The Tesla / Mobileye story

[Yoda101]

Correction: Tesla AP2 already drives straight in SOME lanes... unless it's in love with a nearby truck, or gets confused by sun, rain, sleet, snow, or modified and partially erased or non-existent lane lines or lane lines of the wrong color or lane lines on a draw bridge.

See this test by You You Xue in the Model 3 - seems pretty impressive.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=863412837163520

 

[lunitiks]

Awesome chime.

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(etcetera...)

 

[WannabeOwner]

If you manage to ignore Tesla AP warning's you probably are drunk or asleep.

Or medically incapacitated.

I doubt you would stay asleep - I reckon that the alarm noises would wake you before the car decided to come to a stop

Insurance here is reduced just for having AP fitted, of course the driver may not use it much/at all, so insurance company either only read the brochure! or has actuarially done some calcs and thinks that it is safer than humans already.

 

[jimmy_d]

We discussed this in... AP2.0 camera thread I think in the past.
I think the resultant model would be inferior if you do not have all the same source material that produced the first model. And if you do (And it's labeled accordingly) - you do not need the extra step.

All the corner cases that are carefully coded in MobileEye chip would be lost if you did not happen to capture them in your datastream.

Quite true. The students in transfer learning models are inferior in accuracy to the teacher networks. Sometimes they are smaller and more efficient, but they almost always lose accuracy (though sometimes only a little). The merit in the idea is that it's a quick way to solve a problem. It's not necessarily a good way to solve it.

 

[GWord]

See this test by You You Xue in the Model 3 - seems pretty impressive.

I have a headache after watching all the bouncing. I think his Model 3 has square wheels on it.

 

[Electroman]

That doesn't happen with super cruise. Super cruise either works or tells you to take over/flat doesn't work - makes its behavior more predictable and better.

My neighbors Camry does even better than GM's SuperCruise or Tesla's AP. It has never let him down even once and he is very comfortable with it, judging by the fact that his family is not even aware he is using it. Agreed that it doesn't work on freeways, marked lanes, lanes with no markers, twisty roads, straight roads - BUT it is very predictable in its behavior that you can rely on it every time,all the time

 

[Electroman]

This test from Motortrend says Nissan performed better than Model 3, fw version unknown. Nissan use Mobileye, right?
The Automobile 2.0: Chevrolet Bolt EV vs Nissan Leaf vs Tesla Model 3 Long Range - Motor Trend

Taking all these factors into consideration, our finishing order in this first-ever comparison test of affordable long-range electric vehicles: Tesla Model 3 first, then the Chevrolet Bolt and Nissan Leaf. True, this is a $60,500 Model 3—but some say magic is priceless. Hey, Tesla fans, are your hands still up?

 

[daktari]

Fake news or just a deliberately misplaced quote? You don't help your brand by misinforming...

What MotorTrend wrote on Autopilot vs ProPilot was this:

"As for autonomous-driving features, Tesla is not alone in edging EV drivers ever closer to a hands-free world. Longer term, the emergence of autonomous systems in electric cars means the battery will support the heavy power loads of self-driving’s computing and multiple sensors, and the awareness of its driving environment will stretch the batteries’ range and strategize the car’s navigation into the charging infrastructure.

When I originally sampled Nissan’s ProPilot Assist in Japan, I half wondered if it was just the jetlag. This thing seemed better than good. But upon returning to home soil, I felt the same reassurance when I tried the system in Detroit and now again after using it for several days in California’s high desert.

ProPilot Assist is outwardly quite simple—a single video camera, a solitary radar. But for single-lane driving, adaptive cruise control, and lane centering, it’s freakishly adept at centering itself between the lane stripes. It needs only a light hold on the steering rim—its hand detection is impressively sensitive.

How does it compare to the Model 3’s Autopilot?

Autopilot 2 is a suite of sensors (notoriously sans lidar)—configured with software to do (at the moment) about the same job as ProPilot, plus auto lane changing. Except it does it less well. But those pairs of extra video cameras on the Model 3’s flanks—paused, waiting to see the world—will they be the eyes of the first privately owned Level 4 car? That’s the promise.

Present day, Tesla’s autosteering tended to hug the left side of the lane. “ProPilot Assist was more fluid, though it was sometimes confused in the dark with dim lane markings or strong opposing headlights,” Hong noted.

Added Brooks: “The Tesla seemed to enter freeway turns well after a human driver would. At one point, it chose to drive over the Botts’ dots on the left edge of the lane for a good 20 to 30 seconds. ProPilot steered into curves without any lag—just like a driver would.”"
Then some bla bla 3-6 months cover up from Tesla.

