745 miles (5 supercharger sessions) in one day

[Kipernicus]

Owners could put their phone numbers on their dash, but some may not be comfortable doing that. Better that Tesla knows how to reach them if needed while their car is supercharging.

My wife's immediate reaction to the thought of leaving our phone number was "well that's just asking for someone to call you over to carjack you".

I agree with yours and Trnsl8r's thoughts about supercharger access. This also supports comments in other threads that Supercharger sites need several HPWCs and roadster HPCs (perhaps a unit with selectable cables) to supplement the superchargers and ensure access. If you're going to be shopping for hours, or hiking, or sleeping, use the HPWC not the super.

 

[tdiggity]

When the model S becomes mainstream, you'll have people that won't know about these things. No matter how much signage you put up, they'll be ignored. For example: slow people in the fast lane, large cars in "Compact Only" spaces, and so on.

I really hope they figure something out soon!

 

[JoshG]

It's simple - charger wont operate on a car until its logged with Tesla and they verify your SMS with a text message you'd need to reply to in order to start the juice flowing. Done. Now they can reach you if your turn is up. No one gets juice unless they opt in to the "fair sharing" program.

 

[Trnsl8r]

It's simple - charger wont operate on a car until its logged with Tesla and they verify your SMS with a text message you'd need to reply to in order to start the juice flowing. Done. Now they can reach you if your turn is up. No one gets juice unless they opt in to the "fair sharing" program.

Don't think that's needed. Pretty sure the supercharger will know what car it is, thereby be able to look up owner's info in TM's records.

 

[NuclearPowered]

You all are too nice.

I would implement a 30 min max charge time in the charging system while others are waiting. 30 min and juice cuts off no questions asked

 

[JoshG]

Don't think that's needed. Pretty sure the supercharger will know what car it is, thereby be able to look up owner's info in TM's records.

Maybe, but not sure they have my cell phone number.

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You all are too nice.

I would implement a 30 min max charge time in the charging system while others are waiting. 30 min and juice cuts off no questions asked

Owner still needs to get a notification like an SMS. The way the bays are designed and due to the extremely short cable on the supercharger, even if juice is cut off, no one else can charge until owner returns and moves the car. It's not like the HPWC or roadster HPC, with long enough cable to charge a bunch of cars parked nearby...

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It's a shame there isn't a 20 foot cable on the supercharger... then after 30 minutes, the juice could stop, the car could "release" the cable, and another owner is free to park nearby and just move the cable to his/her car.

 

[MikeK]

View attachment 12808

A bit OT for this thread, but it looks like you've emulated Elon's sticker placement for your HOV sticker, correct? Using one of the side stickers for the back, and going with a single sticker.

I will be interested to know if that actually passes muster with the CHP.

 

[palmer_md]

You all are too nice.

I would implement a 30 min max charge time in the charging system while others are waiting. 30 min and juice cuts off no questions asked

This does not solve any problems. The car may not be charging any longer, but it is still parked in the way, and nobody else can use the charger. There must be a way to get in contact with the driver (not necessarily the owner) of the car. I like Josh's idea of a sms to start the charge which gives Tesla a driver contact number.

 

[mdh]

Afraid I didn't keep accurate records, sorry.

While I did prove to myself that this can be done, I'm not sure, even with Superchargers, that I can say it's a piece of cake, or that it's for everyone. It's not like filling with gas. It produces some anxiety as you weigh tradeoff of waiting for more charge level (as the rate of charging begins dropping) vs just going with less "cushion" of range. The other thing that nearly got me in trouble were the relatively large elevation changes which drastically affects range.

But in the end, charging time added more than a full hour of time to the normally 5.5 hour journey, each way. Not something everyone will find acceptable, and that's with easy access to Superchargers my whole journey. Half-hour supercharges are NOT enough to safely get to the next one.

So Superchargers minimize range anxiety, but don't eliminate it.

