.

Right... Tesla's aren't partial zero emissions, but I hope we're wrong

 

[whisperingshad]

Tesla has 8 yr warranty and 120k for most models, some 100k and some 150k.

 

[whisperingshad]

Just found this KBB article from a couple months ago:

"California goes even further, requiring a 10-year, 150,000-mile warranty on EV and hybrid batteries. Toyota has adopted that standard in all 50 states."

Source: https://www.kbb.com/car-advice/hybrid-ev-battery-warranty/

i saw that too, and i think KBB wrong, CARB only sets for PHEV so far. Fed level i believe sets 8 yrs... not much solid info though

 

[ucmndd]

How long will my EV battery last? California proposes degradation limits

Electric vehicle batteries that don't last the life of the vehicle miss the environmental point—and CARB won't let that slide.

www.greencarreports.com

This article talks about the currently proposed regs and mentions the current difference in requirements between PZEV and BEVs.

 

[cwerdna]

Just found this KBB article from a couple months ago:

"California goes even further, requiring a 10-year, 150,000-mile warranty on EV and hybrid batteries."

Source: https://www.kbb.com/car-advice/hybrid-ev-battery-warranty/

That article is wrong when it comes to pure EV batteries. They should retract it.

Search https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/sites/default/files/2019-07/cleancomplete lev-ghg regs 10-19.pdf for warrant, You will see the references are all for PZEVs, TZEVs, etc. and not BEVs.

Wayback Machine says:

10. Comment: Are there any battery warranty requirements for ZEVs and BEVxs
similar to the 10 year/150k mi for TZEV vehicle batteries?

Response: There is a 10 year/150,000 mile extended warranty on the zero
emission energy storage device used for traction power on TZEVs and BEVxs.
There is no warranty on the traction battery for ZEVs. [CCR, Title13,
1962.2(c)(2)(D)

11. Comment: What are the traction battery requirements for warranty on ZEV
vehicles, both BEV and FCV?
Response: Please see response to Comment 10 above."

AFAIK, it's still true that only AT-PZEV hybrids and enhanced AT-PZEV plug-in hybrids (aka TZEVs) if they are to receive that certification must have the 10 year/150K mile HV battery warranty. Hybrids or PHEVs WITHOUT that aren't required to have that long warranty. We on Priuschat ran into this with former Prius c and Lexus CT. They weren't AT-PZEV, so back then, they didn't get the longer HV battery warranty.

 

[VICE]

Are all Tesla owners from CA warrantied on their batteries for 10 years / 150k miles?

I read an article today that stated all EVs sold in California must come with a 10 year / 150k mile warranty on the battery.

I'm a bit confused because when I looked up the law it states it's only for PZEV:

California Vehicle and Emissions Warranty Periods | California Air Resources Board

1990 and Newer Model Passenger Cars, Light Duty Trucks, Medium-Duty Vehicles, and Medium Duty Engines Applies to passenger cars, light duty trucks, and medium- duty vehicles with a GVWR between 8,501 and 14,000 pounds

ww2.arb.ca.gov

I read on another forum: "BEVs are classified as PZEVs -- basically CARB classifies any vehicle that has a battery that is used for primary movement of the vehicle (e.g. not a "boost" motor like a hybrid) as a PZEV. BEVs are a subset of PZEVs". Does anyone know if this is true?

My Tesla Model S turns 10 years old today!!
September 29th, 2012 took delivery
Battery at 88%; VIN low 100's. Still drives perfectly and smooth.
No Sensors, no cameras, no autopilot, Just a battery, motor, and driver.

Still love it.

My guess, if that old car and battery are still chuggin after 10 years.
Can guess that anything built these days will last much longer.

 

[gaswalla]

@VICE , I also am celebrating 10 years! (Fremont tour and delivery and early S)… you should consider yourself lucky if you are still on the original battery pack - water intrusion and BMS faults apparently are common. Keeping the car out of rough weather and driving very little probably have helped out a lot. (Me: car has seen perfect weather, but has 320k miles, and is on second battery)

 

[whisperingshad]

I know someone with 2 40s(well 60s limited to 40) and they are still alive more or less

 

[girlmeetsgrape]

@VICE , I also am celebrating 10 years! (Fremont tour and delivery and early S)… you should consider yourself lucky if you are still on the original battery pack - water intrusion and BMS faults apparently are common. Keeping the car out of rough weather and driving very little probably have helped out a lot. (Me: car has seen perfect weather, but has 320k miles, and is on second battery)

Hi there. When did your first battery die? We're coming up on eight years and I want it to die before the 150K warranty cap and we're getting perilously close at 143K on the odometer. Utterly problem free Model S except for door handle replacements so far. We're maximally charging each night to try to force battery failure but so far, nothing. Any advice is welcome. Also in LA with perfect weather but we've driven it a bit in the snow to Utah over the years.

 

[gaswalla]

if your car has 8 years, it should have unlimited miles warranty... My first battery went 250k but had been throttled at superchargers