Cost evolution of MS/X yoke

[K.I.T.T.23]

I was just watching the forum, I think u took it a but too personal man… I am only here for fun, to help others and seeking help. I have no intentions to go through debate on forums, so I will avoid answering many questions that follow a debate fashion. but I will answer one. Yes, I had a 2023 MS with the Yoke, I test drove a few, and I ended up canceling my order and picked up another 2023 Model S with the wheel instead. I spoke with so many Yoke owners, and one of them even he likes his suggested that I just take the wheel…. I am guaranteed 100% to not be dissapointed, but the Yoke can and have the potential to dissapoint me… hence after test driving a few Model S vehicles, I got the wheel. Simple. This yoke vs wheel issue does not really worth all the debate… i don’t think it is worth it to debate that Yoke is for everyone, but 100% the wheel is for everyone no matter what.

Yep, I think you are right. Everyone can drive a wheel, at least those that learn on one. Eventually, as automation starts to take over, I think we will see more alternatives; but our generation will need to die off before any real change can take hold regarding vehicular control methods.

I completely understand your reasoning for going with the wheel, and I think that was the biggest mistake they made with the 2021 refresh: the wheel needed to be an option day one. Not everyone is going to be motivated to try something new... not that they should be either! Some of us like the idea, so we spend enough time to learn and adapt... others don't see the value in it and get frustrated; and rightfully so when there is no other option in the vehicle.

I also agree that there should not be a debate about this... but people get opinionated, and then people (like me) feel compelled to correct... arguments ensue, and my ignore list grows. I should know better, just roll my eyes and move on. I have a sticky note on my monitor now "Pearls before swine" to remind me. Gota stop wasting time on willful ignorance.

 

[K.I.T.T.23]

I want my yoke swapped to the wheel yet i refuse to pay Tesla another $700.

I have no issue with paying a labor fee for the swap but Tesla should provide the wheel for the price of the car. “Travel in luxury” as they note in their store for the wheel retrofit.

why? Honest question, if you have driven on it for a while, I assume you bought before there was a wheel option. After all this time, why do you want to swap now? What is causing you issues?

 

[NeuroRad]

why? Honest question, if you have driven on it for a while, I assume you bought before there was a wheel option. After all this time, why do you want to swap now? What is causing you issues?

Why? That’s been beaten to death at this point. It’s a poorly implemented method for steering the vehicle and interior to a wheel.

I do appreciate some of Tesla’s innovation. For example, the automated gear shifting is pretty fantastic and useful in my opinion. Other things like the yoke are a gimmick.

 

[K.I.T.T.23]

Why? That’s been beaten to death at this point. It’s a poorly implemented method for steering the vehicle and interior to a wheel.

I do appreciate some of Tesla’s innovation. For example, the automated gear shifting is pretty fantastic and useful in my opinion. Other things like the yoke are a gimmick.

Sorry, maybe my question wasn't clear. I am not looking for the general answer... we all know what the internet says.

Many yoke users, like myself, enjoy them. Others users don't like them, typically because of varying reasons, such as living in a city, nervous about making a 3-point turn at high speeds, hand position issues, didn't like the buttons... etc.

So, on a personal level, after trying it, what did you find it to be a problem?

My reason for asking is two-fold. Either A, maybe I can give you a pointer, or B, I'll learn something.

 

[NV Ray]

On the con side of pro/cons, this video by Norway's Bjorn Nyland presents myriad cons. Especially turn signal challenges in roundabouts (rotaries). Wouldn't one have the same issue with the round steering wheel? If so, then it's not the yoke, it's turn signal control placement.

 

[E90alex]

Sorry, maybe my question wasn't clear. I am not looking for the general answer... we all know what the internet says.

Many yoke users, like myself, enjoy them. Others users don't like them, typically because of varying reasons, such as living in a city, nervous about making a 3-point turn at high speeds, hand position issues, didn't like the buttons... etc.

So, on a personal level, after trying it, what did you find it to be a problem?

My reason for asking is two-fold. Either A, maybe I can give you a pointer, or B, I'll learn something.

It doesn’t matter what his reasoning is, not like you will listen anyways. You like it and no one will convince you otherwise. Other people don’t and you won’t convince them otherwise either.

