Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Let's take a moment to marvel at this:
- Tesla is expanding Fremont's production capacity.
- Building out the Kato Road facility
- Significantly expanding Shanghai
- Building a new facilty in Austin
- Building a new facilty in Berlin

..and

- they are not funding this with a Capital Raise
- they are not funding it with Debt
- they are not drawing down their Cash on the balance sheet.

Tesla is funding all this with cash generated from Operations. Yep, the company that "loses money on every car it sells", generates enough cash each quarter from operations to fund this massive expansion.
Even after funding all these Capital Expenditures, they still have cash left over (Free Cash Flow). In fact, since Q2 2020, they will have generated Free Cash Flow of $4.4B by Q2 2021.

View attachment 682754
I'm impressed with the capital efficiency. Not only are they working on the major projects you described, but also building out service and supercharger networks and have smaller projects on the go that don't get much notice (supercharger factory, other small factories to support their automation teams, whatever is going on with solar roof manufacturing, trial semi line, etc) and all that for $1.5b a quarter.
 
MIC is Made in China. For now these Model Y will be built in Shanghai and shipped to Europe. Presumably supply will shift to Berlin when GF4 is fully permitted and operational.

I did some searching through various European Model Y configurator pages and came up with this summary of prices (before incentives or savings):

CountryModel Y LR Price*Model Y Perf Price*
Belgium
€ 63,980​
€ 70,980​
France
€ 57,990​
€ 66,990​
Germany
€ 57,970​
€ 69,970​
Italy
€ 60,990​
€ 69,970​
Netherlands
€ 65,010​
€ 71,010​
Norway
549,142 kr​
602,142 kr​
Spain
€ 64,980​
€ 70,980​
Switzerland
62,990 CHF​
71,990 CHF​
* Prices before incentives or savings

With such big price differences between EU countries that have comparable VAT tariffs I’m wondering if these are actually the prices AFTER incentives.
 
Buying a Plaid helps the mission:

- buying Tesla's high margin cars accelerate the buildout of factories more than the low margin cars.
- the Plaid can deliver a hardcore smackdown to fossil fuel performance cars.

I think I'm probably the only person on this forum who hates these Plaid launch videos because after each one my lizard brain just wants to buy one more and more and more, like I feel like I'm almost developing a mental illness. I certainly don't need one, I could buy four Model 3s and donate them to my local police department for the price of one Plaid, which would be better for the climate. I feel like a bad person for spending so much on a car, but I can't help it, the heart wants what the heart wants and I could be dead from a brain tumor or cancer in six months, I don't know, nobody knows when their time is up. And it's not like I can't afford it.

I realize a forum of Tesla investors is not the place to seek help, but I have to get this off my chest somewhere.

I do not need a Plaid S but I'm going to buy one anyway even though I feel greedy and selfish about it. And the yoke doesn't help either, I really like the yoke, it's looks futuristic and space-agey.

I tell myself I'm not going to watch anymore Plaid videos, but then they get posted here, and I end up watching them anyway, getting closer and closer to pulling the trigger.

I need a Plaid S support group.
 
With such big price differences between EU countries that have comparable VAT tariffs I’m wondering if these are actually the prices AFTER incentives.
Here in Finland there's a 50k € limit for incentives. And the incentive is only 2000 €.

Screenshot_20210709-121026.png
 
Now that Model Ss are rolling down the line for Q3 revenue and picking up speed—and Xs should be coming shortly—let’s go back to the Q1 call and recall that Elon mentioned that the cost to produce the new Model S is actually less than the old one (same for X?):

Excerpt from Q12021 transcript (Elon speaking):
So probably, like, we're going to aim to produce over 2,000 S/X per week. Perhaps if we get lucky, upwards of 2,400 or 2,500. This again is contingent on global supply chain issues, which is just a lot of factors outside of our control here. But I do think this will get solved.

So it's just a matter of time and then we'll be doing well over 2,000 S/X per week. It's a great car. It actually costs us less to produce, a little bit less to produce, but it is a superior product.
So we now have the expensive model (Plaid) back, X coming too, with potentially higher volumes than ever before and potentially higher margins than before. Price increase seems in line with expectations that they are hitting their goal for number of orders.

Much of the price increase probably goes toward increased cost of raw materials, but I think some is to curtail demand a bit. Does anyone have estimates on gross margin for Plaid and LR S?

I know that for the overall balance sheet S/X revenue is small compared to 3/Y, but the higher gross margin numbers for S/X will probably catch some attention and help quell the “Tesla doesn’t make money” FUD.
 
Confirmation on Twitter that MIC Model Y is available to order in Europe (LR & P only):

I have to think this is nothing but disastrous for VW. For Europeans that are OK with MIC, it’s a direct ID.4 sales competitor, and when the MIC MYs start showing up and people see how good they are, others will be happy to wait for the MIG version. More ID.4 sales lost.
 
I have to think this is nothing but disastrous for VW. For Europeans that are OK with MIC, it’s a direct ID.4 sales competitor, and when the MIC MYs start showing up and people see how good they are, others will be happy to wait for the MIG version. More ID.4 sales lost.
All because the id4 is so bad. I'm also way too lazy to put a period in id4 when no period works just as well. Same for capitalization. :)
 
The Bolt fires seem like only the beginning or tip of the ice berg for LG as this Bolt had the final SW fixes to prevent issues.

