Anti-Tesla Gibberish

[Grendal]

I appreciate Sarah's endorsement of Tesla by being against them.

The Republicans and their mouthpieces forget that Tesla received their loan from G. W. Bush's ATVM loan program. They should instead be trying to take credit for Tesla's success. Instead they want to include Tesla in slinging mud at Obama and the left as part of "green" money. It is all knee-jerk and incorrect.

It is the following equation in their mind: EV = green = Left = wasteful spending = bad

The ATVM loan program was not a "green" loan program.

 

[Doug_G]

Okay, guys, I just moved several postings to snippiness (a snippy post and two that quoted it).

Politics don't seem to mix with this forum. Please keep your comments to Palin's commentary and avoid partisan bickering, or I'll banish the whole thread. Thanks!

 

[Andrew]

Okay, guys, I just moved several postings to snippiness

Politics don't seem to mix with this forum. Please keep your comments to Palin's commentary and avoid partisan bickering, or I'll banish the whole thread. Thanks!

Thanks Doug_G. Regardless of her politics, I think we should all stop talking about her lies and misleading half-truths. By responding at all we're giving her what she wants.

To that same point, I'm disappointed that Musk responded to her statement at all (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/321342187067543552) - giving her nonsense more time in the news cycle than it deserves (which is none, really).

 

[dflye]

I'm not sure how one could discuss Palin and her statements in a non-political way, as she has become such a polarizing mouth-piece for certain viewpoints, so maybe just shut this thread down?

 

[JRP3]

David Stockman lumps Tesla in with Fisker: http://www.minyanville.com/business...esla253A-Green-Vanities-of/4/10/2013/id/49174

 

[jeff_adams]

Tesla is once again on the front page of MSN (and I bet Yahoo News as well). Elon wins even when attacked.

 

[Doug_G]

I'm not sure how one could discuss Palin and her statements in a non-political way, as she has become such a polarizing mouth-piece for certain viewpoints, so maybe just shut this thread down?

Yeah, I knew from the beginning that this thread was going to go off the rails, which is why I was keeping an eye on it.

The moderators hesitate to lock threads unless they really get out of control, and even then it usually just causes the discussion to pop up somewhere else. Banishing to snippiness works surprisingly well.

 

[tdelta1000]

It's a shame that Mrs. Palin has allowed stupidity to supersede good common sense.

 

[Lloyd]

Apparently Bill O'Reilly took some ill-informed shot at Tesla yesterday too. It makes me sad. Being conservative is not about being ignorant, these people do not represent us well.

+1 !!

 

[Grendal]

David Stockman lumps Tesla in with Fisker: http://www.minyanville.com/business...esla253A-Green-Vanities-of/4/10/2013/id/49174

Getting his talking points from Sarah Palin? Wow. These people never bring up Ford - ever. They just don't get that they lost the election and that, long term, they need to be on the side of Tesla, America, Manufacturing, American Jobs, American Industrial Technology, and the future. The Right should be all for Tesla succeeding and they could even take credit since Bush's administration created the ATVM loan program.

 

[Beckler]

I'm not sure how one could discuss Palin and her statements in a non-political way, as she has become such a polarizing mouth-piece for certain viewpoints, so maybe just shut this thread down?

...and lose useful discussion points in the process. Such is the nature of moderation. Just my opinion, but it's *never* useful, except for the usual things which all forums have (profanity, threats, racism, etc...) Other than that, just let people talk. We're big boys, we can take it. And ironically, it's not like Musk is the type who's afraid of calling people out--quite the opposite.

 

[NigelM]

To that same point, I'm disappointed that Musk responded to her statement at all (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/321342187067543552) - giving her nonsense more time in the news cycle than it deserves (which is none, really).

All advertising is good advertising? Musk has a dry sense of humor and his comment about being deeply wounded was undoubtedly sarcastic.

Regardless of politics I'd be surprised if any Alaskan leader came out in favor of EVs. ~$1,000 oil fund gift annually per individual is a lot for anyone to argue against.

 

[dflye]

...and lose useful discussion points in the process. Such is the nature of moderation. Just my opinion, but it's *never* useful, except for the usual things which all forums have (profanity, threats, racism, etc...) Other than that, just let people talk. We're big boys, we can take it. And ironically, it's not like Musk is the type who's afraid of calling people out--quite the opposite.

Well, in that case, you can find my other comments over in the snippiness thread.

- - - Updated - - -

Regardless of politics I'd be surprised if any Alaskan leader came out in favor of EVs. ~$1,000 oil fund gift annually per individual is a lot for anyone to argue against.

Alaska is a unique state when it comes to money for nothing.

