Type of battery..

[apatel99]

hi friends! I am new to forums, so please forgive any mishaps i make.
I have been very interested in electric vehicles and might switch over from my gas car, it is getting older and the gas for the amount of miles i take up is getting costly.
I have looked into Tesla’s and i think the model 3 would (potentially) be a great option. I’m having many questions with what type of battery would be ideal though. Just to give context, I make almost, key word: almost daily drives to a nearby city that is 40 miles away. A round trip to that city is 80 miles. If i charge my EV every night, then having even a battery of 200 or 240 miles (200 ideally with the 90% charge limit for daily use??) should be enough, right?
And even with an 80 mile round trip for the day, i would still have about 50% battery left for trips around my house before i charge up for the night. And in the winter, it would still give me comfort room.
Is the long range battery worth my round trip/ climate i live in?
Also, is charging the car every single night a good thing to do?
My dream option was the AWD long range, but the AWD is not a feature i need, as now tires in the winter should be the best option, it is the battery and estimated range that i am questioning on.
One last thing: does AC, Heat, wipes, headlights etc etc drain the estimated range at all while driving and while parked?
I know this was a lot, but i will truly appreciate ANY answers i get on ANY of my questions and concerns!
Thanks!

 

[jjrandorin]

hi friends! I am new to forums, so please forgive any mishaps i make.
I have been very interested in electric vehicles and might switch over from my gas car, it is getting older and the gas for the amount of miles i take up is getting costly.
I have looked into Tesla’s and i think the model 3 would (potentially) be a great option. I’m having many questions with what type of battery would be ideal though. Just to give context, I make almost, key word: almost daily drives to a nearby city that is 40 miles away. A round trip to that city is 80 miles. If i charge my EV every night, then having even a battery of 200 or 240 miles (200 ideally with the 90% charge limit for daily use??) should be enough, right?
And even with an 80 mile round trip for the day, i would still have about 50% battery left for trips around my house before i charge up for the night. And in the winter, it would still give me comfort room.
Is the long range battery worth my round trip/ climate i live in?
Also, is charging the car every single night a good thing to do?
My dream option was the AWD long range, but the AWD is not a feature i need, as now tires in the winter should be the best option, it is the battery and estimated range that i am questioning on.
One last thing: does AC, Heat, wipes, headlights etc etc drain the estimated range at all while driving and while parked?
I know this was a lot, but i will truly appreciate ANY answers i get on ANY of my questions and concerns!
Thanks!

1. 80 Mile round trip will likely use between 80 and 120 miles range depending on how heavy your foot is, and how cold it is when you start (and whether its raining, and how windy it is). You should be fine if your normal commute is 80 miles per day with any model 3 you wish to buy.

2. Whether the long range is "worth it" or not is completely up to you, but given your use case stated, it certainly is not necessary.

3.yes, charging every night is a good thing to do. You will read pages and pages and pages (and pages and pages and page) of advice here on charging, but the most simple thing to do regarding charging is to do what the manufacturer of the car tells you to do, which is to plug the car in daily. There are always discussion on what they mean, or why they say that, but you dont need to worry about any of that. You just need to know that Tesla recommends you plug it in every day, and specifically calls out in the manual that there is no benefit to running the battery down before charging it back up on a regular basis.

4. Yes, AC, heater, headlights, etc all use power and could theoretically effect range. The biggest one would be heating. You also will be very unlikely to get the stated range, just like an ICE car rarely gets its EPA gas mileage. Saying that, for your stated use of 80 miles round trip, with errands around town, you would be fine as long as you put some sort of charging in your garage.

 

[bwilson4web]

I would only add that www.plugshare.com is a pretty good tool for finding chargers. Just filter on the two Tesla chargers and J1772 to see what is available. Then read the check-in reports for reliability and other limitations.

Bob Wilson

 

[ewoodrick]

Sorry, but it sounds as if you have no reasons to delay. Go get a SR+ and be happy.
While it still may be possible that a 120V 15A or 20A connection may be sufficient, the NEMA 14-50 or HPWC will definitely provide enough charging in a few hours.

 

[KenC]

Any of the EVs rated for ~240 miles should suit your needs, Leaf, Bolt, SR+, etc.

