Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[gora321]

Tesla High Mileage Leaderboader‏ @TeslaMiles
I started @TeslaMiles & https://sites.google.com/view/teslamiles 6 months ago...

8:57 PM - 17 Feb 2019
@TeslaMiles

 

[Beltsbear]

Electricity gets cleaner every year. Nat gas was up a lot this year, but so was wind and solar. Wind and solar globally was over 150GW of electfixity. The next three years wind and solar in. The USA will be almost 200GW and the TVA and big coal Indiana are speeding up the closure of coal plants. Coal could hit 20% by the end of trumps 1st term and close to zero by his third or fourth term

15 ships producing as much emission as all the cars in the world? Come on, recognize the fake news. It’s so obvious. If this were true it would cost millions per minute in fuel to keep just one of these ships running. Maybe there is an emission of a special pollutant from dirty crude shipping fuel that matches the emissions of the same pollutant by millions of much cleaner cars. But the notion that this is about CO2 emissions is utter nonsense.

Like many claims on the Internet today this is partially true when you use the right numbers. As we know statistics and numbers can say almost anything depending on how they are presented. Many container ships, though probably not these car transporters, use bunker fuel. It is almost unrefined and has a lot more pollutants then you would find in regular diesel fuel. It is so thick that it has to be heated so that it flows well. The trick is that in some things like sulfur it is off the charts in terms of pollution and therefore that number will seem incredibly high when compared to an automobile with the catalytic converter. When you are comparing CO2 omissions on the other hand container ships transport a ton of material a mile with less fuel than almost any other method. So using statistics and numbers you can say that container ships are one of the cleanest methods of transport as well.

 

[Todd Burch]

-The 2170s may not be a more gravimetrically energy dense cell, but they are the optimal geometry for cooling and for a higher gravimetrically energy dense pack.

-Elon’s comments in the last conference call RE 2170s in the S/X seem to make sense now. The S/X pack won’t include 2170s because Tesla is probably going to make the jump to the technology from Maxwell and leapfrog 2170s altogether. This would support “no plans to put the 2170s in S or X” and “no comment on future products”, when Elon and JB’s reaction seemed to imply they knew something they wanted to share but couldn’t.

Question is: how long until the Maxwell process makes it to market for Tesla?

I’m sure Tesla has already validated Maxwell’s technology, or they wouldn’t have offered to purchase them.

It wouldn’t surprise me if we saw a new cell using Maxwell’s tech by end of year. I imagine Tesla is already deep into endurance testing the cells using the new process.

 

[humbaba]

Oh, I found random minor / obscure groups on Slacker, usually with a handful of songs. But with Spotify I'm finding almost all, even when I go really obscure! I know, I know, not an issue for your average person who listens to Beyonce and so forth, but if you're the sort of person who listens to, say, breathy Faroese electronica or Greenlandic pop or or whatnot.... Slacker is seriously lacking.

Don't get me wrong: I really wish that the US got Spotify. But, at least for US region, there are significant gaps even in Spotify. I just double checked and Spotify has one recent Muslim Gauze album (and, subjective I know, but their earlier stuff is far better). Its also missing the less recent Ahlam. Tsuji Ayano is another example of limited coverage. Spotify only has an artist entry for Yuki Kajiura without any music. And only a "playlist" for Elvis Hitler without any songs ("Green Haze", "Ten Wheels For Jesus", etc.) -- I hadn't realized Elvis Hitler was fringe.

But they do have Jello Biafra (gotta love, "Atomic Power", "Convoy in the Sky", etc.) and good coverage of punk. (When I was in service a friend sent me a mix tape he titled "Punk Rock Salutes the Army" with a drawing of a punk giving the finger and an American flag flying off of it with tracks like "Die For the Government" -- he might have been seeing if he could get me into trouble.)

The majority of my library appears to be in Spotify, but certainly not all of it and not that good of a mix of what I regularly listen to. Anything that has never been mainstream is spotty and foreign is definitely licensing dependent. Hard to get more mainstream than AKB48 and Yuki Kajiura isn't exactly fringe. While Spotify would improve things compared to Slacker it is still no competition for a custom library.