But the masses have spoken and the winner is clear seeing as how Tesla made the wheel standard and is charging extra for the yoke, along with anecdotes from Tesla employees saying ~90% of S/X are ordered with the wheel, a number that will surely increase even more given the significant cost now.

 

[cucubits]

nervous about making a 3-point turn at high speeds

 

[K.I.T.T.23]

It doesn’t matter what his reasoning is, not like you will listen anyways. You like it and no one will convince you otherwise. Other people don’t and you won’t convince them otherwise either.

But the masses have spoken and the winner is clear seeing as how Tesla made the wheel standard and is charging extra for the yoke, along with anecdotes from Tesla employees saying ~90% of S/X are ordered with the wheel, a number that will surely increase even more given the significant cost now.

I love your response "you like it and no one will convince you otherwise". Yep. I do just fine.

Why does someone have to convince me? Why can't I just be curious as to why someone else doesn't like it? I can accept that... can you accept that I like it and it works fine for me? I would assume via your written tone that the answer is no, but I'll leave that one open and not assume you are a close-minded ideologue.

Your statement about ordering is spot on, I am sure those numbers are correct. Given a new option that is radically different than the norm, has negative press and reviews, why would people opt for it? Seems like a horrible idea... kind-a like buying an EV. Go with the tried and true my man... this new stuff is for the birds

 

[K.I.T.T.23]

On the con side of pro/cons, this video by Norway's Bjorn Nyland presents myriad cons. Especially turn signal challenges in roundabouts (rotaries). Wouldn't one have the same issue with the round steering wheel? If so, then it's not the yoke, it's turn signal control placement.

I am all about an objective review... but when it starts out with a statement like "I'll show you how Sh!++y the Yoke wheel is" ... bro... come on. I do appreciate it though!!! I know it is time to stop viewing save me 30 minutes of a bias review.

So, this question about the roundabout. I have heard this before. So I had to look it up to make sure, because I don't use a signal in roundabouts at all... I was taught not to. The law is different in different states though.

Blinker or no blinker? Colorado Court of Appeals rules turn signals are not required

It’s a traffic rule that no one ever seems to agree on, but thanks to a case against Timothy Robert McBride in 2017, the state of Colorado now has clarification

www.montrosepress.com

Yield to the left (to vehicles already inside the roundabout) and once it is clear, drive without signaling into the roundabout and keep moving until reaching the intended exit. Exit without signalling and continue driving.

So notice for all of you out-of-state drivers in Colorado; please do not use a turn signal in a roundabout.

 

[sleepydoc]

Your statement about ordering is spot on, I am sure those numbers are correct. Given a new option that is radically different than the norm, has negative press and reviews, why would people opt for it? Seems like a horrible idea... kind-a like buying an EV. Go with the tried and true my man... this new stuff is for the birds

Except there are several very logical, rational reasons why a yoke would be problematic and there are many reviewers who gave it time and tried to ‘adapt’ and still found it problematic. You seem to be unable to recognize or admit the yoke‘s shortcomings and instead try to dismiss criticisms as people being ‘unable to adapt’ or that they just can’t accept anything new like they’re some sort of luddite.

I think the most accurate statement would be, “The yoke isn’t for everyone but I still like it and can make it work for me in spite of its shortcomings.”

I am all about an objective review... but when it starts out with a statement like "I'll show you how Sh!++y the Yoke wheel is" ... bro... come on. I do appreciate it though!!! I know it is time to stop viewing save me 30 minutes of a bias review.

I haven’t seen all of Tesla Bjørn’s reviews but in general I’ve found him to be pretty fair and balanced. Could it be that his first statement is simply a summary of his experience and that you don’t want to watch a negative review? I’ll add Tesla Bjørn to the list of people with significant Tesla experience who found the yoke lacking despite giving it a fair shot. I’ll also add that all of his criticisms are completely valid.

One of his complaints is the lack of consistency which I tend to agree with. There are areas in which the yoke unnecessarily differs from other interface elements or from other cars. Yes, you can learn and adapt but when you drive more than one car and have to re-adapt each time you switch cars it’s a setup for mistakes. That’s just basic ergonomic engineering.

So, this question about the roundabout. I have heard this before. So I had to look it up to make sure, because I don't use a signal in roundabouts at all... I was taught not to. The law is different in different states though.