 

[srs5694]

I'll basically just agree with what others have posted. To reiterate and elaborate on a few points:

• Aside from a day with significantly more-than-typical driving, an EV with 240 miles of range should be adequate.
• If you do need to drive unusually-long distances in a day, you can use PlugShare to find generic EV charging stations, or the Tesla's built-in navigation to find Superchargers. Road trips are entirely possible in a Model 3, with the caveat that a few areas (like North Dakota) still have very little Supercharger infrastructure.
  
• Winter weather will degrade range, but it's very unlikely to drop to less than half the rated range, and probably not to less than 2/3 or so in Missouri. The big issue here is heating, which is very energy-intensive. Using seat warmers is more energy-efficient, so turning off (or down) the cabin heat and relying on seat warmers can help extend your range a bit in cold weather. By contrast, lights, the audio system, etc., consume negligible amounts of power. Air conditioning in hot weather consumes less power (and range) than heat does in cold weather.
  
• Speed also reduces range. Even if you travel at 80mph, that probably won't make a Model 3 SR+ unsuitable for your commute, but it's something to keep in mind if you're running short of range one day.
• Plugging in to charge every day is advisable, especially if you'll be using 1/3 of the battery's capacity every day.

 

[Doctor X]

One more word on AWD and winter, we have had a Model 3 LR without AWD for over a year now and live in Canada. With a set of four good winter tires, we have had no issues whatsoever driving in the snow. I will reiterate what others have said about range in cold weather though, it will go down by 25-30% because of the use of both the heater and the effect the cold temperature has on the battery. That effect is however totally reversible once the temperature outside goes back up in the spring. Remember that when it is very cold (or very hot) you can pre-heat your car (or pre-cool it) right from the Tesla app your phone and get into a comfortable car in any weather. You will love driving the Model 3 in any weather conditions. Please feel free to send me a PM if you should need more information or a referral code which would give you free supercharging miles of you decide to order one.

 

[srs5694]

Remember that when it is very cold (or very hot) you can pre-heat your car (or pre-cool it) right from the Tesla app your phone and get into a comfortable car in any weather.

One more point on this: If you precondition the cabin temperature when the car is plugged in, it draws power from the EVSE, so your range will not drop. There will be a range drop if you precondition the cabin when the car is unplugged, of course, but that range drop won't be all that bad compared to getting into a cold (or hot) car and then turning on the climate control system; it'll just count as preconditioning vs. part of the energy use when driving, with both being drawn from the battery.

 

[darth_vad3r]

One more point on this: If you precondition the cabin temperature when the car is plugged in, it draws power from the EVSE, so your range will not drop.

Unless you are plugged into 120V and the pre-conditioning uses more power than supplied

This happens for me for the first minute or so of A/C even, never mind heating

 

[apatel99]

1. 80 Mile round trip will likely use between 80 and 120 miles range depending on how heavy your foot is, and how cold it is when you start (and whether its raining, and how windy it is). You should be fine if your normal commute is 80 miles per day with any model 3 you wish to buy.

2. Whether the long range is "worth it" or not is completely up to you, but given your use case stated, it certainly is not necessary.

3.yes, charging every night is a good thing to do. You will read pages and pages and pages (and pages and pages and page) of advice here on charging, but the most simple thing to do regarding charging is to do what the manufacturer of the car tells you to do, which is to plug the car in daily. There are always discussion on what they mean, or why they say that, but you dont need to worry about any of that. You just need to know that Tesla recommends you plug it in every day, and specifically calls out in the manual that there is no benefit to running the battery down before charging it back up on a regular basis.

4. Yes, AC, heater, headlights, etc all use power and could theoretically effect range. The biggest one would be heating. You also will be very unlikely to get the stated range, just like an ICE car rarely gets its EPA gas mileage. Saying that, for your stated use of 80 miles round trip, with errands around town, you would be fine as long as you put some sort of charging in your garage.

