Rivian Deliveries Pushed to 2022

Rivian has started notifying customers that they will need to wait a bit longer to receive their vehicles.

Rivian has sent notifications that lay out delivery windows for the “Launch Edition” that range from March to September. It’s reasonable to assume that the company’s less-pricey “Adventure” and “Explore” packages will also be pushed to the second half of 2022.

While Rivian has started production of its all-electric R1T pickup, few have been delivered. The R1S SUV was expected to go into production next month, but it is not clear if that will be the case.

Rivian currently operates a single factory in Normal, Illinois and is reportedly looking for a second factory location. 

Early reviews of the R1T pickup have been strong. And investors have been supportive, as the company’s recent IPO gave it a market capitalization of $100 billion.

 

[strider]

Wonder if you could elaborate on what Tesla has become and why not consider the R1T for a truck.

The lack of quality control, lack of customer service, crappification of the products to decrease costs (forcing everyone to vegan leather that is not as strong as real leather, removing radar, removing rain sensor, removing physical switchgear and stalks, I could go on and on and on). I have told this story before but I had a very minor deer strike in my MS. The car was driveable. It only needed a hood, bumper, and left front fender. The repair took 5 MONTHS. At one point the hood sat in Dallas for 3 weeks waiting for a shipping label to be printed.

Now let me be clear that the individual Tesla employees I interact with are fantastic. They are doing amazing work with nothing. Elon has the mentality of a 10-year-old boy. If it's not cool, he doesn't invest in it. Back end parts inventory systems are not cool and so are not funded. Hence my hood sitting for 3 weeks trying to get a shipping label generated.

I used to read similar stories on here and I wouldn't believe them. But it will happen to all of us. It's just a matter of time.

But at the end of the day, Tesla's order books are full and so they don't have to change. As competitors come (and they are) they will have to shape up or they will go bankrupt/be acquired.

As for the Rivian, my wife and I both think the nose/grill is just hideous. I also believe that I need a full sized truck.

Uh yea, so you get them on the phone and they walk you through the repair. Bring tools.

You do know that it was many years before Tesla had services centers outside the Bay Area and LA right? For those customers they had mobile techs that would fly or drive to the car and work on it. It worked for Tesla and will work for Rivian, Lucid, etc. Yes, it's expensive, but it's the only way to do it until you have critical mass in a certain area to support a fixed service center.

 

[Merrill]

The lack of quality control, lack of customer service, crappification of the products to decrease costs (forcing everyone to vegan leather that is not as strong as real leather, removing radar, removing rain sensor, removing physical switchgear and stalks, I could go on and on and on). I have told this story before but I had a very minor deer strike in my MS. The car was driveable. It only needed a hood, bumper, and left front fender. The repair took 5 MONTHS. At one point the hood sat in Dallas for 3 weeks waiting for a shipping label to be printed.

Now let me be clear that the individual Tesla employees I interact with are fantastic. They are doing amazing work with nothing. Elon has the mentality of a 10-year-old boy. If it's not cool, he doesn't invest in it. Back end parts inventory systems are not cool and so are not funded. Hence my hood sitting for 3 weeks trying to get a shipping label generated.

I used to read similar stories on here and I wouldn't believe them. But it will happen to all of us. It's just a matter of time.

But at the end of the day, Tesla's order books are full and so they don't have to change. As competitors come (and they are) they will have to shape up or they will go bankrupt/be acquired.

As for the Rivian, my wife and I both think the nose/grill is just hideous. I also believe that I need a full sized truck.

You do know that it was many years before Tesla had services centers outside the Bay Area and LA right? For those customers they had mobile techs that would fly or drive to the car and work on it. It worked for Tesla and will work for Rivian, Lucid, etc. Yes, it's expensive, but it's the only way to do it until you have critical mass in a certain area to support a fixed service center.

Thanks for your reply, sorry to hear of your problems I guess I’m lucky I have a 2013 S and a 2016 X and have had great service both at the service center and at home. Also had some body work done with no issues. The Rivian looks very nice in person, but understand if you need a full size truck.