That said, if we got Spotify in the US I'd spring for a premium account (unless it was crippled like it is for Slacker).

Way OT, but I'm always looking for music suggestions. I thought Bjork was about all you guys had to listen to.

Okay, so you were asking Karen, not me, but depending on how your tastes run, you might check out Leaves Eyes and see where that takes you.

 

[mongo]

No, because to produce 1 (mass) unit of beef, you need 10 (mass) units of vegetable food.

(Yes, it gets complicated because the cow can digest plants that humans cannot).

Indeed.
My not-worthy-of-the-forum-point being: not eating cows doesn't eliminate methane production. I had a veggie burger.. was not a pleasant after experience.

 

[lklundin]

Indeed.
My not-worthy-of-the-forum-point being: not eating cows doesn't eliminate methane production. I had a veggie burger.. was not a pleasant after experience.

Right.

The correct way to enjoy vegetables is to eat them as such as opposed to trying to make them into something they are not.

Lightly frying the vegetable in olive oil with some finely chopped garlic is a fine way to bring out the flavour of any vegetable. Depending on size, coarsely chopping and perhaps lightly cooking it in water first can be necessary. Pasta can then be cooked in the vegetable water. Dinner is served...

 

[EVNow]

The correct way to enjoy vegetables is to eat them as such as opposed to trying to make them into something they are not.

Lightly frying the vegetable in olive oil with some finely chopped garlic is a fine way to bring out the flavour of any vegetable. Depending on size, coarsely chopping and perhaps lightly cooking it in water first can be necessary. Pasta can then be cooked in the vegetable water. Dinner is served...

Or make a spicy curry with it - dry or wet. My favorite is to boil and add spices & coconut. Low carb & healthy. There are a hundred traditional Indian recipes that work this way.

I think people try to get the taste they like - without the associated costs. So we have people trying veggie burgers or like me, riced cauliflower. How well it works depends on how committed your are to the diet - because it takes time to change the palate, how widely available it is, how close it is to the original taste etc. A vast majority of people I know have switched from sugary colas to zero calorie colas with substitute sweeteners, for eg. - but not to low carb breads or pizzas.

 

[printf42]

Can’t believe no one’s talking about this yet.

Tesla removed mentioning of SR Model 3 from website and designer.

Any take on what’s happening?

Combined with the news of big batch of rwd VIN registration days ago. I am betting some big news coming.
But I really have no idea what it would be. Even if the are going to release software limited MR as SR, it doesn’t make sense to remove it from website. Maybe this is related to Elon mentioning they “have to make MR available to EU”.

Edit: SR still mentioned in Chinese site, maybe just a delay of updating, or, maybe, just maybe, SR is going to be GF3 exclusive hence Greater China only for a while?

 

[Fact Checking]

The S/X pack won’t include 2170s because Tesla is probably going to make the jump to the technology from Maxwell and leapfrog 2170s altogether.

2170 is simply a cylindrical cell form factor: 21 mm x 70 mm.

Maxwell's technology is a new manufacturing process, which can be used with any form factor.

I'd expect Maxwell's technology to be used with 2170 cells, as there's very little reason for Tesla to introduce yet another cylindrical cell form factor.

 

[EVNow]

The majority of my library appears to be in Spotify, but certainly not all of it and not that good of a mix of what I regularly listen to. Anything that has never been mainstream is spotty and foreign is definitely licensing dependent. Hard to get more mainstream than AKB48 and Yuki Kajiura isn't exactly fringe. While Spotify would improve things compared to Slacker it is still no competition for a custom library.

That said, if we got Spotify in the US I'd spring for a premium account (unless it was crippled like it is for Slacker).