Wow! Thank you for taking the time to write such a detailed reply.
I usually drive the speed limit, so as for the speed, it would not make a difference for me. Winter is harsh but I don’t think it will be too brutal on the car. Thank you for reassuring me that in my case, the long range is not necessary. I have been reading and some are saying that the standard range is useless / it drains too much, which started most of my original concerns about EVs and the Model 3 battery specifically.
Plugging it in every night is something I would do if I decide to go with the M3. Does having standard range plus battery affect how it will age in 6-8 years with the battery degrading? Or is it just, how you take care of the battery and car, and how you drive it which shows the true age?
And lastly, that is what i thought about the range being affected by some extra things on such as lights and heat etc. Hopefully in the winter I can (if i get an EV/ M3) i can preheat while charging to help combat the drained range.

 

[apatel99]

Sorry, but it sounds as if you have no reasons to delay. Go get a SR+ and be happy.
While it still may be possible that a 120V 15A or 20A connection may be sufficient, the NEMA 14-50 or HPWC will definitely provide enough charging in a few hours.

Haha! It sounds like the model 3 SR+ is a winner for my choice. I am glad everyone is being positive and super helpful. I don’t mind paying extra for a special outlet connection to help with faster / more efficient charging, my biggest concern is the type of battery. With things like enhanced autopilot, I could add it in later (extra $$$$) but it would be possible. But things like the battery and motor, it is set and cannot be changed. If I get a M3, I want to make sure it is dependable for a long time.

 

[apatel99]

I'll basically just agree with what others have posted. To reiterate and elaborate on a few points:

• Aside from a day with significantly more-than-typical driving, an EV with 240 miles of range should be adequate.
• If you do need to drive unusually-long distances in a day, you can use PlugShare to find generic EV charging stations, or the Tesla's built-in navigation to find Superchargers. Road trips are entirely possible in a Model 3, with the caveat that a few areas (like North Dakota) still have very little Supercharger infrastructure.
  
• Winter weather will degrade range, but it's very unlikely to drop to less than half the rated range, and probably not to less than 2/3 or so in Missouri. The big issue here is heating, which is very energy-intensive. Using seat warmers is more energy-efficient, so turning off (or down) the cabin heat and relying on seat warmers can help extend your range a bit in cold weather. By contrast, lights, the audio system, etc., consume negligible amounts of power. Air conditioning in hot weather consumes less power (and range) than heat does in cold weather.
  
• Speed also reduces range. Even if you travel at 80mph, that probably won't make a Model 3 SR+ unsuitable for your commute, but it's something to keep in mind if you're running short of range one day.
• Plugging in to charge every day is advisable, especially if you'll be using 1/3 of the battery's capacity every day.

to go with your response that 240 range would be adequate for me, if the recommended charging limit is 90% for daily use, would it drop to 200 miles estimated?
as for the nearby charging stations, the city that I visit for the round trip has ONE Tesla supercharger that is pretty empty and close to where I go in the city, so It wouldn’t hurt to stop by when needed for extra mileage or charging. And knowing that there are websites to help with generic EV charging stations is super helpful! Thank you.
I am glad that winter would not drop my range near halfway, because that would be hard. The tip for seat warmers being more energy efficient is great, thank you.

 

[apatel99]

One more word on AWD and winter, we have had a Model 3 LR without AWD for over a year now and live in Canada. With a set of four good winter tires, we have had no issues whatsoever driving in the snow. I will reiterate what others have said about range in cold weather though, it will go down by 25-30% because of the use of both the heater and the effect the cold temperature has on the battery. That effect is however totally reversible once the temperature outside goes back up in the spring. Remember that when it is very cold (or very hot) you can pre-heat your car (or pre-cool it) right from the Tesla app your phone and get into a comfortable car in any weather. You will love driving the Model 3 in any weather conditions. Please feel free to send me a PM if you should need more information or a referral code which would give you free supercharging miles of you decide to order one.

YES! thank you for setting aside my “fear” that AWD is NOT needed for snow/winter and winter tires would be great enough. When I think about how much snow I see in the winter season where I live, it does not sound like enough to pay so much for AWD when I could put extra money into paint, interior, autopilot, etc.
SUPER cool that you can program it right from your phone. It is such a great feature and it draws me sooo much to Tesla and how it is the perfect balance of comfort, luxury, eco friendly, minimalistic and yet futuristic at the same time. I don’t think any other EV catches my eye or meets my “needs” like the M3 does.
I will PM you if I order a M3 someday soon (hopefully end of this year OR early next year hahaha)
Thank you for the reply!

