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Yes, I agree. I realized after I posted that I should have said TACC failed. Period. I have never personally had TACC fail. But, yes, after reading some of these posts, I suppose a sensor could have caused the issue.(Cross-post of a reply of mine at teslamotors.com)
As to terminology, here is Tesla's:
Autopilot, which includes:
--Autosteer
--Autopark
----parallel
----perpendicular
----Summon
--Traffic-Aware Cruise Control (TACC)
The hierarchical levels are as indicated in the 7.1 Release Notes.
Good plan. But don't "break" your foot. Just 'brake." :wink:On 3 occasions TACC failed to stop, slow down, or remain stopped. I noticed twice where the car image in front would disappear, reappear, and even shimmy even when at a full stop. When the car in front disappeared, my car would surge and then alert (due to sensors?). Each time, I avoided a collision, thank God.
Recalibration of the camera and sensors supposedly fixed the problem, per Tesla.
I will continue to use TACC (and the rest of the AP features) with caution -- distance set at 1 per 10mph, hands on steering wheel, and foot ready to break if it doesn't slow down or remain stopped properly. Even in this cautious mind frame, I find highway driving far less stressful with AP and I enjoy using it.
This is sage advice. It was definitely a bad idea to set my distance at 2 for highway driving. I was too cavalier, too starstruck and trusting of the technology. It simply never ocurred to me that the car would fail to stop. That was foolish.
Good plan. But don't "break" your foot. Just 'brake." :wink:
And at 1 per 10 mph, does that mean you set it at 7 on the freeway if going 70+? I am curious, because I usually keep it at about 4 to avoid people getting pissed off and passing me thinking I'm not "going fast enough" even though I'm going exactly the same speed as the car in front of me at those points. But that could be a CA thing. They drive super fast here, and I cut my teeth driving on Houston freeways.
Yes! the icon turned red and the car made a horrible sound. I asked the technician at Tesla why the collision avoidance system wouldn't have kicked-in, and he promised to have results within the next 48 hours. I hope I can count on the company to be forthright if they can uncover the problem.
AEB is not designed to avoid collisions, only reduce the impact. OP said it made noise before the crash, so it seems to have worked as designed. AEB works between 5 and 85mph and will only reduce your speed by a maximum of 25mph before it disengages (this is all in the manual) Due to the low amount of damage to the vehicle, it looks like it was quite likely down to 5mph at time of impact. AEB success!
Tesla is a schizophrenic company that pretends to be an automobile company pretending to be a tech company.I may get blasted for this statement but stay with me and absorb what I'm about to say. IMO, Tesla is a technology company who happens to manufacture automobiles. The other traditional auto companies are automobile manufactures first, who happen to incorporate technology into their vehicles.
I think it should be emphasized that this is NOT autopilot! This was TACC which didn't do it's job. Clearly auto-steer was not at fault.
TACC is hardly new technology-- Mercedes has offered something very similar since 2005-- that's over 10 years!
This is sage advice. It was definitely a bad idea to set my distance at 2 for highway driving. I was too cavalier, too starstruck and trusting of the technology. It simply never ocurred to me that the car would fail to stop. That was foolish.
TACC doesn't use car lengths. From the Owner's Manual:First, I don't have AP. I read here a wide variety of opinions on maintaining safe following distances. I'm puzzled as to why Tesla introduced the concept of using car lengths for determining vehicle separation. This can lead to a false sense of security. If 2 car lengths works well at 30mph then why not use it at 40, and so on. For anyone who uses 2 lengths at 60mph, and hasn't yet had a problem, it's comfortable only because that individual hasn't yet experienced a failure.
Safe separation can be had at any speed over a fixed time interval. There is some debate in the driver education community, but 3, preferably 4 seconds of separation are generally accepted numbers. You learn to judge this by waiting until the vehicle in front of you has passed a road sign, a tree, or anything fixed by the side of the road. Then count up to the number 4. At 4, the front of your vehicle should be passing that same marker. A little practice and this becomes a subconscious life long driving habit.
It would probably take more lines of code, but Tesla could probably program the AP to adopt this method of vehicle separation. Imagine if all you had to do was to set it to 4, as in seconds. Dependent on road conditions, this setting would work most anywhere, anytime. This would eliminate the current guesswork concerning vehicle spacing and the associated distraction, while easing driver workload and increasing the margin of safety.
Each setting corresponds to a time-based distance that represents how long it takes for Model S, from its current location, to reach the
location of the rear bumper of the vehicle ahead.
i see your point. I think i was trying to say that i couldn't do anything ONCE i realized the car wouldn't stop. If i had used more caution (and more distance/time), it sounds probable I'd have avoided the accident. Had i had read something like this string (i haven't perused this site since 2013) or had my DS (or anyone else) advised me to be more judicious, perhaps i wouldn't have collided. I'm not trying to abdicate responsibility (and i know i lack some common sense here) but I'm just suggesting that it couldn't hurt for the DSs to advise customers of these potential pitfalls
Warning: Traffic-Aware Cruise Control can not detect all objects and may not brake/decelerate for stationary vehicles,especially in situations when you are driving over 50 mph (80 km/h) and a vehicle you are following moves out of your driving path and a stationary vehicle or object, bicycle, or pedestrian is in front of you instead. Always pay attention to the road ahead and stay prepared to take immediate corrective action. Depending on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to avoid a collision can result in serious injury or death. In addition, Traffic-Aware Cruise Control may react to vehicles or objects that either do not exist or are not in the lane of travel, causing Model S to slowdown unnecessarily or inappropriately.
Warning: Traffic-Aware Cruise Control may be unable to provide adequate speed control because of limited braking capability and hills. It can also misjudge the distance from a vehicle ahead. Driving downhill can increase driving speed,causing Model S to exceed your set speed. Never depend on Traffic-AwareCruise Control to slow down the vehicle enough to prevent a collision. Always keep your eyes on the road when driving and be prepared to take corrective action as needed. Depending on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to slow the vehicle down enough to prevent a collision can result in serious injury or death.
Warning: Forward Collision Warning is designed only to provide visual and audible alerts. It does not attempt to apply the brakes or decelerate Model S. When seeing and/or hearing a warning, it is the driver's responsibility to take corrective action immediately.
View attachment 107910
Yes, the emergency collision warning should have sounded and then kicked in..
I've been expecting these kinds of mishaps with AP. My car isn't AP-capable, but me personally, even if it was, I wouldn't drive with it, definitely not in traffic. I don't believe AP is anywhere near ready for real-world situations, and I have been unhappy with the company pushing this stuff (and Elon's "in 2 years, you can Summon your car in NY while you're in LA") because the chances of failure are very high.
We're going to see more and more mishaps like this, people trusting AP when, in my opinion, they need to be even MORE on guard and skeptical and alert whenever AP's enabled. One simply cannot trust the technology now, maybe not for a long time, if ever. Some things I am glad to be an early adopter of. AP is not one of them.
I also still fully expect state laws to quickly change over the next 12 months as more and more AP mishaps happen, especially when serious AP mishaps happen. I worry what this will do to the stock. I wish Tesla could've stayed focused on battery improvements and execution and scaling S and X, instead of all this AP stuff.
I know I'm not in the majority with these views. Oh well.