 

[_Redshift_]

Thanks for your reply, sorry to hear of your problems I guess I’m lucky I have a 2013 S and a 2016 X and have had great service both at the service center and at home. Also had some body work done with no issues. The Rivian looks very nice in person, but understand if you need a full size truck.

The lack of quality control, lack of customer service, crappification of the products to decrease costs (forcing everyone to vegan leather that is not as strong as real leather, removing radar, removing rain sensor, removing physical switchgear and stalks, I could go on and on and on). I have told this story before but I had a very minor deer strike in my MS. The car was driveable. It only needed a hood, bumper, and left front fender. The repair took 5 MONTHS. At one point the hood sat in Dallas for 3 weeks waiting for a shipping label to be printed.

Now let me be clear that the individual Tesla employees I interact with are fantastic. They are doing amazing work with nothing. Elon has the mentality of a 10-year-old boy. If it's not cool, he doesn't invest in it. Back end parts inventory systems are not cool and so are not funded. Hence my hood sitting for 3 weeks trying to get a shipping label generated.

I used to read similar stories on here and I wouldn't believe them. But it will happen to all of us. It's just a matter of time.

But at the end of the day, Tesla's order books are full and so they don't have to change. As competitors come (and they are) they will have to shape up or they will go bankrupt/be acquired.

As for the Rivian, my wife and I both think the nose/grill is just hideous. I also believe that I need a full sized truck.

You do know that it was many years before Tesla had services centers outside the Bay Area and LA right? For those customers they had mobile techs that would fly or drive to the car and work on it. It worked for Tesla and will work for Rivian, Lucid, etc. Yes, it's expensive, but it's the only way to do it until you have critical mass in a certain area to support a fixed service center.

This is exactly what has alienated me from Tesla of today. Tesla owner, stock holder, and a big fan of Tesla until six months back.

Elon was the dynamo that brought Tesla to where it is today. Unfortunately, that dynamo is what will cause weaknesses and cracks in the company, regarding its product content. I believe there aren’t many who will question Elon’s decisions nor challenge them. You end up with mistakes that open yourself up to competition.

 

[OxBrew]

This is exactly what has alienated me from Tesla of today. Tesla owner, stock holder, and a big fan of Tesla until six months back.

Elon was the dynamo that brought Tesla to where it is today. Unfortunately, that dynamo is what will cause weaknesses and cracks in the company, regarding its product content. I believe there aren’t many who will question Elon’s decisions nor challenge them. You end up with mistakes that open yourself up to competition.

For the last 10 years someone has always been saying something about how this or that will open Tesla up to competitors.

One, that's always been a goal of Elon's, and 2, competition is good. Shakes out the loose clutter.

3, so far, not really happening, at least in battery tech. I just got back from reading some papers on supposedly competitive thermal management strategies. One just a couple years old was touting the cooling system that's failing in the Mach-E presently.

The problem is, people in management have no idea how anything works, and take crap like that at face value. For all his flaws, Elon at least understands enough about hardware to get the right people doing the right things with it.

I don't see another CTO or CEO type anywhere that really has his ability to suss out the right path. In the mean time, they'd do better to just copy Tesla straight up.

I dug into how Rivian is cooling their batteries, and I'm not holding my breath. I thought they were doing it right, but now I'm not so sure. I hope they're doing something magic that I can't see from the overall battery architecture.

 

[_Redshift_]

For the last 10 years someone has always been saying something about how this or that will open Tesla up to competitors.

One, that's always been a goal of Elon's, and 2, competition is good. Shakes out the loose clutter.

3, so far, not really happening, at least in battery tech. I just got back from reading some papers on supposedly competitive thermal management strategies. One just a couple years old was touting the cooling system that's failing in the Mach-E presently.

The problem is, people in management have no idea how anything works, and take crap like that at face value. For all his flaws, Elon at least understands enough about hardware to get the right people doing the right things with it.

I don't see another CTO or CEO type anywhere that really has his ability to suss out the right path. In the mean time, they'd do better to just copy Tesla straight up.

I dug into how Rivian is cooling their batteries, and I'm not holding my breath. I thought they were doing it right, but now I'm not so sure. I hope they're doing something magic that I can't see from the overall battery architecture.

You don’t aim to create weaknesses in your products so someone else can exploit them, only to claim ‘competition is good anyway’.