And there's a new anxiety that's very real: Supercharger availability anxiety. If the station is in use, you might have multiple hours of delay. Owner could have wandered away shopping, sleeping, or whatever and you have no way to charge until he or she returns.

Tesla needs to have a reservation and alert system. The network knows which car is charging and Tesla can reach the owner by phone or SMS to get them to move if someone else needs the bay. I think owners need to agree to be reachable in exchange for the free fuel. To make sure you're reachable, maybe you need to reply to an SMS every 20 minutes of supercharge to keep the juice flowing and see if you now need to share the charge bay with another owner who may urgently need a charge.

It's going to happen - the bay(s) are full and an owner with very little power left will need the spot and the other owners are off shopping or on a hike or whatever. We have to find a way to avoid monopolization of the Superchargers. As it is, even with pretty few S drivers in California, as you see in the pictures, at both Harris (1bay) and Tejon ( 2 bays operational), had another driver pulled in, there'd have been no way to charge, and no way to reach me if I had walked to a restaurant or gone to a movie.

Owners could put their phone numbers on their dash, but some may not be comfortable doing that. Better that Tesla knows how to reach them if needed while their car is supercharging.

These are exactly my biggest concerns with EVs.... the charging network must be overbuilt to have an extra margin of capacity. I think you mentioned only one bay at Harris? Nuts.

I think in general, the charging infrastructure needs to charge ($) people upon charging completion as a motivation tool to move one's car.

 

[RDoc]

The real time internet Supercharger availability and reservation idea sounds to me like a very good, almost essential feature. To fund the system, maybe it costs $10 to make a reservation and/or a general yearly fee for access to it.

If long cords aren't an option for safety, and/or mechanical reasons, how about having more charging parking slots, each with their own short cord, than there are actual chargers. The idea is if there are 3 chargers, there are 6 slots and they're serviced in arrival order, possibly modified by reservations. Once a car finishes charging, the free charger is switched to the next slot which has been plugged in and waiting the longest. If someone is down the street having a 3 hour pedicure they're taking a parking slot but not a charger.

If a reservation has been made and a non-reservation car pulls into the last slot, there's a warning issued stating when the slot must be vacated. If the reservation holder shows up and there are no free slots, there are various penalties such as being prohibited from using the Superchargers, the car's range being shortened by software, the same Christmas carol by Alvin and the Chipmunks being played for the next 4 hours of drive time, etc.

 

[mattjn]

Even with reservations, this issue isn't going to go completely away due to the nature of the batteries. If/when EV becomes mainstream and the majority of the cars sold, chargers need to be the same number as gas stations are now. I know Tesla has said that 100 or fewer superchargers could cover the country, but that would not be nearly enough when everyone is driving an electric vehicle.

 

[VolkerP]

how about having more charging parking slots, each with their own short cord, than there are actual chargers. The idea is if there are 3 chargers, there are 6 slots and they're serviced in arrival order, possibly modified by reservations. Once a car finishes charging, the free charger is switched to the next slot which has been plugged in and waiting the longest. If someone is down the street having a 3 hour pedicure they're taking a parking slot but not a charger.

As I understood it, the output of one supercharger unit of 120kW can be split up between two parking slots. Possibly in increments of 10kW. While one Model S tapers off at 40kW, 80kW are available to another car.

With a 500kVA grid connection like at Folsom, a supercharger site is good for 4 superchargers @120kW and 8 charge/park slots.

 

[NuclearPowered]

Maybe, but not sure they have my cell phone number.

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Owner still needs to get a notification like an SMS. The way the bays are designed and due to the extremely short cable on the supercharger, even if juice is cut off, no one else can charge until owner returns and moves the car. It's not like the HPWC or roadster HPC, with long enough cable to charge a bunch of cars parked nearby...

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It's a shame there isn't a 20 foot cable on the supercharger... then after 30 minutes, the juice could stop, the car could "release" the cable, and another owner is free to park nearby and just move the cable to his/her car.