For "foreign/ethnic" music, after trying a few of the US based services - I decided to switch to an Indian streaming service. I didn't know they had become very popular - apparently over 250 million people in India stream music (almost the population of US). So, I'm guessing a Japanese streaming service would cover such artists better. I also get premium Slacker for the car - for kids who want to listen to random songs repeatedly.

 

[EVNow]

Can’t believe no one’s talking about this yet.

Tesla removed mentioning of SR Model 3 from website and designer.

Any take on what’s happening?

Combined with the news of big batch of rwd VIN registration days ago. I am betting some big news coming.
But I really have no idea what it would be. Even if the are going to release software limited MR as SR, it doesn’t make sense to remove it from website. Maybe this is related to Elon mentioning they “have to make MR available to EU”.

They don't want to have on the website something cheaper that is coming later ?

 

[Fact Checking]

Can’t believe no one’s talking about this yet.

Tesla removed mentioning of SR Model 3 from website and designer.

Any take on what’s happening?

Combined with the news of big batch of rwd VIN registration days ago. I am betting some big news coming.
But I really have no idea what it would be. Even if the are going to release software limited MR as SR, it doesn’t make sense to remove it from website. Maybe this is related to Elon mentioning they “have to make MR available to EU”.

Other explanations:

• They had SR "coming in 3-6 months" for the past 6 months, which was pretty stupid.
• That message was creating an unnecessary Osborne Effect against their own current offers: why remind customers who are thinking about ordering LR and MR, that a 20% less expensive configuration would be available "real soon"? It was an anti-selling force.
• Tesla has no obligation to announce their future plans. (And then get flak when they are missing their self-imposed deadlines or are changing their plans.)
• If European orders increase (and there's no tariff war) then meaningful quantities of SR might be delayed further: they should prioritize higher ASP configurations.

So I'm glad it's gone.

 

[30seconds]

Why execution matters more than a big name

Why Are We Still Waiting for Electric Buses?

 

[anthonyj]

Can’t believe no one’s talking about this yet.

Tesla removed mentioning of SR Model 3 from website and designer.

Any take on what’s happening?

Combined with the news of big batch of rwd VIN registration days ago. I am betting some big news coming.
But I really have no idea what it would be. Even if the are going to release software limited MR as SR, it doesn’t make sense to remove it from website. Maybe this is related to Elon mentioning they “have to make MR available to EU”.

Edit: SR still mentioned in Chinese site, maybe just a delay of updating, or, maybe, just maybe, SR is going to be GF3 exclusive hence Greater China only for a while?

35k car probably won’t come out for another year or two. I think we will see gradual price reduction instead

 

[KarenRei]

Way OT, but I'm always looking for music suggestions. I thought Bjork was about all you guys had to listen to.

Hahahahaha lol Iceland is basically an artists' colony in the middle of the North Atlantic; everyone and their cousin is in an amazing band. That said, so as not to create lots of OT spam, I'll put suggestions in fine print, all on the same line:

Agent Fresco (deeply personal danish-icelandic metal+crooning); Asdfhg. (soothing - accidental musician); Ask The Slave (slow); Aragrúi (sexy); Avóka (jazzy / lounge / personal?); Axel Flóvent (light rock); Árstíðir (harmonizing; famous for an impromptu acapella version of an old Icelandic hymn in a Berlin subway station); Ásgeir (harmonizing with a beat; got a lot of views for a cover of Heart-Shaped Box); Bellstop (Icelandic folk/pop band formed in China); Bloodgroup (faroese-icelandic electronica, shared band members with Byrta); Borko (electronic-ish?); Byrta (breathy faroese-icelandic electronica); Boogie Trouble (disco); Ceasetone (rock?); Cell7 (hip-hop); Daði Freyr (nerd pop); Dikta (pop); Dísa (unsure); Emíliana Torrini (pop, one song used in LOTR); Emmsjé Gauti (hip-hop sometimes backed by a metal band); Ensími (rock?); Epic Rain (musical poetry); For A Minor Reflection (instrumental metal); FM Belfast (party); Gabríel (hip-hop); GKR (hip-hop, most famous for a song about breakfast); Grúska Babúska (powerful weirdness); Hatari (S&M, probably going to troll Eurovision for us this year ); Hellvar (metal, with the occasional borrowed riff from Philip Glass); Hexagon Eye (chillout); Hide Your Kids (rock... rarely see these guys anymore); Himbrimi (pop); Hjaltalín (slow, not sure the category); Júníus Meyvant (light rock); John Grant (pop, "honorary Icelander"); Jónas Sigurðsson (sometimes-political rock); Kaleo (light rock/blues); Kimono (metal); Kira Kira (bizarre); Kiriyama Family (dress like it's still the 1990s, play like it's still the 1980s); Kontinuum (metal); Lay Low (singer/songwriter, sometimes from old Icelandic poetry); Low Roar (often personal); Mammút (just a total powerhouse); Maus (rock); Mælginn (hip-hop); Mono Town (rock/pop/etc); Moses Hightower (funk); Mr. Silla (not sure...); Mugison (blues metal, blues); Múm (like a less famous version of Sigur Rós); Nóra (rock++), Of Monsters and Men (come on, you know these guys!); Oyama (shoegaze); Pascal Pinon (acoustic duet); Páll Óskar (faaaaabulous); Pétur Ben (rock); Prins Póló (not sure); Retro Stefson (Europop, plus ice cream); Samaris (breathy electronica, often with woodwinds); Sin Fang (um.. pop I guess?); Skálmöld (viking folk metal); Skytturnar (hip-hop); Sigur Rós (the name in Post-Rock and the background to like every other nature documentary); Sometime (acid electronica); Soffía Björg (almost a bit Janis Joplin at times), Sóley (cloud cuckoo lander pianist); Sólstafir (trance metal); Sudden Weather Change (rock - offkey vocals but nice riffs); Svavar Knútur (troubador + standup comedy); Sykur (party); Tilbury (pop); Úlfur Úlfur (hip-hop, sometimes backed by a metal band); Útidúr (varied international influences); Valdimar (trumpet-playing lumberjack rock); VAR (a spot-on mix of Sigur Rós and For A Minor Reflection), Vök (breathy, relaxing, some sax)

I could have gone on and on and on WAY beyond that, this is a seriously trimmed down version. And yes, I actually took the time to pick representative samples of each for you

 

[Drumheller]

Karen, remember a few weeks ago when you complained about all of the S/X 2170 cell discussion posts in this thread? That discussion was more relevant than your spotify discussion

 

[Cobbler]

On a serious note: what's everyone's take on the SP this week?
Will we stay above $300?

 

[Todd Burch]

2170 is simply a cylindrical cell form factor: 21 mm x 70 mm.

Maxwell's technology is a new manufacturing process, which can be used with any form factor.

I'd expect Maxwell's technology to be used with 2170 cells, as there's very little reason for Tesla to introduce yet another cylindrical cell form factor.

Yes, when I say 2170 I was referring to the existing 2170s with Panasonic’s processes in use.

Agree they will stick with 2170 form factor—they’ve already optimized that.

 

[KarenRei]

Karen, remember a few weeks ago when you complained about all of the S/X 2170 cell discussion posts in this thread? That discussion was more relevant than your spotify discussion

Really? Tesla unveiling a new, better means for playing music in EU owners' cars is irrelevant? Okay...

And you're describing a totally different situation - the S/X 2170 discussion had been popping up endlessly, over and over, for years, and completely dominating this thread every time it happened, with everyone just repeating the same arguments over and over. It'd die back once Tesla reiterated that they have no plans to switch over, only to resurface like a zombie in advance of the next quarterly report. Yes, that's worth complaining about. There hasn't been a single complaint so far (that I noticed, at least) about discussing the fact that Tesla is introducing Spotify for Europe. But I'll count your post as a first. :Þ

 

[KarenRei]

On a serious note: what's everyone's take on the SP this week?
Will we stay above $300?

Not so sure. Hence the bear suit.