Snow, Ice, and regenerative braking

[E Thompson]

Yesterday (Nov 26th,2023) was the first time that I was out driving with the temperature dropping and rain/sleet/snow falling. I was on an interstate, in Omaha, and when passing under an overpass I would have to take my foot off the accelerator because traffic was slowing down, and each time I did the car would lose traction for second or two and I would feel the car start to swerve just a little. I think it was the fact that my battery was near 50% so regen was probably fully enabled that caused the regen braking to be so dramatic.

This problem was not limited to me, or just electric cars. As I drove I saw a number of cars/trucks that had hit the concrete divider wall between the different lanes of travel because they had lost control. I few I saw as it was happening. I noticed that underpasses were where the really 'slick' spots were, as letting off the accelerator on the open road didn't make my Model Y swerve, even slightly. But letting off the accelerator while under an overpass caused a noticeable momentary steering loss.

I know at one time you could set the amount of regen braking but I think originally my cars software had removed that option. Is that option still there or been added back, and would it help prevent the tires from skidding when you took your foot off the gas? As I said, letting my foot off the gas when I wasn't under an overpass didn't cause the loss of traction.

 

[Kupe]

It's a good reminder that you bring up this topic. I'm not surprised at this. Regenerative breaking can be fairly aggressive in the Model Y so in a snow/ice scenario, it will behave much like standard breaking in an ICE vehicle. Seems better to slowly let up on the accelerator rather than just remove one's foot all at once - kind of like you might lightly test your brakes in a "regular" car.

 

[fholbert]

It's a good reminder that you bring up this topic. I'm not surprised at this. Regenerative breaking can be fairly aggressive in the Model Y so in a snow/ice scenario, it will behave much like standard breaking in an ICE vehicle. Seems better to slowly let up on the accelerator rather than just remove one's foot all at once - kind of like you might lightly test your brakes in a "regular" car.

Yep, I know someone why totaled a MY last winter.

He was driving in heavy rain and the car started to hydroplane. Our whole life we were taught to take our foot off the accelerator and don’t brake. And that’s what he did.

Regen kicked in, the rear passed the front and he backed into the K-Rail.

 

[Thp3]

I have found that in winter, my car drives better in the “Chill” driving mode. At one time Tesla recommended it for driving in winter condition's. I get snow covered roads here and it is much easier to control the car in Chill mode.

Thanks for the reminder, I’ll select the option today for the season.

 

[boredwitless]

Yesterday (Nov 26th,2023) was the first time that I was out driving with the temperature dropping and rain/sleet/snow falling. I was on an interstate, in Omaha, and when passing under an overpass I would have to take my foot off the accelerator because traffic was slowing down, and each time I did the car would lose traction for second or two and I would feel the car start to swerve just a little. I think it was the fact that my battery was near 50% so regen was probably fully enabled that caused the regen braking to be so dramatic.

This problem was not limited to me, or just electric cars. As I drove I saw a number of cars/trucks that had hit the concrete divider wall between the different lanes of travel because they had lost control. I few I saw as it was happening. I noticed that underpasses were where the really 'slick' spots were, as letting off the accelerator on the open road didn't make my Model Y swerve, even slightly. But letting off the accelerator while under an overpass caused a noticeable momentary steering loss.

I know at one time you could set the amount of regen braking but I think originally my cars software had removed that option. Is that option still there or been added back, and would it help prevent the tires from skidding when you took your foot off the gas? As I said, letting my foot off the gas when I wasn't under an overpass didn't cause the loss of traction.

This topic has been discussed a number of times before. However, it does not hurt to revisit it!

First, the good news! While your Tesla swerved a bit under regen braking, it looks like the traction control system kicked in and did its thing correctly: your Tesla recovered and did not crash, unlike a number of cars and trucks that you saw.

Second, as you suspect, with recent software you can no longer manually set the level of regen. The exception to this is if you have the S3XY buttons, which allow you to control regen. (For some people this alone makes it worth getting them.)

Third, when it is cold and your Tesla detects sliding, it automatically puts you into a "snow mode" for some (5?) minutes. If you have a LR or P, amongst other things, this changes the car to running a 50-50 distribution front-rear for both power and regen. This mode helps stabilize the car. Standard range rear wheel drive only Teslas also have a snow mode, which I think may include reducing the aggressiveness of regen.

Fourth, annoyingly, you cannot actively select the "snow mode" (not even with S3XY buttons). The closest you can get is putting the car into "off road mode", which similarly activates a 50-50 split on power and regen. Note that you can only activate this mode while stationary. Some people have found that activating this gives improved behavior when driving on snow, but you must be aware that the car will drift more easily in curves.

Last, in my opinion, there is quite some difference between snow and ice/heavily compacted ice-like snow. I have found my Tesla great on the former. On the latter, I experienced similar swerving behavior. While the car quickly recovered, it was unnerving...