 

[bhzmark]

Propilot sounds like AP1: a single camera and radar. Except it can't change lanes, and it can't work when the wipers are on. Or, I should say, it reliably won't work in those cases.

Econo Autonomy: Nissan’s ProPilot Assist Brings Self-Driving Features to the Budget-Conscious

 

[NerdUno]

Sounds like ProPilot doesn't include Tesla's Lane Darts feature. I prefer the Tesla adventure and not knowing what's coming next.

 

[daktari]

Tesla Auto lane change v2 at the moment is mostly a gimmick in my eyes. Slow and to little confident when other cars are around, sometimes unpredictable, poor performing in turns and still need to hold hands on the wheel.

GM solution seem superior, just turn the wheel, supercruise reactivates automatically when over in the other lane.

 

[Saghost]

Tesla Auto lane change v2 at the moment is mostly a gimmick in my eyes. Slow and to little confident when other cars are around, sometimes unpredictable, poor performing in turns and still need to hold hands on the wheel.

GM solution seem superior, just turn the wheel, supercruise reactivates automatically when over in the other lane.

The soft handoff in Supercruise is actually one of things that worries me.

With AP, the car is always very clear about which one of you is steering - driven most likely from experience in Aviation, where confusion on that subject has caused a number of accidents.

Supercruise seems to be trying to make the experience seamless - not necessarily a bad thing, but it might lead to things falling through the gap.

If you yank the wheel once towards a valid lane, and then let go, what happens?

Does it switch to the next lane, center in that lane, and retake control? Does it behave differently if there's another valid lane beyond that one or if you hold on to the wheel instead?

The big lights on the top of the wheel are a nice indicator, but I still worry about folks not realizing when they are in control.

 

[bhzmark]

GM solution seem superior, just turn the wheel, supercruise reactivates automatically when over in the other lane.

The soft handoff in Supercruise is actually one of things that worries me.

With AP, the car is always very clear about which one of you is steering

Right, The Tesla solution is superior, if you don't want to use AP to do the lane change, just turn the wheel, AP deactivates and when you are ready just reactivate when over in the other lane with no confusion about when AP is steering or not.

 

[buttershrimp]

Right, The Tesla solution is superior, if you don't want to use AP to do the lane change, just turn the wheel, AP deactivates and when you are ready just reactivate when over in the other lane with no confusion about when AP is steering or not.

These are the types of conversations I'm looking forward to as more automakers have autonomous platforms that don't totally suck. I don't think supercruise is remarkable until it has a lot of folks driving it and finding its edges in function. But this is the first post that actually makes me want to drive it to compare..... that's a big achievement.

 

[bhzmark]

makes me want to drive it to compare..... that's a big achievement.

Supercruise sounds like AP1 restricted to limited access highways where there are few hard situations to read, and watching your eyes constantly instead of requiring a hand torque on the wheel once in a while, and not doing auto lane change.

Yawn.

 

[buttershrimp]

Supercruise sounds like AP1 restricted to limited access highways where there are few hard situations to read, and watching your eyes constantly instead of requiring a hand torque on the wheel once in a while, and not doing auto lane change.

Yawn.

Thanks for the cold water.... what the hell was I thinking?

 

[daktari]

Right, The Tesla solution is superior, if you don't want to use AP to do the lane change, just turn the wheel, AP deactivates and when you are ready just reactivate when over in the other lane with no confusion about when AP is steering or not.

Except the annoying pling that fades the stereo and then another time the pling and fading the stereo again...
In Europe we practice "rechts fahren" meaning a lot of lane changes, maybe twice a minute.

 

[bhzmark]

Except the annoying pling that fades the stereo and then another time the pling and fading the stereo again...
In Europe we practice "rechts fahren" meaning a lot of lane changes, maybe twice a minute.

Ok. You got me there. The ping is annoying -- and Europeans are much better at staying right except to pass (non-mediterranean Europeans anyway).

 

[WannabeOwner]

this is the first post that actually makes me want to drive it to compare

Would be good if you could get your hands on a test car, with dashcam of course ..., and do some comparison runs on your Buttershrimp test routes

 

[tander]

So this is not exactly hot news... More like funeral memorial words

I never really understood what happened between with Mobileye and Tesla. I mean truthfully: When and why did they actually decide to break up? Who took the initiative? ...

That's a seriously great list. My assumption is that there is a another unannounced point where Musk/Tesla team realized it would be cheaper/easier to control in the long run if they just do it themselves. Otherwise they would always be beholden to Mobileye for a very critical part of the business, which has never really been Tesla's m.o.