Well, nothing as perceived by those in Alaska who can't see beyond their TV set to the outside world affected by their "free" money.

 

[aznt1217]

goodness gracious. I saw this and flipped. I tweeted to Elon yesterday and was saying that if this many people hate you, you're doing something right (in fact many things).

1. It was a Bush program
2. If you're in Alaska you want to preserve nature. ICE is the worlds dumbest scientist experiment
3. Detroit took bailout money as well. Nobody raised a huge stink.
4. Are you seriously challenging a guy who taught himself rocket science, created a rocket, and docked with the space station all within 2 years. Seriously... this is just a stupid bet.

 

[jvonbokel]

The US treasury was put in harm’s way in all three of these cases not simply to boost the debatable concept of electric-battery vehicles. The global automotive industry is already rife with efforts in that direction by incumbent car companies including the Toyota Prius, the Nissan Leaf, the Chevy Volt, the upcoming (2013) Ford Escape electric vehicle, and countless more.

This is classic... "Hey, why do we need to give $465M to Tesla, when Nissan and Ford (among others) are already doing it?" Setting aside the benefits of competition in the marketplace, he seems completely oblivious to the fact that Ford recieved a $6B loan (nearly 13 times Tesla's loan) and Nissan received a $1.6B loan (more than 3 times Tesla's loan). GM (Chevy) also got even more gov't assistance, albeit under different programs.

Also, he frames it as if these companies received the funds after they were already struggling ("failing vanity projects of Silicon Valley billionaires that are now being bailed out by the taxpayers for no discernible reason" & "big bucks from Washington are being used to prop up billion-dollar bids by venture capitalists". Admittedly Tesla was having cash flow problems (to put it mildly) at the time, but they had a solid (albeit risky) business plan which has now been proven successful (profitable).

I guess it just goes to show how much your perspective and/or preconceived notions can color your conclusions. Large parts of the article stink of a haphazard misreading of facts with a set narrative already ingrained. To me, I'll take it as a reminder to try to keep an open mind when I read things I don't agree with.

 

[quartzav]

They did raise much stink during election for GM. Not for Nissan and Ford though.

goodness gracious. I saw this and flipped. I tweeted to Elon yesterday and was saying that if this many people hate you, you're doing something right (in fact many things).

1. It was a Bush program
2. If you're in Alaska you want to preserve nature. ICE is the worlds dumbest scientist experiment
3. Detroit took bailout money as well. Nobody raised a huge stink.
4. Are you seriously challenging a guy who taught himself rocket science, created a rocket, and docked with the space station all within 2 years. Seriously... this is just a stupid bet.

 

[Arnold Panz]

I think we can stop with the "It was a Bush program!" argument. I'm very confident that the objections of Palin, O'Reilly and others are because it could make Obama look good if his administration picked a "winner" out of this program. Solyndra was the biggest "scandal" of Obama's first term (until Benghazi, I guess), and Obama's opponents are desperate to find a similar failure on his watch, and even more concerned about there being a big success. If McCain had won in 2008 and his administration had given the same loan to Tesla, you can bet there would be none of these types of attacks on Tesla. It's just politics.

 

[Martini]

Ignorance isn't something that is just prevalent one side of the aisle or the other: it is equally applied in combination with gullibility to huge swaths of the population.

Why should one research and think for oneself, when one can copy/paste a witty sound bite in some social media app that expresses the opinions one purports to uphold, often without even having a clue whatsoever of any reality behind the sound bite.

If there were to be any voter suppression in this country, I'd be wholeheartedly in favor of it being based upon a simple test of competency, comprehension and lucidity given at the polling location on any matter being voted upon. That should really clear out the polls for the most part, as most people have no real clue what they are voting for / against, they are just voting based upon sound bites from talking heads.

I don't think Palin or O'Reilly are being ignorant. I just think that facts no longer encumber political talk.

 

[SebastianR]

I don't think Palin or O'Reilly are being ignorant. I just think that facts no longer encumber political talk.

I'm not going into the politics of this, but did you guys consider the fact, that a lot of shorts need to offload before the next earnings call? So of course you need to use whatever tricks you have to drag the company into the mud.

I wouldn't be surprised if in the next days a mysterious issue with only a select few of cars arise - something that makes the Model S look really bad. Or if some reputable newspaper all of a sudden broders another Tesla.

I mean, look around strange coincidents happen at times see e.g. AAPL here...

So, having all this in mind, I don't even know if this is politics or simply money talking here.

 

[mknox]

3. Detroit took bailout money as well. Nobody raised a huge stink.

...but this wasn't bail out money. Ford and Nissan got much larger loans than Tesla. Are they "losers" too?