 

[apatel99]

One more point on this: If you precondition the cabin temperature when the car is plugged in, it draws power from the EVSE, so your range will not drop. There will be a range drop if you precondition the cabin when the car is unplugged, of course, but that range drop won't be all that bad compared to getting into a cold (or hot) car and then turning on the climate control system; it'll just count as preconditioning vs. part of the energy use when driving, with both being drawn from the battery.

Makes sense! It would be ideal to pre heat when plugged in and charging to avoid range drop.
Thank you for adding this point and showing different views to when driving / preconditioning and when plugged in/ not plugged in.

 

[Runt8]

If it helps put your mind at ease, I have a similar commute (slightly fewer miles to work and back, but I frequently drive the kids around so ~80 miles a day is pretty usual for me). I have the LR battery but in the almost 1 year I’ve had the car I’ve never had fewer than 150 miles of range, even in the winter in Colorado. I’ve never worried about turning the heat or AC down to conserve power, or had to drive slow in order to get to a charging station.

The ability to charge at home and start every day with a “full tank” is the great equalizer for EVs. The only time you would ever wish you went for the bigger battery is if you went on a road trip. For a daily commuter with a <100 mile commute, that you charge every night, there’s literally no difference between SR and LR.

 

[srs5694]

Plugging it in every night is something I would do if I decide to go with the M3. Does having standard range plus battery affect how it will age in 6-8 years with the battery degrading? Or is it just, how you take care of the battery and car, and how you drive it which shows the true age?

The SR/SR+ has a slightly shorter battery warranty than the LR variants. Specifically, both are warranted for 8 years, but the SR/SR+ has a 100,000-mile limit, whereas the LR has a 120,000-mile limit. I'm speculating, but my guess is that the difference is because driving a constant X miles means using more of the SR/SR+'s battery-pack capacity than of the LR's battery-pack capacity. For instance, driving 120 miles means using 50% of the SR+ capacity, but only 39% of an LR AWD's capacity. Deeper discharges tend to be more damaging to batteries than shallow discharges, so if a person were to regularly drive 120 miles before recharging, that would do a little more damage to an SR/SR+ battery than to an LR battery. I'd like to reiterate, though, that I'm speculating about the reason for the mileage difference in battery warranty terms.

That said, that difference in warranty terms isn't all that huge -- the LR variants provide for 20% more mileage than the SR/SR+ variants. The SR/SR+ warranty terms work out to 12,500 miles per year, whereas the LR warranty works out to 15,000 miles per year. In terms of warranty alone, do you expect to keep the car for 8+ years or over 100,000 miles? If so, then this might be a (small) factor in your decision. Strictly in terms of warranty, it's really the mileage between 100,001 miles and 120,000 miles and under 8 years that's of interest; but if my hypothesis about the reason for the warranty difference is correct, then how much you drive and your charging habits may be relevant to battery degradation generally.

Personally, if I had an SR/SR+, I might be a little more diligent about plugging it in whenever possible, but that would be as much because of range anxiety as about minimizing wear and tear on the battery. There are lots of L2 public charging points that can be used. I use them sometimes on day trips -- if I drive 50 miles to a beach or something, I may plug in so I have less charging to do when I get home. The number of such charge points is only likely to increase in the future, too.

 

[Phlier]

One more word on AWD and winter, we have had a Model 3 LR without AWD for over a year now and live in Canada. With a set of four good winter tires, we have had no issues whatsoever driving in the snow. I will reiterate what others have said about range in cold weather though, it will go down by 25-30% because of the use of both the heater and the effect the cold temperature has on the battery. That effect is however totally reversible once the temperature outside goes back up in the spring. Remember that when it is very cold (or very hot) you can pre-heat your car (or pre-cool it) right from the Tesla app your phone and get into a comfortable car in any weather. You will love driving the Model 3 in any weather conditions. Please feel free to send me a PM if you should need more information or a referral code which would give you free supercharging miles of you decide to order one.

While the information in your post is good, I do have to take exception with one thing... IMO, using this forum to advertise your referral code is in very poor taste.

Every single Tesla owner on this site has a referral code. Imagine if all of us pimped our referral codes in our posts like you do. Place would be a horrid waste land of spam.

IMO, this forum is NOT a place to try to get people to use your referral code.