That’s just nonsense. Also, Elon is very competitive, but he has his head in many different places right now to address the weaknesses in his current products.

”So far not really happening” is the clarion call of the complacent. Seeds of a company’s failure are sown when they are doing well. That’s a famous saying you should look up sometime.

These are things Tesla doesn’t, and for the most part, has never done well:

Interior quality
NVH control
Exterior quality
Service (this one though was excellent till 2017)
Ride and handling compromise (last good one was the coil over spring suspension Model S, a very rare bird indeed)
Ergonomics of the UI (better on the S, terrible on the 3)


These are things Tesla has always done well:

Superchargers (work reliably, widespread, and very user friendly)
Battery and power train (less than 4% degradation on my 2013 S60, though I’ve had 2 DUs replaced because of mechanical issues with the bearings)
Beautiful design (like both the S and the 3, mostly)
Straight line performance

None of the strengths are insurmountable for others. The weaknesses have already been addressed by some of the up and coming EVs.

 

[OxBrew]

You don’t aim to create weaknesses in your products so someone else can exploit them, only to claim ‘competition is good anyway’.

That’s just nonsense. Also, Elon is very competitive, but he has his head in many different places right now to address the weaknesses in his current products.

”So far not really happening” is the clarion call of the complacent. Seeds of a company’s failure are sown when they are doing well. That’s a famous saying you should look up sometime.

These are things Tesla doesn’t, and for the most part, has never done well:

Interior quality
NVH control
Exterior quality
Service (this one though was excellent till 2017)
Ride and handling compromise (last good one was the coil over spring suspension Model S, a very rare bird indeed)
Ergonomics of the UI (better on the S, terrible on the 3)


These are things Tesla has always done well:

Superchargers (work reliably, widespread, and very user friendly)
Battery and power train (less than 4% degradation on my 2013 S60, though I’ve had 2 DUs replaced because of mechanical issues with the bearings)
Beautiful design (like both the S and the 3, mostly)
Straight line performance

None of the strengths are insurmountable for others. The weaknesses have already been addressed by some of the up and coming EVs.

I agree completely. But the 2 things that are table stakes, that no one else has really proved at all yet, are batteries and charging networks.

So sure, they are open to being disrupted by high quality interior, exterior, service (not really, ICE service in universally horrid, but sure), and all the rest. But if the batteries all have to be recalled and the charging network is a catastrophe, have fun with that nice interior.

And honestly? Coming from Subaru, I don't think the build quality of our Y is that bad. I actually can't really fault anything. Handles snow better than any Outback I've owned too. So it's at least not a total fail in any of the weak areas.

And my prediction that all T-fin flat cell battery designs will degrade faster than anything else may not hold true for all implementations. Maybe some will do OK. IDK.

 

[_Redshift_]

I agree completely. But the 2 things that are table stakes, that no one else has really proved at all yet, are batteries and charging networks.

So sure, they are open to being disrupted by high quality interior, exterior, service (not really, ICE service in universally horrid, but sure), and all the rest. But if the batteries all have to be recalled and the charging network is a catastrophe, have fun with that nice interior.

And honestly? Coming from Subaru, I don't think the build quality of our Y is that bad. I actually can't really fault anything. Handles snow better than any Outback I've owned too. So it's at least not a total fail in any of the weak areas.

And my prediction that all T-fin flat cell battery designs will degrade faster than anything else may not hold true for all implementations. Maybe some will do OK. IDK.

From a Subaru, it might seem like an upgrade. However, your Y is not a cheap vehicle. It needs to have interior content to match the price. Straight line acceleration is not the be all and end all.

For the longest time, I’ve wondered what the right scroll wheel and button do most of the time. They come along for the ride! In my S, all buttons are utilized correctly. In my 3, the right buttons only get used when using cruise or AP. Rest of the time, they could do the multi-function thing they do on my S, but no.

Which genius was in charge of that poor design choice?

That’s just the start. The wipers on the 3 are terrible, based only on cameras. On my S, they have never given me any issues, and are based on a sensor. Cost cutting has a price. Tesla just thinks they are too cool to address those issues.

these basic issues should never exist in a sub 70K car. Let alone in a 20k car.