These fires are occuring *after* the car is done charging. That means the BMS believes the battery is in a good state and has put it to sleep (in a good way). However, seems that thermal runaway is occurring and the BMS is unaware. This is so bad I can't even begin as the BMS is the ONLY way to monitor battery health.

I really hope these cars are recalled or at least there is some acknowledged way for owners to ensure battery stability.

I hope they are recalled. Don't need any more battery fire issues.
 

I have to be honest, I'm of two sides regarding all the recent price hikes on Tesla's:

1) As an investor I LOVE the price hikes because it's likely increasing margins and bolstering the bottom line!

2) As someone who supports Tesla's mission to accelerate EV adoption I HATE the price hikes because moving Tesla cars further out of reach of the customers is actively working against the mission.

I think I'd prefer it if the prices of Tesla's were trending downward, not upward.
 
I should have been more clear that I was referring to the tremendous population. But it is no slouch in size either:

#CountryTot. Area
(Km²)
Tot. Area
(mi²)
Land Area
(Km²)
Land Area
(mi²)
% of world
landmass
1Russia17,098,2426,601,66516,376,8706,323,14211.0 %
2Canada9,984,6703,855,1019,093,5103,511,0226.1 %
3China9,706,9613,747,8779,388,2113,624,8076.3 %

It is actually a touch larger than the US.

Not dismissing challenges in China at all. But I will stick with my original point; the Teslas on the ground create demand. There were times in the US as well when it seemed like demand was slowing. But the cars already sold were seen and felt and the demand exploded. I am betting this will continue. The product cannot be denied IMO, outside of FUD and outliers.

Edit: I seem to remember that the continental US and Alaska together are slightly bigger and as such the 3rd largest country in the world, but eh, guess things can be measured in different ways.
Yep China is a large country over half is empty, like central NV empty, there are people and villages but no cities or wealth. Then most of the southern inland areas don't have the wealth (one exception), the money is really along coastal cities or in the area between Shanghai and Beijing. This is a 600 mile long corridor of high wealth and population. This makes scaling up in China a very interesting game, everyone is looking for the same sort of store location, etc. At the same time any physical presence is seen by a lot of consumers. In this regard I think you have a great point, if people see and touch a Tesla they may be more inclined to buy one. You could well be right that sales build sales. I'm not a fan of relying on China for sales but if Tesla helps push China to EVs than that in and of itself is great.
 
More cartel news.


And we really think these same forces wouldn’t do everything they could to slow down Giga Berlin? No mercy for German auto. MIC MY full speed ahead.
Yep exactly and frankly all the pro VW comments here are ...well they tick me off. VW and GM have done more to delay the transition to a clean environment than other legacy auto makers. The same families control VW so ownership did not change, most of management did not change. Hope they fail first.

In the USA the recent state case against VW for the emission cheating is very interesting and could saddle VW with billions more in fines, much more than the Federal settlement which I felt was overly friendly to VW.
 
I have to be honest, I'm of two sides regarding all the recent price hikes on Tesla's:

1) As an investor I LOVE the price hikes because it's likely increasing margins and bolstering the bottom line!

2) As someone who supports Tesla's mission to accelerate EV adoption I HATE the price hikes because moving Tesla cars further out of reach of the customers is actively working against the mission.

I think I'd prefer it if the prices of Tesla's were trending downward, not upward.
It is a price hike on a lux car, just demand/supply curve showing that the car was mis priced to begin with when put side by side with the competition. Sure it is a family sedan sized car, really it is a super car for speed freaks. They'll pay. Also a long range car for those able to pay and apparently many are willing to pay for range. I think the interesting thing is that production is limited.
 
I have to be honest, I'm of two sides regarding all the recent price hikes on Tesla's:

1) As an investor I LOVE the price hikes because it's likely increasing margins and bolstering the bottom line!

2) As someone who supports Tesla's mission to accelerate EV adoption I HATE the price hikes because moving Tesla cars further out of reach of the customers is actively working against the mission.

I think I'd prefer it if the prices of Tesla's were trending downward, not upward.

If they do this to handle demand - the price increase doesnt really effect EV adoption, as they still sell all they are able to make.
When production increases further, prices can go down..

What Tesla reallt dont want, is people who order (available models) have to wait 6-10-12 months for their cars.
 
I have to be honest, I'm of two sides regarding all the recent price hikes on Tesla's:

1) As an investor I LOVE the price hikes because it's likely increasing margins and bolstering the bottom line!

2) As someone who supports Tesla's mission to accelerate EV adoption I HATE the price hikes because moving Tesla cars further out of reach of the customers is actively working against the mission.

I think I'd prefer it if the prices of Tesla's were trending downward, not upward.
True, but as long as they’re limited by battery supply and can sell everything they make, the extra cash goes toward the mission.
 
MaxPain is 650 (down slightly from 652.50 yesterday). Total OI (expiring today) is 860K contracts.


Time:
Stock Price
Max Pain
Highest Call
Highest Put
Call OI
Put OI
Total OI
Put/Call
07/08/21 7:00 AM​
$626.75​
$652.50​
$700​
$450​
216,377​
620,660​
837,037​
2.8684​
07/09/21 7:00 AM​
$655.46​
$650.00​
$700​
$450​
230,731​
629,718​
860,449​
2.7292​
 
True, but as long as they’re limited by battery supply and can sell everything they make, the extra cash goes toward the mission.

I know, given the current situation raising prices makes good business sense. It's just I know there are people who want to buy Tesla's who will now hold off because the prices are higher than they were before, and I hope at some point in the future prices come back down again to further increase adoption.