No Supercharging for 40Kwh :(

[EVNow]

The Leaf, the Mitsubishi i, and probably the Spark EV all offer DC fast charging with smaller packs than the 160-mile Model S. I doubt there is a technical reason that prevents Tesla from offering this.

You mean Spark EV might have the new SAE QC plug ? I guess that is a possibility if GM really wants to push that "standard".

[Norbert]

BTW, my impression is people getting the 300 mile model are saying it is OK for 160 mile model not to have QC. I'm interested in hearing what people who reserved a 40kWh "160 mile" model think about this. I can't beleive they are happy about this turn of events.

I think it is disappointing, although I already had doubts that the smaller packs would be able to support 90 kW, and made some posts here about that. There were also some hints in recent months from Tesla in this direction, but I assume they wanted to make a comprehensive statement and not cause a lot of discussion, back and forth, before they knew what exactly they want to do and offer. There seems to be a still ongoing process as the supercharging option for the 60 kWh pack is still "TBD". For example, perhaps they weren't sure whether to offer it for the 60 kWh pack, until recently. They may have done some extensive testing before making these decisions.

[jimbakker666]

I don't think anybody is saying it's OK. I think that most are saying it was inevetable due to the smallish pack and battery chemistry.

I for one think that this is a mistake. Tesla would sell more cars if they offered the supercharger charging at a lower rate for the base cars.

As a person with a 160 reservation I will confirm that, at least from my perspective. If I can regain my mileage quickly, then I find much more utility in my vehicle. I don't see much point for a family sedan when we can't really go anywhere meaningful. We're literally restricted to a sub-80 mile radius in this vehicle unless we're going somewhere where we can charge overnight.

[richkae]

Now is the time to directly give Tesla your feedback and tell them you *need* fast charging on the Model S variant you would consider buying - and if you would cancel your order if it is not.

If they are considering offering Chademo support, then push them to do so.
If they are not, there still is time for them to do something about it.

[Tommy]

I think we Americans just got a dose of what our European friends have been clamoring the past few years with Tesla over the need for fast charging via 3 phase.

[EVNow]

I think it is disappointing, although I already had doubts that the smaller packs would be able to support 90 kW, and made some posts here about that. There were also some hints in recent months from Tesla in this direction, but I assume they wanted to make a comprehensive statement and not cause a lot of discussion, back and forth, before they knew what exactly they want to do and offer. There seems to be a still ongoing process as the supercharging option for the 60 kWh pack is still "TBD". For example, perhaps they weren't sure whether to offer it for the 60 kWh pack, until recently. They may have done some extensive testing before making these decisions.

It would be useful to get a direct comment from Tesla on the reason why they didn't allow for a lower powered QC for the 160 mile pack. Technically that should be a very simple thing to do, assuming the packs can't even take 2C charging.

I wonder whether Tesla is thinking of SuperCharging only in a very restricted long road tour scenario.

With any EV we are making quite a few compromises. So, people will find novel ways of pushing the EV usage if QC is available. Tesla shouldn't consider just some narrow scenarios.

On the business side, I think lack of QC may make the base version very unattractive and significantly impact S's market, since the next level is a costly $10k upgrade. In the case of Leaf, more than 80% (IIRC) chose to get the trim that allowed them to get QC. Clearly, the lower the range, the more the need for QC.

[AnOutsider]

As a person with a 160 reservation I will confirm that, at least from my perspective. If I can regain my mileage quickly, then I find much more utility in my vehicle. I don't see much point for a family sedan when we can't really go anywhere meaningful. We're literally restricted to a sub-80 mile radius in this vehicle unless we're going somewhere where we can charge overnight.

Again, not to belittle the fact that it's not in the car for whatever reason, but if range really is that important why don't you upgrade the pack size? As it stands, you'd drive 2 hours, then stop and recharge for 1/4 that time (30 mins) to get another hour's worth of driving?

With the 80 mile radius thing, again, buy the car that fits your needs (I think tesla's fact page actually says that outright).

[Norbert]

It would be useful to get a direct comment from Tesla on the reason why they didn't allow for a lower powered QC for the 160 mile pack.

Agreed. I'd guess it is multiple reasons coming together. Perhaps Elon will explain this in an interview, or a blog post on Tesla's website. Also the upcoming Supercharger announcement may clarify the situation. Although that's still a few months down the road.

[fairlycool]

Completely different chemistry. The standard Lithium cobalt laptop cells in the 40kWh Model S are probably the worst in terms of charging/discharging C-rates and cycle life out of the battery types being used in EVs. Tesla just addresses that problem by using lots of them.

Can you explain this a bit more. So the 40Kwh battery pack is different that the Nissan Leaf battery pack. I assume you are meaning to say it is inferior too. Is the 60/85Kwh battery pack significantly different from the 40Kwh battery in terms of chemistry/quality? Are those more comparable to the leaf?

[stopcrazypp]

To make it explicitly clear, there's a good technical reason why Tesla doesn't want to offer supercharging to 40kWh packs at the full 90kW power. But there is no good technical reason for Tesla not to offer it running at half power (45kW).

The critical question right now is if there are any differences in the car itself needed to support supercharging. If there isn't any difference, all it takes for 40kWh cars to use the superchargers is a policy change by Tesla (and maybe some tweaks on the charger side at worse), rather than a costly retrofit on the car.