 

[WhiteWi]

From a Subaru, it might seem like an upgrade. However, your Y is not a cheap vehicle. It needs to have interior content to match the price. Straight line acceleration is not the be all and end all.

For the longest time, I’ve wondered what the right scroll wheel and button do most of the time. They come along for the ride! In my S, all buttons are utilized correctly. In my 3, the right buttons only get used when using cruise or AP. Rest of the time, they could do the multi-function thing they do on my S, but no.

Which genius was in charge of that poor design choice?

That’s just the start. The wipers on the 3 are terrible, based only on cameras. On my S, they have never given me any issues, and are based on a sensor. Cost cutting has a price. Tesla just thinks they are too cool to address those issues.

these basic issues should never exist in a sub 70K car. Let alone in a 20k car.

Your personal opinion, I have no problems with any of that. Same thing about interior quality.

 

[chinney]

[...]

These are things Tesla doesn’t, and for the most part, has never done well:

Interior quality
NVH control
Exterior quality
Service (this one though was excellent till 2017)
Ride and handling compromise (last good one was the coil over spring suspension Model S, a very rare bird indeed)
Ergonomics of the UI (better on the S, terrible on the 3)

[...]

My own experience with my 2020 Model 3 LR on all of these points, with a partial exception of the UI ergonomics, is quite different from what you say. Interior and exterior quality on my own vehicle has been flawless. NVH is excellent. My - albeit limited - Tesla service experiences (flat tire due to debris on the highway - cracked windscreen due to rock thrown up by a truck) have been very quick and excellent. Ride and handling is the best I have experienced on any vehicle I have driven. The UI is ok - not bad, but could be improved on some points. I do agree, however, with your point in a separate post noting that the Model 3 wiper controls are pretty bad - that is partially a UI issue and partially the mistake Tesla made with using optical sensors only.

 

[bmah]

Moderator note:

Several posts about trailers with batteries acting as range extenders moved to this new thread:

EV range extender trailers

As I said above it comes down to range when towing, as battery technology improves so will range and that is necessary for long range towing. Maybe make trailers with built in battery packs that can be tapped in by the car when towing! Just an idea.

teslamotorsclub.com

Bruce.

 

[ecarfan]

Keep in mind that most service will be done in your driveway

That is unlikely. I think saying “some“ service will be done at your house is more accurate, as many repairs require a life. And many people do not have driveways, they live in apartments, so finding a place where a Rivian tech could work on your vehicle could be difficult. Many apartment buildings or condo high rises do not allow car repairs to be performed on the property.

and Rivian already has service centers all over the US and will be expanding in the future.

On the Rivian website no service centers are shown. Of course they company has big plans for service centers and has listed job openings at many locations across the US. But it will take years to build them all. Tesla went through the same process a decade ago. It’s not easy to find qualified people.

 

[Merrill]

That is unlikely. I think saying “some“ service will be done at your house is more accurate, as many repairs require a life. And many people do not have driveways, they live in apartments, so finding a place where a Rivian tech could work on your vehicle could be difficult. Many apartment buildings or condo high rises do not allow car repairs to be performed on the property.

On the Rivian website no service centers are shown. Of course they company has big plans for service centers and has listed job openings at many locations across the US. But it will take years to build them all. Tesla went through the same process a decade ago. It’s not easy to find qualified people.

Rivian will be doing what Tesla currently does with mobile service, if you go on the internet you will see that Rivian has some service centers throughout the US and more will be coming.

 

[tm1v2]

That is unlikely. I think saying “some“ service will be done at your house is more accurate, as many repairs require a life. And many people do not have driveways, they live in apartments, so finding a place where a Rivian tech could work on your vehicle could be difficult. Many apartment buildings or condo high rises do not allow car repairs to be performed on the property.

On the Rivian website no service centers are shown. Of course they company has big plans for service centers and has listed job openings at many locations across the US. But it will take years to build them all. Tesla went through the same process a decade ago. It’s not easy to find qualified people.

I believe Rivian is actually making progress on their service center rollout. I've already come across a car-related business that's moving right about now from where they've been for decades because Rivian is buying the building. I was told Rivian will have sales and service there together if I recall correctly.