 

[Tectonic]

Second, as you suspect, with recent software you can no longer manually set the level of regen. The exception to this is if you have the S3XY buttons, which allow you to control regen. (For some people this alone makes it worth getting them.)

Wait, is this still true? There were reports several months ago that Tesla was bringing back this option? (Tesla brings back regenerative braking options on its electric cars)

We have a 2019 M3 RWD and the option for "low" regenerative breaking was never removed. Driving on ice, it's essential - in fact, I wish regen could be turned off completely for extreme situations! Considering a new MY, and really hoping that we can control the regen...

 

[jcanoe]

In my area there are signs posted stating "Bridges, ramps and over/under passes freeze first." Cold air under and around these structures will quickly cause any surface water to freeze. The highway department tries to treat these trouble areas first with saline solution, road salt and sand. Winter tires or better all-season tires can help you to maintain control of your vehicle. If you must drive then reduce your speed. Stay off icy roads until they have been treated.

Selecting Chill Mode when driving on wet or snow covered roads helps to reduce loss of traction when accelerating but does not improve braking. Apply the accelerator pedal and brake pedal lightly, don't lift your foot abruptly from the accelerator pedal.

 

[kpanda17]

Interesting I’m always in chill mode due to speed pin limited in both of my Ts
Pined due to 20 year olds in the house
I like the limit on myself as well

But when I want a treat I pin off the limit and hit it
Fun plus track mode
Like our parents hiding the liquor when we were young

 

[boredwitless]

Wait, is this still true? There were reports several months ago that Tesla was bringing back this option? (Tesla brings back regenerative braking options on its electric cars)

Thanks for the link. I have checked in the settings, and I certainly cannot control regen in my MYLR. This is on the latest software 2023.44.1
I am on a European spec Tesla, so it's not impossible that the situation is different in the USA. For instance, over here we are not offered a blended braking option that I believe exists in the USA.

 

[Thp3]

My MYLR has low and standard Regen options. 2023.27.7 Firmware USA version.

in winter, I go to low regen and chill mode. Then the car does no slide or fishtail on slippery roads or when slow down.

It is just a personal preference.

 

[David99]

Third, when it is cold and your Tesla detects sliding, it automatically puts you into a "snow mode" for some (5?) minutes. If you have a LR or P, amongst other things, this changes the car to running a 50-50 distribution front-rear for both power and regen. This mode helps stabilize the car. Standard range rear wheel drive only Teslas also have a snow mode, which I think may include reducing the aggressiveness of regen.

Monitoring the power distribution using ScanMyTesla, I noticed the car will switch to a fixed 50/50 front/back motor ratio as soon as the ambient temperature drops below 0 Celsius (freezing point). It stays 50/50 in all situations, speeds and pedal positions. This was with my old Model S dual motor. I assume it is the same with all dual motor cars, though.

I honestly wish there was a zero regen option. In theory we all know to feather the brake or accelerator. In reality, when the car start loosing traction, we all automatically lift off the accelerator completely. It's a panic reaction. Regen kicks in and makes things worse. With my old RWD Model S that caused me to slide almost sideways on an icy freeway. The best way to gain traction back when you slide is to have zero torque on all wheels. Hence I wish there was a zero regen option. I have not driven my new Y on icy roads, so maybe the car reacts much better now when it detects loss of traction.

 

[ciagw]

Monitoring the power distribution using ScanMyTesla, I noticed the car will switch to a fixed 50/50 front/back motor ratio as soon as the ambient temperature drops below 0 Celsius (freezing point). It stays 50/50 in all situations, speeds and pedal positions. This was with my old Model S dual motor. I assume it is the same with all dual motor cars, though.

I honestly wish there was a zero regen option. In theory we all know to feather the brake or accelerator. In reality, when the car start loosing traction, we all automatically lift off the accelerator completely. It's a panic reaction. Regen kicks in and makes things worse. With my old RWD Model S that caused me to slide almost sideways on an icy freeway. The best way to gain traction back when you slide is to have zero torque on all wheels. Hence I wish there was a zero regen option. I have not driven my new Y on icy roads, so maybe the car reacts much better now when it detects loss of traction.

'23 MY LR in BC Canada. Just did a 1,000 km road trip over the mountains in ice, snow, freezing rain loaed up with our family and a ton of ski gear. On Michelin X Ice Snow tires (19"). My MY does *not* have option to change regen settings. I can see how for someone just jumping into the Tesla from an ICE car and heading out in the snow, and suddenly pulling off the accelerator when they hit a slippery patch it would be unnerving as heck. Heading down a steep grade in the mountains with hard packed snow and lots of wind, I certainly felt the backend twitch a bit a few times at around 45 mph when I pulled off the accelerator hard enough down this steep grade, though as soon as I pushed it back in a bit more toward neutral it went back to full control. Never felt like a full loss of control but certainly would be unnerving if you have some from your average front end heavy ICE SUV.