I'm just not sure what notifying the owner would really do? If someone wants to ignore a x min clock while they are resting or eating during travel, as SC are intended to be used, then why wouldn't they just ignore a SMS? I've seen people sit the gas pump at a full station to go by the fast food mart while they are not pumping. An SMS to the owner without some kind of negative consequence is useless. If one needs x amount of miles to their destination, will he/she care if someone is patiently waiting?

You could say a solution might be blocking access to future SC for repeat offenders, affecting car parameters, etc... but that really isn't an option. SC is an advertised feature that comes with owning the car. I am not aware that anyone taking delievery now is signing any kind of supercharger agreement, or even that there is a posted sign stating any type of rules at the stations. Charging owers for time spent plugged in, charging or not, would be even more effective. Overbuilding the network would work too.

I think we're likely to see crowding as early as next year during holiday travel time. With as big as I hope Tesla gets, assuming everyone will be a upstanding, good citizen is a mistake.

 

[jvonbokel]

If long cords aren't an option for safety, and/or mechanical reasons, how about having more charging parking slots, each with their own short cord, than there are actual chargers. The idea is if there are 3 chargers, there are 6 slots and they're serviced in arrival order, possibly modified by reservations. Once a car finishes charging, the free charger is switched to the next slot which has been plugged in and waiting the longest. If someone is down the street having a 3 hour pedicure they're taking a parking slot but not a charger.

+1 This is a really good idea.

 

[ClearwaterBchSteve]

I would implement a 30 min max charge time in the charging system while others are waiting. 30 min and juice cuts off no questions asked

That's a good start. How would the system know if people are waiting? Having never been to a Supercharger, I'm not sure how they are laid out, but curious. Do you just drive up and plug in on your own? Is their any attendant or check in procedure?

 

[Robert.Boston]

Even with reservations, this issue isn't going to go completely away due to the nature of the batteries. If/when EV becomes mainstream and the majority of the cars sold, chargers need to be the same number as gas stations are now. I know Tesla has said that 100 or fewer superchargers could cover the country, but that would not be nearly enough when everyone is driving an electric vehicle.

I disagree -- the comparison is inapt.

Nearly all EV charging is done at home or at other destinations, whereas "gassing up" always occurs at gas stations. The neighborhood gas stations will become irrelevant.

In contrast, the gas stations used for longer distance driving may have too few slots. It only takes 5 minutes or so to fill a gas tank, but it takes at least 30 to (partially) Supercharge. So the long-run demand for SC plug points, or their equivalent, could be much greater than the current supply of these mid-route gas stations.

 

[RDoc]

I disagree -- the comparison is inapt.

Nearly all EV charging is done at home or at other destinations, whereas "gassing up" always occurs at gas stations. The neighborhood gas stations will become irrelevant.

In contrast, the gas stations used for longer distance driving may have too few slots. It only takes 5 minutes or so to fill a gas tank, but it takes at least 30 to (partially) Supercharge. So the long-run demand for SC plug points, or their equivalent, could be much greater than the current supply of these mid-route gas stations.

I think that's exactly correct. Furthermore if most destinations like motels, restaurants, ski areas, etc. have even relatively slow chargers it takes a lot of load off the long distance Supercharger system. Moderate power electricity is really ubiquitous, and installing a 30A J1772 charge point is a whole lot cheaper and easier than a gas pump.

 

[Brian H]

These are exactly my biggest concerns with EVs.... the charging network must be overbuilt to have an extra margin of capacity. I think you mentioned only one bay at Harris? Nuts.

...

That's the only actual solution. More charge units where demand is high! All the other solutions involve ridiculous levels of nanny-ocracy and are just begging for disputes, etc. Since, as Elon says, the actual chargers are now cheap and easy to install, keeping a near or actual surplus available is by far the best way to go. (Statistically speaking, n+1 or n+2 greatly increases the odds of one being free, more than a simple ratio of the two numbers to n.)