Btw the Rivian front end looks much better in person to me. It does look cartoonish and silly in photos. In person the nice detailing is more apparent, especially the headlights, and I like that the design is not part of the giant truck grill competition. For anyone who likes that though, I'm sure Ford, GM, and Ram EV pickups will have you covered.

 

[ecarfan]

Rivian will be doing what Tesla currently does with mobile service, if you go on the internet you will see that Rivian has some service centers throughout the US and more will be coming.

I went “on the internet” and I could not find a single Rivian service center that is currently open. If you can, please provide a link.

Of course Rivian has big plans for many service centers in the US. They aren’t operational yet. My point is that takes time to build out, it can’t happen in a few weeks or months. Tesla went through the same process a decade ago.

Right now Rivian’s production rate is very low and early adopters are typically more tolerant of issues with getting service. Rivian will try to perform as many service calls as possible using the mobile techs (just like Tesla) but if a repair requires a lift that is going to be a problem for most new customers.

Rivian is copying the sales and service model that Tesla pioneered; internet sales directly to the consumer, no dealerships, OTA updates, creating their own high speed charging network, mobile service when possible. It’s the smart approach. The difficulties lie in going from producing a few cars a day to hundreds, creating hundreds of service centers and building hundreds/thousands of chargers.

Rivian has an advantage in that it can raise capital more easily than Tesla could over a decade ago when almost everyone was of the opinion that EVs had no future and Tesla would fail. Tesla proved them wrong and Rivian does not have to overcome those obstacles. I want Rivian to succeed!

 

[Merrill]

I went “on the internet” and I could not find a single Rivian service center that is currently open. If you can, please provide a link.

Of course Rivian has big plans for many service centers in the US. They aren’t operational yet. My point is that takes time to build out, it can’t happen in a few weeks or months. Tesla went through the same process a decade ago.

Right now Rivian’s production rate is very low and early adopters are typically more tolerant of issues with getting service. Rivian will try to perform as many service calls as possible using the mobile techs (just like Tesla) but if a repair requires a lift that is going to be a problem for most new customers.

Rivian is copying the sales and service model that Tesla pioneered; internet sales directly to the consumer, no dealerships, OTA updates, creating their own high speed charging network, mobile service when possible. It’s the smart approach. The difficulties lie in going from producing a few cars a day to hundreds, creating hundreds of service centers and building hundreds/thousands of chargers.

Rivian has an advantage in that it can raise capital more easily than Tesla could over a decade ago when almost everyone was of the opinion that EVs had no future and Tesla would fail. Tesla proved them wrong and Rivian does not have to overcome those obstacles. I want Rivian to succeed!

Just google Rivian service centers now open.

 

[Krispykreme]

This tracks, sort of. They have a responsibility to put out reasonable PR based on their honest assessments of development schedules.

I know a few engineers who have migrated from Tesla and other places to Rivian, and they report it's the real thing, they're doing it right, so I'm hesitant to lump them in with Lucid and Fiskar.

And I know first hand the supply bottlenecks are a real bottleneck right now. Our big flagship development project is delayed by 14 months from original timelines, 100% supply chain related. This is the worst time to launch a new product.

I personally think Lucid is far more solid than rivian.

Have it occurred to you why Rivian Mpge is in such a low range?

Why would Ford walk away? It’s not like Ford is front running in EV tech and self driving platform.

Morgan Stanley underwritten the Rivian IPO so it’s going out of its way to pump up rivian.

It’s 2022- why would a vehicle with 400V based architecture would be the future?

Even the Korean is already on 800V on EV6

It’s not that hard to see.

 

[WhiteWi]

Lucid is huge scam.

 

[Krispykreme]

Lucid actually delivered car to paying customers, whether you like it or not.

800v architecture is also one of the leading edge one. The fact EPA rating verified the efficiency is already more proof then any of the startup out there.

Scam? Not when they have actual proof. Problem- every new entrant will have their share of problem.

But platform performance don’t lie.

 

[WhiteWi]

Okey.

 

[dipper]

It's a scam because it is not Tesla. That is how it always ends in talking about a competitor. You should know that by now.