Blinker or no blinker? Colorado Court of Appeals rules turn signals are not required

It’s a traffic rule that no one ever seems to agree on, but thanks to a case against Timothy Robert McBride in 2017, the state of Colorado now has clarification

www.montrosepress.com

Yield to the left (to vehicles already inside the roundabout) and once it is clear, drive without signaling into the roundabout and keep moving until reaching the intended exit. Exit without signalling and continue driving.

So notice for all of you out-of-state drivers in Colorado; please do not use a turn signal in a roundabout.

Thanks for the heads up about CO roundabouts- this is something that should be standardized between states, though it’s not a huge issue. One can imagine that it must be a nighttmare for the FSD programmers, too. Personally, my practice is to use the signal where it seems necessary to clarify my intent to other drivers. Entering a roundabout? There’s no need since you only have one choice. When exiting it often times doesn’t matter but sometimes there’s a driver waiting to enter and signaling your exit can help him/her. There are also multilane roundabouts in which it could be helpful. Hopefully I don’t get pulled over by a CO trooper for using my turn signal!

 

[sleepydoc]

I just watched the TopGear review of the Cybertruck. The Cybertruck has apparently added a top bar to the yoke, making it a 'squirkle' (their term, not sure if that's Tesla's term or not.) The TopGear reviewer's take:

“This is called the squirkle. It’s kind of a development of the yoke that they added to the Model S and Model X except it’s sprouted a top bar here which makes it infinitely more usable but still not quite as useful as a normal steering wheel, and to add to the annoyance, there’s now no stalks so you have to push these buttons left and right on the wheel. I have gotten used to it but honestly, I don’t know why they quite literally had to reinvent the wheel”

Yet another actual expert who finds the stalkless yoke a clear downgrade. one good thing - the drive by wire system makes it so you never need to turn the wheel/yoke/squirkel more than 170º so it makes it a bit more usable.

 

[dsm363]

I just watched the TopGear review of the Cybertruck. The Cybertruck has apparently added a top bar to the yoke, making it a 'squirkle' (their term, not sure if that's Tesla's term or not.) The TopGear reviewer's take:

“This is called the squirkle. It’s kind of a development of the yoke that they added to the Model S and Model X except it’s sprouted a top bar here which makes it infinitely more usable but still not quite as useful as a normal steering wheel, and to add to the annoyance, there’s now no stalks so you have to push these buttons left and right on the wheel. I have gotten used to it but honestly, I don’t know why they quite literally had to reinvent the wheel”

Yet another actual expert who finds the stalkless yoke a clear downgrade. one good thing - the drive by wire system makes it so you never need to turn the wheel/yoke/squirkel more than 170º so it makes it a bit more usable.

They really should just offer both versions. Yoke with no stalks since some people seem to love that. And a round steering wheel with a turn signal stalk for I assume the majority of buyers. Charge extra if they need to. I also wish the gear selector under the charger were actual physical buttons. I don't mind pushing the gear buttons there but you have to wake it up first then you can select the gear.

 

[dmurphy]

the drive by wire system makes it so you never need to turn the wheel/yoke/squirkel more than 170º so it makes it a bit more usable.

This. All of this. I’d happily revisit the yoke with this kind of adaptive steering.

But with traditional non-variable steering, no …

 

[K.I.T.T.23]

This. All of this. I’d happily revisit the yoke with this kind of adaptive steering.

But with traditional non-variable steering, no …

the adaptive steering is the way of the future, 100% I can't WAIT for it. spinning a wheel around is... well, so 1900-ish. When the MSP gets "fly by wire" KITT22 is gona update to KITTXX (whatever year it is).

I still stand by there are no issues with the yoke. over 20k miles.. and I have had 0 problems. round-abouts, sharp turns, parking lots, highway... and even the dreaded turn signal buttons... love them now (and I HATE stalks...). At this point I have noticed that in the rare instances that I do drive a wheel (rentals and my wife's car) I hold the wheel very different now, I never use the top of it for example.

To each their own.

 

[dsm363]

I don't think the yoke itslef is a major problem. Has some advantages. Just poorly implemented without steer by wire and the capacitive buttons aren't ideal (for me anyway). I'm l glad we have options now.

 

[hchu0304]

Sorry to sidetrack.

For anyone interested I have a new yoke and airbag for $700 shipped, newest version H serial. Obviously you can probably resale your stock wheel for minimum $400 easily. Which net will cost you $300 or less.