Have owned many different types of vehicles and driven them in snow including Jeep Gladiator, Ram 1500, BMW 330xi, VW Atlas, Benz gl350, Toyota Yaris etc. To me in snow the Model Y feels very similar to how my manual bmw 330xi felt if I would downshift in snow... just a hint of a twitch from the rear (or all four wheels if engine braking aggresively enough) -- though much, much heavier and you certainly do feel the extra weight of the tesla (and the weight distribution difference too - try slamming on the brakes in the snow in an MR2 for example and watch your rear overtake the front).

As long as one understands how regen braking and one pedal driving works in a heavy EV with the weight in the middle, and with proper winter tires and some experience driving different vehicles, I think the MY dual motor is perfectly safe and VERY competent in snow, but I definitely agree if someone were to just jump in and drive in tough snow conditions without being thoughtful about how regen will affect traction, and they suddenly let go of the accelerator it could lead to at least temporary loss of control. That said, probably no different from slamming on the brakes in an ICE car in a similar situation.

I will plan on getting ScanMyTesla and try to report back on whether the power distribution shifts to 50/50 in my MY.

 

[yobigd20]

Ok so I've been around. 208k miles in MS. Sold it a while ago and this is my first winter in a Model Y. How do I disable regen braking? It is FAR too aggressive and in the last 10 miles (northeast snow storm right now) the regen braking has caused the vehicle to hydroplane at least 8 or 9 times. This is going to cause a major accident eventually. The Model S had the ability to set it to 'low'. Where is this setting in the Model Y? I can't find it in the dashboard menus anywhere. Btw I have Michelin X-Ice snow tires on. These are cream of the crop for this weather and yet the regen braking is so hard it still causes the car to immediately hydroplane as soon as you let off the accelerator pedal.

Also the stock wiper blades suck more than anything I've ever seen on any car before. Any recommendations for aftermarket?

 

[E90alex]

Use chill mode and control your foot better.

 

[zoomer0056]

I don't think regen can be disabled. I just read this on NotATeslaApp.

Why Tesla Is Updating Stopping Modes for Model 3 and Y to Feature Hold Mode Exclusively

Tesla revises Model 3/Y, dropping Creep/Roll for Hold Mode in US, enhancing efficiency & driving experience. No OTA change for existing models

www.notateslaapp.com

 

[Utumno]

Ok so I've been around. 208k miles in MS. Sold it a while ago and this is my first winter in a Model Y. How do I disable regen braking? It is FAR too aggressive and in the last 10 miles (northeast snow storm right now) the regen braking has caused the vehicle to hydroplane at least 8 or 9 times. This is going to cause a major accident eventually. The Model S had the ability to set it to 'low'. Where is this setting in the Model Y? I can't find it in the dashboard menus anywhere. Btw I have Michelin X-Ice snow tires on. These are cream of the crop for this weather and yet the regen braking is so hard it still causes the car to immediately hydroplane as soon as you let off the accelerator pedal.

RTFM?

Model Y Owner's Manual | Tesla

Understand your vehicle's braking system and stopping features.

www.tesla.com

In snowy or icy conditions, Model Ymay experience loss of traction during regenerative braking, particularly when in the Standard setting and/or not using winter tires. Tesla recommends using the Low setting in snowy or icy conditions to help maintain vehicle stability.

Further…

You can use the touchscreen to change the level of regenerative braking:

1. Touch Controls > Pedals & Steering > Regenerative Braking.
2. Choose from two levels:
   • Low: Limits regenerative braking. When you release the accelerator, Model Y takes longer to slow down and coasts farther than if set to "Standard".
   • Standard: Provides the maximum amount of regenerative braking. When you release the accelerator, Model Yslows down, reducing the need to use the brakes.

Not hugely tricky?

 

[E90alex]

RTFM?

Model Y Owner's Manual | Tesla

Understand your vehicle's braking system and stopping features.

www.tesla.com

Further…

Not hugely tricky?

Low regen mode is not available in cars made after about 2021

 

[yobigd20]

Use chill mode and control your foot better.

This is a dumb response. We're talking about safety here. Clearly Tesla has the ability to make the car safer , so why wouldnt they? Its a lawsuit waiting to happen.

 

[yobigd20]

RTFM?

Model Y Owner's Manual | Tesla

Understand your vehicle's braking system and stopping features.

www.tesla.com

Further…

Not hugely tricky?

Clearly this forum is just as toxic as to when i left it years ago with dumbass responses like this.

 

[zoomer0056]

Clearly this forum is just as toxic as to when i left it years ago with dumbass responses like this.

This is the section in the manual.